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Violence at Israeli-Gazan Border
(05-18-2018, 09:12 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I think one of the things that frustrates me in discussions around Gaza and Hamas is when people don't really understand the authoritarian ways of Hamas. Since they have taken power, they haven't allowed for elections to take place. They shot a young man in the kneecaps in the center of town for making an anti-Hamas post on social media. They terrorize the people of Gaza as much or more than they do Israel based on what I am given to understand from people who have spent time there.

It is one of the things that many don't seem to understand. The Palestinians in Gaza are essentially caged in with one dangerous group and on the other side is another dangerous group. They are in a rock and hard place scenario and the world has all but abandoned them.

I am in whole-hearted agreement with your last point. Without disagreeing with your first point, however, I'd like to tweak it a bit.


I haven't noticed any dearth of reporting on the authoritarianism of Hamas
. Some may be reluctant to criticize them in the usual contextless, ahistorical fashion because 1) it's doubtful there would be a Hamas, or that it would have its present form, were it not for the special isolation/imprisonment of Gaza under the occupation, and 2) the picture of Evil Hamas using human shields and paying martyrs and the like supports an Israeli narrative that the effect is really the cause of Gazan imprisonment. 

One could make an analogy to Hezbollah here.
As I think you know, before the Israeli invasion in 1982, the Shia of Southern Lebanon were largely represented by Amal, which means "hope" in Arabic. And the organization itself was secular and liberal-tolerant. The founders of Hezbollah constituted a minor sect with few followers. The Israeli invasion massively disrupted security in Lebanon, in the period which followed, Hezbollah formed a religiously themed resistance which proved more effective, and rapidly drew followers from Amal. They became in effect a state within a state, supplying food, medical services and schooling to Lebanese Shia.  Constantly under siege, they have become somewhat totalitarian, a "martyr worship" state. And very effective in their resistance to Israel. But no Israeli invasion in 1982 and there is no Iran-Assad allied Hezbollah in 2018. Hamas offers a Sunni version of this process, but one which has developed under much more severe constraints.  I can make similar analogies to ethnic-religious groups like Yemeni Houthi and Pashtu Taliban, which evolved under conditions of extreme insecurity.

So I am always ready to acknowledge the excesses of Hamas, but not to discuss them as if they proceeded from some essential nature of Palestinians or Islam
. People living in Gaza really are like inmates in US prisons, forced to join one gang or another for protection or survival. Imagine whole families--including children--condemned to life in prison. And the sentence looks to extend to generations as yet unborn. There is a mass pathology there, for sure, but "bad leaders" are not the root cause.  It is not in the interest of Israel to stop that pathology, but to intensify it and insure press coverage. That's what we need to understand, if we want the peace process to work.
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RE: Violence at Israeli-Gazan Border - Dill - 05-18-2018, 10:15 PM

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