Thoughts after a few weeks...

[*rfaulk34*]

(09-17-2019, 04:48 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Andy actually has not been in that position very often, but he was driving us to a victory against the Texans in 2015 when Green gave the game away with a fumble with 50 seconds left.  Dalton was 6-8 for 66 yards driving us from our own 18 to the Texans 20 with juts 50 seconds left. Can't blame him for another players fumble.

Dalton also drove us to what should have been a victory against the Texans in 2016.  He completed 7 of 8 passes to drive us from our own 15 to the Texan 25 yard line but Bullock shanked the game winning FG on the last play of the game.

Other than those games there have only been 3 other Sunday night or Monday night games that we lost by one score that Andy could have won "late".  Two of those games were actually tied when the Bengal defense gave up drives that ended with game winning FGs on the final play (Cards '15, Steelers '17).  The only other one was against the Giants in '16.  In that game Dalton was sacked twice in a row with 4 minutes left and never got the ball back in a 20-21 loss.

So out of five situations you reference Dalton did his job in two of them, and the defense let him down in two of them.

I never have and would never deny that he's been good to great right up to the absolute final drive when he has to make the throws to win the game. I would also not deny that he's put the team in position to win--specifically on the instances you provided--and been let down by someone else. He has been unlucky in a couple of instances, but he's not the most unlucky QB to ever play the game. The very bottom line is, even if only given 2 or 3 actual chances--in actual games he's played--he's failed in each of them to get the job done. 

In the 2015 Cardinals game he had the ball in his hands and missed 2 throws, including one that AJ caught just out of bounds at the goal line and settled for a FG and an eventual loss. In the 2016 Texans game he got the ball back with 3:46 on the clock. During the drive, Core beat his defender and Dalton overthrew him by 2 yards, just like he overthrew Green in the 2nd Texans playoff game, when he was wide open, in the endzone with 3:00 left in the game (exactly the point i continue to make--he misses every time the opportunity is there). At the end of the drive in the '16 Texans game, he made a bad, short throw to Uzo that caused him to go down, in bounds and keep the clock running, forcing Marv to call one more run play(only one TO left), that Burkhead made a huge gain on, before trying the field goal. In the 2017 Steelers game, Ben drove the team down the field on the 2nd to last drive, making throw after throw including the game tying touchdown pass to Brown. Dalton got the ball back with 3:44 left on the clock, missed one pass to Green who was open and then got sacked on 3rd and 5 while having about 3 or 4 seconds to make a decision on who to throw to. Ben got the ball back and completed 3 passes, the first with a defender draped on his receivers back, about 20 yards, and led them down to the game winning FG as time expired. That's exactly what great QBs do. 

Whose to say that another QB doesn't make a different decision on any play during any of those chances and it leads to a TD and a win. That's the point i was making earlier when i gave the example of 3rd and 5 between Andy and Ben. What we know is that Dalton hasn't done it in the actual games he's played while other QBs have in those situations. What we don't know, and can't know, but can surmise based on what another QB has done, is that it is possible that they would have made a different decision somewhere on a drive to win a game. 

Granted, it's all speculation but it's not impossible. With the great QBs it's more probable than improbable. There is no speculation that Dalton has yet, in 8 years and 2 games, to win in that circumstance. 

You can continue to try and minimize the number of chances he's had, or point to how he "did his job" by getting the team in position but you can't deny that when put in position to make the throw or throws to win a game, he's missed every.single.time.