Government Shutdown

[Dill]

(09-21-2023, 12:16 PM)LSUfaninTN Wrote: A) What principle? Are you looking at us defending one of the most corrupt countries on earth as a humanitarian measure? Outside of agricultural imports and the occasional successful startup tech company, Ukraine is a corrupt country that contributes very little to the world. 

B) Geopolitical space: I don’t know your stance on energy. But the current administration is shooting itself in the foot by reducing dependence on fossil fuels. Ceding Ukraine won’t have near the impact, the only thing the Ukraine war does for this is provide a very expensive excuse to put sanctions on Russia to make it more difficult for them to export oil. Less energy independence weakens us geopolitically as we will have less and less influence on global oil markets and reduced ability to defend our allies if we were to depend more than we should on foreign oil imports. We’re still a net exporter but not like we used to be. It’s really not that complicated. Oil. It’s not going anywhere. Unless we switch to nuclear, which we won’t, dependence on oil will outlive every member of this board. We have it. We must use it. The US and Russia are in constant competition over production, exports and market share. We’re throwing Russia a very large bone in the geopolitical space by choosing not to dominate them. 

C) Ceding Ukraine to Russia is different from ceding a NATO ally to Russia. Ceding Ukraine is different from ceding the Pacific to Japan and ignoring an attack on US soil. It’s not our war. We do not have the military might that we used to have. We do not have the money that we used to have. We can’t just put Russia and China in their places anymore. They’ve become too powerful. 

Excellent, substantive response. Hits all the crucial questions/issues. Regarding A:

For starters, the invasion is a violation of the UN Charter 2(4) which upholds the integrity of sovereign states and advances their security against armed aggression. Think of this in local community rather than international terms. If some gang invades a family's house and robs and kills some members to take possession of it, should the police ignore that if the family has a reputation for "corruption" and/or doesn't contribute much to the community? If you think not, then you are standing on several principles, among them equality before the law, and the notion that selective enforcement weakens the legitimacy and effectiveness of law overall. That's true of the international community as well.

Ukraine's agricultural imports are vital to a number of developing countries, especially in the Middle East, Africa, and Indonesia. They are vital to global food security, and so to political stability, and so to the free flow of trade through, near, and around these regions. They are also one of the primary contributors to UN relief. Impending famine in the Sahel and South Sudan when the flow of Ukrainian grain is disrupted. It's not just about oil.
https://docs.wfp.org/api/documents/WFP-0000137463/download/?_ga=2.58383210.1137841221.1695311452-324417549.1695311450

As far as corruption--the biggest driver of that corruption is their connection to Russia. That's why they ousted Yanukovych, and why Russia then seized the Crimea and Eastern Ukraine. The US should be supporting that effort, tied as it is to democracy, not abandoning it.