Israel/Hamas War Superthread

[Belsnickel]

(05-23-2024, 11:46 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: As you admit, this is very much a chicken or the egg argument.  One thing that cannot be denied is that, whatever the reason and impetus, the people of Gaza elected a terrorist organization to lead them.  One with explicitly expressed genocidal intent.  Without the wall how many more thousands of Israeli citizens would be raped, kidnapped and murdered?

Well, I said we could have the debate to no end. I personally think it is obvious where it started but you would disagree. As for the election, it has been pointed out many times that the vast majority of Gazans there today did not vote for Hamas. Hamas has been in power nearly 20 years, before the majority of Gazans living there today were able to vote, even if they were alive.

(05-23-2024, 11:46 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: We both agree there is no obvious good guy here in terms of who did what to who first.  At the end of the day we have to deal with the situation as it exists, right now.  That being the case there is clearly a side to support and clearly a side to condemn.  It certainly doesn't give Israel a blank check to act as they please, but turning a blind eye to the deliberate actions of Hamas in terms of civilian casualties is to hand them a huge win.  The ICC absolutely blew it here by treating them as equal actors, once again the West handing Hamas a huge propaganda victory.  

The ICC did not treat them as equal actors. That is the narrative coming from some sides, but when you look at the charges in the application and the explanations it is clear that they didn't treat them as equal. I heard some of the conference on the application for the charges and I think it was approached in the way it should be. Looking only at the actions and not at those perpetrating them; looking at it through an objective lens.

(05-23-2024, 06:30 PM)Dill Wrote: 2. Another reason for NOT bringing refugees into Egypt (I believe you already know this) is because Palestinians fear that 
having already driven them from homes in other parts of the Mandate, Israel will take Gaza too. Now many may so fear
for their lives they would take the risk. Not unreasonable to suppose Netanyahu would take that gift if it fell into his lap.

Yeah, that was something I considered adding in there as well. For many of them, especially those that were around to hear of the Nakba directly from those who experienced it (or were even there themselves), there is going to be the sense that leaving Gaza is giving up on their homes and it isn't something they will be very inclined to do.