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It's stuff like this that adds another year to the time i'll be able to look back on him with fondness.

We are getting close to my anticipated death.

(12-12-2017, 02:31 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: [ -> ]Marvin, is it your job to motivate your team?



Marvin, is it your job to make sure your guys are well prepared?



Marvin, is it your job to make sure schematic changes are made if they're not working?



Marvin, is it your job to ensure second half adjustments are made?



Marvin, is it your job to take responsibility for the failings of your staff?



Marvin, are you held accountable in any way by management?

https://media.tenor.com/images/f9bd55dd16bbf3cd6cbb21a0f84b4a89/tenor.gif.

Marvin, Marvin, Marvin!



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I need to be a reporter in Cincinnati so I can attend one of these pressers and ask some uncomfortable questions. The journals that attend these things don't ask the tough questions and less his ass off the hook every time

When has it ever NOT been the HC job to provide motivation for games?

Wtf

I think it depends on your definition of motivate. If you mean getting the adrenaline flowing, frothing-at-the-mouth-ready-to-run-through-a-brick-wall motivation, Marvin is right....not his job. Not at this level. Some of the greatest coaches weren't rah rah guys.  Landry,  Noll, Belichik, Dungy, Grant, Parcells, were all highly successful, but weren't real motivaters in a rah rah sense.  Chuck Noll famously told his team in his first team meeting that if he had to motivate them, then he'll fire them. There was just no room on the roster for anyone that didn't naturally give 100% effort, 100% of the time.  That was the standard back then. Even Belichick' s "just do you job" mantra is more old school than new age. 

Successful teams also seem to have at least one if not several players that are strong team leaders that the other players respect and rally around.

So I don't think it's the HC's job to individually motivate any player. I do think the head coach's role in that regard is to create a culture on the team where 100% motivation of the player and the team to succeed is the standard.   Anything else is unacceptable. That includes stupid and selfish penalties that hurt the team. And you draft players that fit into that culture. Any player that needs their hand held, a personal cheerleader or sideline shrink should be on the next bus out of town. HC's have more important things to do.  (Position coaches on the other hand should absolutely get in the faces of their players. He knows their personalities and motivation triggers much better than the HC.)

That said, a coach has to hold up their end also...and that's where the Bengals may fall short. If the players don't believe they're being given the very best opportunity to succeed, it's human nature to have difficulty maintaining self-motivation. Doesn't mean that it's right or acceptable, especially with the money these guys make, but like I said, they have to fight human nature. 

There's a reason that some teams can come back and win after being down by 17 at the half, and other teams can come back and lose after being up 17 at the half, and it's not JUST about X's and O's. It's a mindset instilled by the culture of the team that started way back in training camp.

(12-13-2017, 12:38 PM)BMK Wrote: [ -> ]I think it depends on your definition of motivate. If you mean getting the adrenaline flowing, frothing-at-the-mouth-ready-to-run-through-a-brick-wall motivation, Marvin is right....not his job. Not at this level. Some of the greatest coaches weren't rah rah guys.  Landry,  Noll, Belichik, Dungy, Grant, Parcells, were all highly successful, but weren't real motivaters in a rah rah sense.  Chuck Noll famously told his team in his first team meeting that if he had to motivate them, then he'll fire them. There was just no room on the roster for anyone that didn't naturally give 100% effort, 100% of the time.  That was the standard back then. Even Belichick' s "just do you job" mantra is more old school than new age. 

Successful teams also seem to have at least one if not several players that are strong team leaders that the other players respect and rally around.

So I don't think it's the HC's job to individually motivate any player. I do think the head coach's role in that regard is to create a culture on the team where 100% motivation of the player and the team to succeed is the standard.   Anything else is unacceptable. That includes stupid and selfish penalties that hurt the team. And you draft players that fit into that culture. Any player that needs their hand held, a personal cheerleader or sideline shrink should be on the next bus out of town. HC's have more important things to do.  (Position coaches on the other hand should absolutely get in the faces of their players. He knows their personalities and motivation triggers much better than the HC.)

That said, a coach has to hold up their end also...and that's where the Bengals may fall short. If the players don't believe they're being given the very best opportunity to succeed, it's human nature to have difficulty maintaining self-motivation. Doesn't mean that it's right or acceptable, especially with the money these guys make, but like I said, they have to fight human nature. 

There's a reason that some teams can come back and win after being down by 17 at the half, and other teams can come back and lose after being up 17 at the half, and it's not JUST about X's and O's. It's a mindset instilled by the culture of the team that started way back in training camp.

Perfectly said!

(12-13-2017, 12:38 PM)BMK Wrote: [ -> ]I think it depends on your definition of motivate. If you mean getting the adrenaline flowing, frothing-at-the-mouth-ready-to-run-through-a-brick-wall motivation, Marvin is right....not his job. Not at this level. Some of the greatest coaches weren't rah rah guys.  Landry,  Noll, Belichik, Dungy, Grant, Parcells, were all highly successful, but weren't real motivaters in a rah rah sense.  Chuck Noll famously told his team in his first team meeting that if he had to motivate them, then he'll fire them. There was just no room on the roster for anyone that didn't naturally give 100% effort, 100% of the time.  That was the standard back then. Even Belichick' s "just do you job" mantra is more old school than new age. 

Successful teams also seem to have at least one if not several players that are strong team leaders that the other players respect and rally around.

So I don't think it's the HC's job to individually motivate any player. I do think the head coach's role in that regard is to create a culture on the team where 100% motivation of the player and the team to succeed is the standard.   Anything else is unacceptable. That includes stupid and selfish penalties that hurt the team. And you draft players that fit into that culture. Any player that needs their hand held, a personal cheerleader or sideline shrink should be on the next bus out of town. HC's have more important things to do.  (Position coaches on the other hand should absolutely get in the faces of their players. He knows their personalities and motivation triggers much better than the HC.)

That said, a coach has to hold up their end also...and that's where the Bengals may fall short. If the players don't believe they're being given the very best opportunity to succeed, it's human nature to have difficulty maintaining self-motivation. Doesn't mean that it's right or acceptable, especially with the money these guys make, but like I said, they have to fight human nature. 

There's a reason that some teams can come back and win after being down by 17 at the half, and other teams can come back and lose after being up 17 at the half, and it's not JUST about X's and O's. It's a mindset instilled by the culture of the team that started way back in training camp.

.......and there you have it.  This team doesn't even bench guys for a play or two for boneheaded mistakes/underperforming.....unless you're a rookie wideout.  That's part of "motivation" as well.

Worst motivator in the league, also takes zero responsibility. A responsible person would have quit by now. "I can't do it, I'm bad."

(12-12-2017, 02:11 PM)masonbengals fan Wrote: [ -> ]If motivation & scheme isn't his job, what is his job.

Probably to be Mikey's only NFL friend. I wonder how Paul brown would have reacted to the motivation-comment by Lewis?

(12-12-2017, 05:01 PM)TheUberHuber Wrote: [ -> ]Marv has lost his dam mind.

Also, what he said about some "pretty important games coming up" when in reality their level of importance is pretty much moot at this point.

Maybe he should have said "some pretty important games coming up" a few weeks ago. But, he typically preaches that "each game is just another game." No wonder the Dip**** can't win primetime/playoff games. He needs to go ASAP.

(12-12-2017, 06:09 PM)sandwedge Wrote: [ -> ]I was just pointing out a staple of Marvin's conservative ways. Hard to be motivated when the coach doesn't put you in position to succeed. Ask our defense if they like this bend but don't break crap he plays? The defense loved playing for Zimmer, why because he challenged them by playing man alot.

Sunday, those who may actually watch the game, will see how defense is supposed to be played. And it won't be Guenther's sloppy D showing the way.

Getting paid a million bucks for a season really should be the only motivation any of them needs.. These guys don't get multi million dollar contracts by losing games except in Cleveland..  Oh wait..it's the National Fixed League.. Of course they get paid to lose.. 

"What might have been Sunday," coming right up.

What happened against the Bears was a bunch of professional football players, showing no professional pride. I don’t think Marvin can be held responsible for that. If you’re the kind of pro that will give up like that, you shouldn’t have a job. You’re getting paid a to do a job, do it.

Being a manager myself, I can understand that professionals shouldn’t “need” some type of motivation from their manager. However, if the team is performing below expectations, it’s the manager’s responsibility to find ways to improve that performance. If there’s some type of incentive or just a motivational speech that will work, one should try it.


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(12-16-2017, 01:22 PM)ochocincos Wrote: [ -> ]Being a manager myself, I can understand that professionals shouldn’t “need” some type of motivation from their manager. However, if the team is performing below expectations, it’s the manager’s responsibility to find ways to improve that performance. If there’s some type of incentive or just a motivational speech that will work, one should try it.


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Bingo.  Whether someone earns $400 or $400,000 per week, a good manager can motivate them.  This guy's just sleepwalking through his days until about 4 PM December 31.  

(12-12-2017, 05:34 PM)Interceptor Wrote: [ -> ]Marv needs to be put out of his misery....

Correction--he needs to be put out of our misery.

(12-12-2017, 05:21 PM)bfine32 Wrote: [ -> ]Well I have taken a few mental intelligence classes as a HRM and I agree with Marvin that it is not your job to motivate anyone. It is your job to set the framework for them to motivate themselves; as everyone is not motivated by the same thing. I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest Marvin understands the dynamic more that many experts in this forum that were "motivated" by their PeeWee coach with Ice Cream after the game.

What do we think Marvin should do to "motivate" a millionaire getting paid to play a game if that player cannot motivate themselves?

It's easy. I guarantee Mike Tomlin knows how to motivate his players, this guy is a straight up dawg.

"Is Antonio better than you?" - to AJ
Mixon created self motivation by talking trash in the media about Bell.
Gio ran better than ever when Mixon got hurt, why, because he wants his job back.
But not everyone can create that motivation themselves, Marvin should have pushed it, and he didn't, he doesn't know how. It's an honest thing to say that if you perform better, you get hte job, so it's easy to tell Gio "go get your job back." But as I like to say, where there's money, there are liars - so there's no honesty going around in this league.

Not everyone is motivated by money, everyone is motivated by something "else", but there is no "atmosphere" for them to be motivated - Marvin has to do that himself! The coach is responsible for firing people up. Jordan and Kobe made shit up to motivate them, some people need that extra spice.

Think about why we played so well against the Steelers in the 1st half, they are clearly a better team. This team has lacked motivation for 3-4 years, it has always been their biggest problem. Marvin is the worst motivator, we could see that from the outside, and now he admits it. We have the perfect combination of personality traits that allows lack of motivation to occur. Andy is too damn nice. When do we see him get into a player's face? It matters when you're the leader, you don't have to be mr. mean guy but mr. nice guy rarely finishes first. Leaders set the tone (for better or worse).

Motivation comes in a lot of colors. There is no penalty for performing poorly, then why would some be motivated to perform well? Some do take that into account.

For example, in my current job I can work 80 hours a week but I really have no personal benefit for producing fast (timeline wise). I'm going to release a product that will make hundreds of millions, but I won't likely see a dime other than my typical salary. That stops me for a second before I forget about it and keep working hard, but everyone is different. Many fold once the money comes in, they have to be jousted in some way.

Everything ties in to why we perform poorly when needed. Nobody drives motivation, there's no penalty for being unmotivated, there's no penalty for performing poorly, there's no reason to make half time adjustments (and no capability, since nobody cares that they're getting owned one way or another), it doesn't really matter if we win or lose (it's just a game!).

A long time ago I was on anxiety meds, it made me not care about the outcome of anything. I didn't care if I did a good job, or bad job, I was even keel. Marvin Lewis had the whole team on Zoloft.

Helps explain why Marvin Lewis coached teams play their worst in prime time and play off games.

Just a reminder for some, from FM 6-22 Leader Development:

"LEADERSHIP REQUIREMENTS

1-13 An Army leader, by virtue of assumed role or assigned responsibility, inspires people to accomplish organizational goals. Army leaders motivate people both inside and outside the chain of command to pursue actions, focus thinking, and shape decisions for the greater good of the organization {ADP 6-22). These occur through leadership-the process of influencing people by providing purpose, direction, and motivation to accomplish the mission and improve the organization (ADP 6-22)."

Claiming it isn't a coach's job to motivate his players is some of the weakest weak sauce, yet. It's on par with fredtoast defending everything Bratkowski or Paul Alexander. Or claiming a leader's job doesn't include motivating his subordinates.

(12-17-2017, 12:52 PM)reuben.ahmed Wrote: [ -> ]It's easy. I guarantee Mike Tomlin knows how to motivate his players, this guy is a straight up dawg.

"Is Antonio better than you?" - to AJ

If Tomlin was coaching Burfict: "Yo Taz.... Keep doin' what you always been doin'..."