Democrats losing all credibility in denial of overwhelming evidence..

[Dill]

(04-01-2024, 08:35 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Literally could not have made a better post to illustrate that you really don't actually read what the people you disagree with actually write.

Literally could not have made a better example of how you substitute claims for demonstration--and cannot refute demonstration.

(04-01-2024, 08:35 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: but SSF can call you an antisemite and makes claims about you without a single link to anything to prove what he says.  He calls you a terrorist sympathizer because you don't fall in lock step with what he believes (black and white).

Either put up of shut up.  Just casting aspersions because you disagree is what leads this entire forum in the wrong direction.  

I've literally done exactly that, numerous times.  I will reiterate because apparently you can't be bothered to read.  Among other things, which I have pointed out, Dill said, straight out, that he does not believe Israel has a right to exist in any form it has since its reformation after WW2.  I'll repeat, he does not think Israel should be able to exist.  That's the person you're defending here from "unfounded" judgments.  Put up enough for you?

You've done "exactly that" never. Not once.  Your claim is that I "support Hamas" and "mitigate" and "excuse" them, and that I am a "pro-Islamist" antisemite.

So "putting up" would mean showing where I said "I back Hamas in Palestinian elections," or said "Attacking that music festival was not so bad," or "Let's not be too hard on Hamas; after all, life in Gaza is not easy."  That would unambiguously count as proof.  But your charges on the super thread only follow my references to IDF war crimes, not statements about Hamas, which sound more like "Hamas is the Palestinian Right, an obstacle to peace like the Israel right."

So as I've been saying, your charge that I "support Hamas" on the Superthread always everywhere follows my reference to violations of international law.
You are simply saying that criticism of IDF war crimes and the occupation = support for Hamas; the only alternative to not "supporting Hamas"? Don't criticize the IDF. Black/white.

And I have never said anything anti-Jewish, or disparaging about Jews as a people or religion. Proof that I'm anti-semitic would be a statement like "Jews can't be trusted" or "Jews control US banking."  Can you find such?  I think not.  Again, the anti-semitism charge just follows acknowledgement of human rights violations, not anything said about Jews as a people.

Dino is quite correct: you've labeled me an "antisemitic Hamas supporter" numerous times, but proven it not once. Because you cannot. You know that.
The intention is to provoke and incite, to manage forum conflict with labels, without the burden of evidence-based argument. 

So far, the only thing specific that you have "put up"--your one hope--is your claim I do not think Israel "should be able to exist." Horrors!  My actual words: "Israel has a right to exist as part of a two-state or one-state solution to the Palestinian problem. It doesn't have right to exist as an ethnic state which occupies territory gained in war with intent to cleanse and annex.   

But this is not evidence of antisemitism or "support for Hamas." It is an affirmation that universal human rights extend to Palestinians, and those depriving them of those rights have an obligation to rectify that violation. It doesn't mean Israeli citizens (or Jews) should not exist. It is an endorsement of a mutual recognition and peace agreement signed by Shamir and Arafat, which Netanyahu and the Israeli right has blocked.  This is not a question of whether Israel meets the criteria for a sovereign state in today's international system.  As far as international law goes, no state has a legal "right to exist." The argument is about how to recognize and protect the rights of everyone now under control of the current Israeli state--protect them equally.  

There is a conversation here you do not want to have, about Palestinian rights, about the legitimacy of any ethnic state, about military occupation, and the annexation of territory seized by violence.