Jan 6 Hearings

[hollodero]

(06-15-2022, 08:13 AM)Dill Wrote: You're likely more informed than most of my fellow citizens, including me, I'm sorry to say.

I am most certainly not. I am just real gifted in avoiding to show what I don't know.

Eg. nope I did not know what the roles of Ivanka and Jared really were. It's just not that vitally important, imho, to understand Jan 6. Like I'd guess many people I was not breathlessly eager to know what Ivanka had said to Trump about the election, or this or that person at this or that time. Trump very well knew before Jan 6 that all serious people determined that he had lost, that much was clear. Because I know he watches TV, really.

(06-15-2022, 08:13 AM)Dill Wrote: I think listening to Trump insiders testifying to their tack toward the facts, as Trump tacked away from them, was much more persuasive than a summary by Dem Committee members could ever be.

Possibly, sure, I did not try to slam the committee. I can just say, when I heard what the Monday hearing would be about, I tuned out as well. Because, as I said, it was no surprise that people told him he actually had lost the election. Additionally, I didn't care all that much about that particular issue (whether he believed he'd lost or not), even though it might be of legal importance. Was he just lying or honestly delusional, well what gives really. And I suppose many people felt that way.

(06-15-2022, 08:13 AM)Dill Wrote: And much harder for Hannity & Co. to spin away.

I don't care about that either. It's never hard for them really. They have an audience that is already convinced anyway. Nothing they say has to pass any reality check to please their viewers.

(06-15-2022, 08:13 AM)Dill Wrote: As far as the Monday hearings, I also figured Trump was grifting with his appeals for a "Stop the Steal" defense fund, but I didn't realize that, so far as anyone can tell, there isn't and never was any such fund. Money just went straight to the Trump organization for "expenses" and "charities" run by co-conspirators like Meadows. This looks worse than the now defunct Trump Foundation grift. 

Yeah as I said, that was the most interesting part to me, too bad they hardly addressed it. Not that it's much of a surprise either, of course. Trump betraying his donors, can't say I didn't know he had it in him.

(06-15-2022, 08:13 AM)Dill Wrote: https://ag.ny.gov/press-release/2019/donald-j-trump-pays-court-ordered-2-million-illegally-using-trump-foundation

I don't think that "we" knew all this already if some of "us" have been largely listening to right wing media, which have been insistently minimizing the gravity of the insurgency/coup attempt and assuming that belief in "the steal" was the consensus among Trump insiders and Republicans who were actually investigating allegations of fraud. 

But people behaving in that manner and only believing Tucker/Hannity/etc will continue to do so anyway. They could watch Trump shoot someone and would believe it was actually Hillary in a mask. And Republicans who speak out against Trump in any way are RINOS, bad and incredible people that get primaried out. Maybe they find more enemies in that sense if they should ever come across these hearings (which they will not anyway), maybe Barr is an enemy and RINO to them now too, but that's that. No committee and no additional truth will ever change these minds. I lost all hope on that a long time ago. Reality and facts don't matter in that universe.
Really no reason to watch the hearings in length, worrying about these folks that is.

Overall, yeah "I" knew and that's why "I" left out the hearings and kept to a summary. Doesn't mean I also don't care about democracy. You paint it as though everyone not watching the hearings in length doesn't care about any of that, but that imho is a faulty conclusion.

(06-15-2022, 08:13 AM)Dill Wrote: Also, Trump defenders have sought not only to minimize the Capitol breach, but also to disconnect it from Trump and the Big Lie which motivated them along with millions of Republican voters who still believe the election was stolen. The hearings have reconnected all these disparate elements to show how the "Big Lie," the Green Bay Sweep, the pressure on Pence to disqualify electors in swing states, and Trump sending a mass of true believers to converge "peacefully" on the Capitol to increase pressure on Pence--as Proud Boys and Oathkeepers already waited in position--all worked together to disrupt the certification of the 2020 election, and in a manner requiring foresight and long term preparation. And they are doing this largely by testimony from the perps and video. 

And now? Now Trump defenders will still seek to minimize the Capitol breach, to disconnect it from Trump and the Big Lie and all the other things you said. I know I repeat my stance, but that's just what I can say about it. No hearing will change all that and I for one can grasp no additional fascination from that.