Continued Trump Administration Fallout

[hollodero]

(05-05-2021, 09:49 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: A friend of my sister's grandfather was in the Waffen SS.  Sincerely nice guy, and he was a conscripted member, not a volunteer (I also get that age tends to mellow a person quite a bit).

The Austrian experience. Nice old former Nazi guys that don't seem all that evil. My world was full of them, it was quite confusing.

(05-05-2021, 09:49 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: There's definitely some truth to this.  I don't agree with the degree of Trump's influence going forward, but your position does appear to be the more correct at this point in time.

We'll see, maybe his influence diminshes still, with him being somewhat less present in the media and banned from social media. I think his heritage remains, and I am fairly convinced the Capitol storm was not his predicted downfall, but hey I so hope you end up being right.

(05-05-2021, 09:49 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I'd probably have more respect for it if she didn't have innumerable fall back positions.  It's easy to tale a stand, even if it's late in the game, when you have the family connections and wealth she has.

Sure, it also is easy for Romney after being so rich and beloved in his state for some reason. I wouldn't hold that against her as much as the fact that she did not stand up before and imho only stood up now out of expediency rather than genuine conviction.

(05-05-2021, 09:49 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I'd honestly have to give it some thought.  For me Trump was, especially before the "Big Lie" way more bluster than substance.  I've made the point here several times that George W. was a far more destructive and dangerous POTUS than Trump.  I suppose whether he, Trump, appears on the list depends on how much you think his actions have endangered the US system.

That seems to be the issue, yeah. I do think he was quite dangerous, in what he created, groomed and left behind (sure more through rhetorics than deed), which is a fanatic, hateful, anti-democratic base that stepped out of the fringe and now dictates the republican party. He laid the groundwork for dangers to come. I get your dislike for inept comparisons, but that is not comparing Trump to the more vile characters of history, it's comparing him to the people that prepared the climate for said creatures; that created an atmosphere, defined an electorate etc. Democracies don't fall in a day, and maybe not in a generation.
Or the spook just ends and Trump turns into a bizarre footnote in history. Sure hope it does.

I sure felt like writing a 10.000 page essay on how awful Donald Trump is, but I can see your point. Trump did not start a war, he did not cause mass casualties (one could argue his lieing about Corona can be tied to additional death, but that's a matter of interpretation) and that is indeed the one genuinely good thing I have to say about him. It's a big one, keeping your take on Cheney in mind. Which I agree with, of course, the Halliburton war can clearly be seen as a whole other level of evil and dangerous.

(05-05-2021, 09:49 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Nixon?  Not even close.  He was underhanded, and certainly not adverse to skullduggery, but he was a brilliant man and a superb POTUS from the foreign policy aspect of the position.  Also, consider what a shitshow he inherited from Kennedy/LBJ.  While he certainly deserves much of the criticism he gets, he's not even close to top three IMO.

Well he was a crook, abused his power and from what I seem to remember, his tapes revealed he was quite the racist. I also seem to remember he played a vital part in porolonging the Vietnam war because he thought it would help him politically, but I could misremember the specifics. In my youth he always was the poster boy for the vile US president, but sure we're oversimplifying it. I can see what you mean.

(05-05-2021, 09:49 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I'd put George Wallace in the top three.  He was so dedicated to racism and segregation that he basically made it a foundation of his "party platform".

Fair, he held high office. In my mind I somehow restricted it to POTUS or VP.
Also fair, he was an awful human just until the end. Not that it redeems him, but the one thing I found out through the internet was that he seemed genuinely remorseful in his later days and had his share of apologies to the black community. And that he had an extraordinary amount of black people in his last Alabama government. Again, not that this means redemption.

Evilness is hard to compare it seems. Andrew Jackson ended so many native lives. Truman dropped two atomic bombs that by all indications didn't need dropping. Kissinger imho is an honorable mention, and then some. A list of three just is too narrow.