Coronavirus Information...who do you trust?

[Belsnickel]

So, I had my twice-a-year visit with my doctor, this morning, because of my diabetes and what not. The nurse doing the weight, BP, and all that was talking about the COVID mess. She told me she wasn't going to get vaccinated. She mentioned another nurse that got the vaccine and a week later tested positive for COVID. She said "what do they expect when you're putting the virus inside you?"

I didn't try to argue with her because I knew that wasn't a great idea, especially since she was going to be giving be a TDAP vaccine and a pneumonia vaccine, but this is where I get so concerned about the misinformation that is out there. As we've discussed in this thread, the COVID vaccines are not the typical dead/weakened virus types we are used to. They train the cells on what to look for, they don't introduce the virus to the immune system. And of course it is possible for someone that is immunized to be infected. One, the immunizations are not 100% effective, and two, both the Moderna and Pfizer vaccines require a second injection a couple of weeks after the initial one to reach the efficacy determined in the studies.

Anyway, just had to vent a little about that. On the pneumonia vaccine: it has been approved for people with T2 diabetes under 65. It is a good idea that if you fall into a group approved for the vaccine to go ahead and get it. It won't prevent the pneumonia caused by SARS-CoV2, but it will prevent the bacterial pneumonias from taking advantage of the situation and settling in to complicate matters. Also, there is a study that came out in November about the effects of the MMR vaccine on COVID patients. https://mbio.asm.org/content/11/6/e02628-20

The tl;dr version is that the more antibodies in you from the MMR vaccine, the lower likelihood of a severe case of a COVID infection. This isn't a causal finding and there is more research that could be needed to confirm these findings. However, on average a person's antibodies level for MMR drops below the threshold about 14 years after immunization. It isn't a terrible idea to get a booster just for the sake of MMR, but if it can reduce your chance of a serious infection then it's an added bonus. I will be getting a booster in a couple weeks once my immune system calms down from today.

Quote:ABSTRACT
The measles-mumps-rubella (MMR) vaccine has been theorized to provide protection against coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19). Our aim was to determine whether any MMR IgG titers are inversely correlated with severity in recovered COVID-19 patients previously vaccinated with MMR II. We divided 80 subjects into two groups, comparing MMR titers to recent COVID-19 severity levels. The MMR II group consisted of 50 subjects who would primarily have MMR antibodies from the MMR II vaccine, and a comparison group of 30 subjects consisted of those who would primarily have MMR antibodies from sources other than MMR II, including prior measles, mumps, and/or rubella illnesses. There was a significant inverse correlation (rs = −0.71, P < 0.001) between mumps virus titers (mumps titers) and COVID-19 severity within the MMR II group. There were no significant correlations between mumps titers and severity in the comparison group, between mumps titers and age in the MMR II group, or between severity and measles or rubella titers in either group. Within the MMR II group, mumps titers of 134 to 300 arbitrary units (AU)/ml (n = 8) were found only in those who were functionally immune or asymptomatic; all with mild symptoms had mumps titers below 134 AU/ml (n = 17); all with moderate symptoms had mumps titers below 75 AU/ml (n = 11); all who had been hospitalized and had required oxygen had mumps titers below 32 AU/ml (n = 5). Our results demonstrate that there is a significant inverse correlation between mumps titers from MMR II and COVID-19 severity.

IMPORTANCE
COVID-19 has presented various paradoxes that, if understood better, may provide clues to controlling the pandemic, even before a COVID-19 vaccine is widely available. First, young children are largely spared from severe disease. Second, numerous countries have COVID-19 death rates that are as low as 1% of the death rates of other countries. Third, many people, despite prolonged close contact with someone who is COVID-19 positive, never test positive themselves. Fourth, nearly half of people who test positive for COVID-19 are asymptomatic. Some researchers have theorized that the measles-mumps-rubella (MMR) vaccine may be responsible for these disparities. The significance of our study is that it showed that mumps titers related to the MMR II vaccine are significantly and inversely correlated with the severity of COVID-19-related symptoms, supporting the theorized association between the MMR vaccine and COVID-19 severity.

[Au165]

(01-05-2021, 11:28 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: She mentioned another nurse that got the vaccine and a week later tested positive for COVID. 

This is going to be a major issue because the vaccine takes weeks to become effective at preventing the virus. People who get it then act like they are instantly immune will become super spreaders through their ignorance. 

[Belsnickel]

(01-05-2021, 11:44 AM)Au165 Wrote: This is going to be a major issue because the vaccine takes weeks to become effective at preventing the virus. People who get it then act like they are instantly immune will become super spreaders through their ignorance. 

Well, the problem is that with healthcare workers they would have gotten it with or without the vaccine. It's just the nature of things for them. Now, the general public, I agree.

[*Nately120*]

My mother in law told my wife that she won't be getting the vaccine because it has aborted fetus in it.

[Au165]

Seems relevant... 

  https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2021/01/05/wisconsin-pharmacist-confessed-trying-destroy-vaccines-da-says/4140364001/

Quote:Pharmacist who tried to spoil 500 vaccine doses is 'admitted conspiracy theorist,' police say

PORT WASHINGTON, Wis. – The pharmacist suspected of intentionally spoiling 500 doses of COVID-19 vaccine at a Wisconsin hospital because he believed they were unsafe was released from jail Monday, after a prosecutor indicated he's not positive the vaccine was actually destroyed.


Steven R. Brandenburg, 46, of Grafton, had concerns the vaccines could change people's DNA, an unfounded claim that has been debunked. His estranged wife said in a divorce record that in early December, he brought her a water purifier and 30-day food supply because the world was "crashing down" due to government cyberattacks and power grid shutdowns.

Last week, she said she no longer felt safe around him, and a court commissioner temporarily ordered the couple's children not stay with Brandenburg.

Brandenburg was arrested last week and had been ordered held on a probable cause statement from Grafton police that he likely committed two felonies – first-degree recklessly endangering safety, and criminal damage to property.


Misinformation around the COVID-19 vaccines has surged online with false claims circulating on everything from the vaccines’ ingredients to its possible side effects.

One of the earliest false claims suggested that the vaccines could alter DNA. Experts have said there is no truth to the claims that the vaccines can genetically modify humans.

He appeared via Zoom from the Ozaukee County Jail for an initial court appearance Monday afternoon, as did his attorney, Jason Baltz of Mequon. Baltz said later that neither he nor his client wanted to comment to news media.
But Ozaukee County District Attorney Adam Gerol told Circuit Judge Paul Malloy that the hospital had "walked back" some of the information on which police had relied, that the vials in question have not since been destroyed, but are still in the hospital's possession and might even still be viable.

He said he's working with Moderna to possibly test that evidence. If the vaccine is still good, Gerol said, the most he could charge Brandenburg with would be attempted criminal damage to property, a misdemeanor.  There is no crime of attempting to recklessly endanger someone.
Gerol said he is working with the U.S. Attorney's Office as well which could try to charge Brandenburg with a federal crime. A spokesman with that office said Monday federal prosecutors had no comment.
Malloy ordered Brandenburg to turn over any weapons, not work in healthcare or distribute medication of any kind, or have any contact with Aurora Health Center while free on the signature bond.

Gerol said Brandenburg, whom a Grafton police detective described as "an admitted conspiracy theorist," had made a "full confession" to Grafton police that he intentionally tried to ruin the vaccines because he didn't believe they were safe. He told a detective he was concerned the vaccine could alter the DNA of people who took it.

The Moderna vaccines are messenger RNA vaccines. Instead of introducing a weakened version of the virus so the body will try to build defenses, the mRNA delivers instructions for our cells to make a piece of protein like that found on COVID-19, and the body then begins building immunities against that and the coronavirus.
The COVID-19 vaccines are the first to use the mRNA process, though scientists have been studying it for decades and experts have endorsed the new vaccines as safe. They have no impact on someone's DNA.

FDA officials, asked to respond to Brandenburg's actions, referred to its statement Dec. 18, the day Moderna's vaccine received emergency use authorization.

“Guided by science and data, the agency’s career staff determined that the vaccine’s known and potential benefits clearly outweigh its known and potential risks...,” said Peter Marks, M.D., Ph.D., Director of the FDA’s Center for Biologics Evaluation and Research.

“Today’s authorization demonstrates our steadfast commitment to the health of the American people, with the assurance that our scientific standards and the integrity of our review process have been maintained."


Gerol, the prosecutor, said some of the pharmacists' coworkers told investigators they believed he had brought guns to work at least two times, though Gerol was unsure when those instances occurred.
Brandenburg was arrested early Dec. 31, the day after Aurora Health Care Medical Group officials said his failure to refrigerate the vials of Moderna vaccine a week earlier – first reported to have been a mistake or oversight – was in fact intentional. The hospital said it fired Brandenburg.

[GMDino]

(01-05-2021, 11:56 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: Well, the problem is that with healthcare workers they would have gotten it with or without the vaccine. It's just the nature of things for them. Now, the general public, I agree.

A friend told me today that all of his kids and he and his wife got all of their vaccinations growing up.  His son served in Iraq and had a bad reaction to a vaccine.  Naturally the Obama administration never helped get him any care but just one letter to the Trump administration (and the declassifying about the vaccine) and his son is in a better place, less depressed and without the suicidal thoughts.  So my friend will wait to get the Covid Vaccine because he knew someone who had a bad reaction to another vaccine.

And that's where we are.  One person had a reaction so *I* won't take it...coming from the same people who said they weren't afraid of getting Covid because they didn't know anyone who had it or they did and they recovered fine.

What a country.

[Yojimbo]

Some pretty bad vaccine news here in OR.

https://www.opb.org/article/2021/01/15/oregon-covid-19-vaccine-governor-brown-trump-administration/

“Last night, I received disturbing news, confirmed to me directly by General Perna of Operation Warp Speed: States will not be receiving increased shipments of vaccines from the national stockpile next week, because there is no federal reserve of doses,” Brown said on Twitter.

[BmorePat87]

Charles Barkley suggested today that professional athletes should be given some preferential treatment with vaccines because of how much money they pay in taxes.

Beyond the fact that it's troubling to suggest that how much money you have should determine your worth to the government, athletes are primarily healthy individuals in their 20's and 30's, and do not have to interact with the public as part of their profession. This is just a bad idea and a tough look for him.

[BigPapaKain]

(01-15-2021, 05:30 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: Charles Barkley suggested today that professional athletes should be given some preferential treatment with vaccines because of how much money they pay in taxes.

Beyond the fact that it's troubling to suggest that how much money you have should determine your worth to the government, athletes are primarily healthy individuals in their 20's and 30's, and do not have to interact with the public as part of their profession. This is just a bad idea and a tough look for him.

That's why smart people don't listen to celebrities when it comes to things like science and politics (Unless that celebrity is Neil deGrasse Tyson talking astrophysics).

[Yojimbo]

(01-15-2021, 05:40 PM)BigPapaKain Wrote: That's why smart people don't listen to celebrities when it comes to things like science and politics (Unless that celebrity is Neil deGrasse Tyson talking astrophysics).

NDT would tell you to be skeptical even of him and do your own research and investigating.

[BigPapaKain]

(01-15-2021, 05:45 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: NDT would tell you to be skeptical even of him and do your own research and investigating.

I'd be skeptical of someone telling me to be skeptical of what they tell me.

[BmorePat87]

according to sources in the new Biden administration, there was no vaccine distribution plan left behind...

[Belsnickel]

(01-21-2021, 10:55 AM)BmorePat87 Wrote: according to sources in the new Biden administration, there was no vaccine distribution plan left behind...

As we learn more about how much the Trump administration hamstringed Biden's, I find myself even more pissed off.

[Forever Spinning Vinyl]

(01-21-2021, 11:07 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: As we learn more about how much the Trump administration hamstringed Biden's, I find myself even more pissed off.

And there will still be fools defending that illiterate dunce no matter how screwed up he left the country and embarrassed us on the world stage.

[*Nately120*]

(01-21-2021, 06:40 PM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: And there will still be fools defending that illiterate dunce no matter how screwed up he left the country and embarrassed us on the world stage.

At least we can think back to those halcyon days where we could be overtly racist and 4 people out of 10 were cool with it.

[GMDino]

Fauci seems to feel better than he can talk freely without Trump.

Maybe we can see actual progress made now.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9173927/Fauci-unloads-Trump-saying-didnt-feel-talk-wouldnt-repercussions.html

Quote:'It's a liberating feeling to let the science speak!' Dr. Fauci unloads on Trump saying 'things were said that weren't based on science,' and 'you didn't feel you could say something and there wouldn't be repercussions'

• Dr. Anthony Fauci made it clear he's happy to be working for President Joe Biden
  
• In his first appearance in White House briefing room in months, Fauci took a few pot shots at what it was like operating under Donald Trump
  
• 'One of the new things in this administration is: if you don't know the answer, don't guess. Just say you don't know the answer,' he said 
  
• Fauci noted the strain he felt talking about COVID while working under Trump
  
• 'You didn't feel like you could say something and there wouldn't be repercussions,' he said
  
• Fauci made his first public appearance at President Biden's side Thursday 
  
• Of the new administration's stance toward him, Fauci said: 'It is somewhat of a liberating feeling' 
  

Full story at the link.

[masonbengals fan]

So there was no plan but the new plan aims to vaccinate the same number of people monthly as the old plan.

And if Trump was responsible for 400,000 dead last year did Biden's tally start this week?

[Belsnickel]

(01-22-2021, 11:32 AM)masonbengals fan Wrote: So there was no plan but the new plan aims to vaccinate the same number of people monthly as the old plan.

And if Trump was responsible for 400,000 dead last year did Biden's tally start this week?

Setting a number isn't the same as making a plan. And fixing the mess that was left behind will take some time. Trying to immediately lay things at Biden's feet like that is stupid. There is a reason it's become a meme about right-wing media doing it.

[masonbengals fan]

So when does Biden's responsibility begin ? Will we know that timeline beforehand or wait until the numbers start to improve for a better look. Biden, his party & his people weaponized the virus so don't be shocked when there is pushback.

[Belsnickel]

(01-22-2021, 11:50 AM)masonbengals fan Wrote: So when does Biden's responsibility begin ? Will we know that timeline beforehand or wait until the numbers start to improve for a better look. Biden, his party & his people weaponized the virus so don't be shocked when there is pushback.

What do you mean by "weaponized the virus?" Do you mean pointing out how terrible the administration was at handling the pandemic?