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It was never that clear cut. We don't know if Zeitler actually wanted to be here anymore and it's not like having both would save this train wreck of a season so how would we know?

I wasn’t all that thrilled with shelling out that deal for Dre.

I would have preferred Logan Ryan for 3 yrs and 30 mil and someone like ronald Leary and let Dre and z walk


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(09-27-2017, 12:06 PM)CageTheBengal Wrote: [ -> ]It was never that clear cut. We don't know if Zeitler actually wanted to be here anymore and it's not like having both would save this train wreck of a season so how would we know?

He went to the Browns. I doubt he had a deep desire to go to the worst team in football.

Had the Bengals offerred him $10-11 million a year...he would have been back. 

I was against the Kirkpatrick contract from the get-go. Dude took 5 years to become a decent starter and it just so happened to be in his contract year. Now he's right back where he was. Shocking.

Also didn't want Jones back after his offseason stuff, though I will admit I didn't think he'd drop off that much on the field.

I didn't like Zeitler at that $, but I would have (obviously) kept Whit and then spent some money on other OL.

Based on how this team is structured and what Andy needs in order to make him good, the offensive line should have been a priority. How the coaches and the organization didnt realize this is beyond me.

(09-27-2017, 10:16 AM)muskiesfan Wrote: [ -> ]We should have kept at least Zeitler or Whit. Honestly, when you have the worst OLine in the NFL the drop off is definitely considerable from Zeitler to these jokesters. Keeping Zeitler would mean an improvement at 1 position on the OLine. It doesn't mean the overall play would be improved. Zeitler had some issues last year as well. Being flanked by Bodine and Ced did him no favors.

Moving Johnson to C should be a no brainer. In the past when given playing time their, he has outplayed Bodine. With Bodine being the personal pick of our shitty OLine coach though, Bodine gets to start no matter what. I wonder what it feels like to be a fan of a team that is actually ran properly. I bet it feels amazing.

So true

Why and how did they let both of our best linemen on a below average line walk in the same year.

(09-27-2017, 10:09 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: [ -> ]So far this year, Kirkpatrick's PFF rating is 41.9 which is Poor. He's ranked as the 91st best CB. Zeitler, in a new scheme with the Browns ranks at 72.5 which is Average. Last year he was rated as the #7 Guard in football.

IF we let Kirkpatrick walk, our CB's would have been: Jones/Jackson/Dennard/Shaw then Russell and Benwikere. Granted Dennard has been a disappointment up to this year...but this far this year he's at a 79.6. Jackson has a 77.4. Granted they're not facing a teams #1 WR like Kirkpatrick, but it seems they are capable.

Now the offensive line with Zeitler would have been: Ced/Boling/Bodine/Zeitler/Fisher...and Smith could be rotated with Fisher and Ced and TJ Johnson could be slid in at Center producing something like this: Smith/Boling/Johnson/Zeitler/Fisher.

Which scenario makes the team better?

Personally I think the dropoff from Kirkpatrick to the other CB's is less than from Zeitler to the other lineman. Especially allowing Johnson to slide in at Center.

More food for thought: Jones is a $7.6 million cap hit. Andre Smith makes $3.25 million. Combined you have nearly Zeitler's salary.

Eh, for the money Zeit got paid, Kirkpatrick was the right choice cause you never know if Dennard is going to stay
healthy or WJ3 will live up to his draft status. These guys look good right now thankfully but at the time extending
Dre was the right decision IMHO.

Zeit was bad run blocker here and was not worth nearly as much as he got paid. He is good in pass protection but
he isn't THAT good for heck sake. The Browns overpaid him big time.

The guy we should of kept is Whitworth.

the corners caused us the last 2 games with their shitty coverage in the 4th quarter.

(09-27-2017, 12:06 PM)CageTheBengal Wrote: [ -> ]It was never that clear cut. We don't know if Zeitler actually wanted to be here anymore and it's not like having both would save this train wreck of a season so how would we know?

The Bengals and Zeitler's camp never talked again after DeCastro's deal was announced. The Bengals knew he would probably ask for at least that kind of money and they don't value guards like that.

What's really sad is that after we drafted Zeitler, his agents/reps said he'd probably never receive a 2nd contract from the Bengals.

This is a passing league CB have a lot more value then a G. We would not over pay for a G weather we had Dre on the team or not. This is kind of a apples to oranges comparison the CB wins hands down.

Lol I always thought the contract we gave him was ridiculous. He's not good at all. He had a game with a few interceptions and that's all the Bengals needed.

Terrible decision.

(09-27-2017, 03:51 PM)BengalsBong Wrote: [ -> ]This is a passing league CB have a lot more value then a G. We would not over pay for a G weather we had Dre on the team or not. This is kind of a apples to oranges comparison the CB wins hands down.

It's a passing league, yet a good guard is less valuable than a mediocre CB?

What? Have you seen what happens to teams with poor lines?

(09-27-2017, 03:51 PM)BengalsBong Wrote: [ -> ]This is a passing league CB have a lot more value then a G. We would not over pay for a G weather we had Dre on the team or not. This is kind of a apples to oranges comparison the CB wins hands down.

re: The notion of overpaying a player - It's not like we're going to spend that money in free agency. It just goes to the Bengals profit margin...which doesn't improve the team.

You may as well overpay some of your own players.

Kirkpatrick over Whitworth is the real question.

And the answer is "f******k no."

This was before Zeitler hit free agency:

“I don’t see it, I mean cause Kevin Zeitler turned down good money, turned down an offer that was something like $5.5 million per year average. But, you know, when you look at it, (Kelechi) Osemele got like $12 million bucks a year from the Oakland Raiders last year, as a guard. So Zeitler’s like, hmm. Osemele made the Pro Bowl team, Zeitler is second team. So Kevin Zeitler is thinking, I’ve gotta be eight, nine, 10, seven (million) worst case scenario. And not just Kevin, Kevin and his agents. But I don’t see the Bengals paying that kind of dollars to a guard when they have other guys they feel they can plug in and play,” Lapham said.

https://www.cincyjungle.com/2017/1/3/14157272/dave-lapham-doesnt-see-bengals-re-signing-both-kevin-zeitler-and-andrew-whitworth

So DeCastro gets $10 million a year and the Bengals offer Zeitler $5.5 million a year!?!?

It wasn't really an either or situation.
They could have kept everyone.

Whit, Dre and Zeitler.

They just didn't want to do the things required of them as a franchise to do it.

(09-27-2017, 12:29 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: [ -> ]Zeit was bad run blocker here and was not worth nearly as much as he got paid. He is good in pass protection but
he isn't THAT good for heck sake. The Browns overpaid him big time.

Just....just stop

Considering we had 2 1st round picks at CB and ZERO decent OG, yes, we should have signed Z.

(09-27-2017, 10:16 AM)muskiesfan Wrote: [ -> ]We should have kept at least Zeitler or Whit. Honestly, when you have the worst OLine in the NFL the drop off is definitely considerable from Zeitler to these jokesters. Keeping Zeitler would mean an improvement at 1 position on the OLine. It doesn't mean the overall play would be improved. Zeitler had some issues last year as well. Being flanked by Bodine and Ced did him no favors.

Moving Johnson to C should be a no brainer. In the past when given playing time their, he has outplayed Bodine. With Bodine being the personal pick of our shitty OLine coach though, Bodine gets to start no matter what. I wonder what it feels like to be a fan of a team that is actually ran properly. I bet it feels amazing.

Geez! Just watch some of the video clips and you will see Bovine on his ass a lot of the time. The other times he is just out of the play. How can any responsible coach keep running Bovine out there as the center on a piss poor line? Only in Bengalville.

(09-27-2017, 12:23 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: [ -> ]I was against the Kirkpatrick contract from the get-go. Dude took 5 years to become a decent starter and it just so happened to be in his contract year. Now he's right back where he was. Shocking.

Also didn't want Jones back after his offseason stuff, though I will admit I didn't think he'd drop off that much on the field.

I didn't like Zeitler at that $, but I would have (obviously) kept Whit and then spent some money on other OL.

EXACTLY!