Trump attacks protections for immigrants from ‘s***hole’ countries

[Dill]

(01-29-2018, 05:47 PM)Sociopathics teelerfan Wrote: Are you saying that in no other ancient civilization were the subjugated peoples of varies region treated as lesser citizens than that of the conquering empire?  That would also be very hard for me to believe, probably because it isn't true.

 
What I wrote was NOT that "no other ancient civilization treated subjugated peoples as lesser citizens."

What I wrote was, "It was the Romans who detached the concept of citizenship and political rights from ethnic attributes such as language, culture, or skin color."  Which they did. That is why a Jew, like Paul, could be a Roman citizen, as could a white Briton or a black Libyan, in contrast to the Athenians for example, who gave citizenship only to those born of two parents already citizens of their polis.

If you can think of another "ancient civilization" that did what the Romans did, then I would appreciate hearing about it.

"Citizen" is also a Western concept. As far as Aristotle is concerned, the Persian empire does not have citizens, only subjugated peoples, slaves to the king.  A citizen participates in government, in "politics," i.e., in the making of policy, with other citizens on a platform of substantive equality.

You seem to be conflating generic discriminatory behaviors with culturally and historically specific categories and concepts. So if someone says ancient Chinese who discriminated against Koreans were not using a European concept of race or even ethnicity, you appear to be hearing someone say Ancient Chinese did not discriminate against Koreans.

If, after you yourself deploy Western concepts of race and ethnicity, and someone points out these concepts were developed within European social science, then you think someone has "changed the rules of the game" because in some previous time one non-western ethnic group may have used skin color as marker of discrimination against another so "racism" was not restricted to Westerners.