Cincinnati Bengals Message Board / Forums - Home of Jungle Noise

(12-28-2017, 09:13 AM)Socal Bengals fan Wrote: [ -> ]Check out Drew Lock out of Missouri.   Good size at 604 but the guy can sling the football. He's shooting up the draft boards after setting the record at SEC at 43tds. He's got a cannon for an arm . In one of his videos he threw it 65 yards in the airhitiing the guy in stride against Georgia.  Anyways we can't risk it n need to hit on a q.b. early

Isn't Lock only a junior? I don't see that he's declared for the draft anywhere... But yes, the guy has arm talent for sure. With the right coaching staff the guy could do very well in the NFL. 

Take him in the second or third round. 

(12-28-2017, 02:42 PM)Pat5775 Wrote: [ -> ]Very well said. And I agree 100%

(12-28-2017, 02:05 PM)Socal Bengals fan Wrote: [ -> ]What does he do positive. He is the product of the system nothing more

Really?  And what system is what?  Gruden's system?  Hue's system?  Zampese's system?  The system has changed on him 4 times and he's produced every time aside from the shyt show Zampese put on the field earlier this year.

Your argument holds zero weight.  Sorry.  Try again with an actual argument.

(12-28-2017, 02:27 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: [ -> ]This logic has always been so frustrating to me. Dalton is a player, right? We've had a crap ton of players choke or outright disappear under Marvin, correct? Now why do people act like Dalton is supposed to be immune to that? To rise above it when no one else does? It makes absolutely zero sense. If the system is predictable and playoff caliber teams can stop it in the playoffs, how is that Dalton's fault? Kitna, Palmer and McCarron were all considered top flight backups or serviceable starters at the very least, and all of them played like ass in the playoffs. That's why I think it's a system/schematic/coaching issue.

Sorry, I'm not aiming this at you so much as the (popular) idea that Dalton is on the same level as Marv as far as blame goes. If we truly believe Marv is the issue, then he would be affecting Dalton's play as well.

Like I've been saying, I'm indifferent on bringing Dalton back or drafting a Baker Mayfield. I do know that this franchise has a LOT to fix if they're going to ever contend for championships...regardless of who the QB is. 

Very well said.

(12-26-2017, 09:35 PM)Nati#1 Wrote: [ -> ]In this years draft I don't think we should pass up drafting a QB. Wyoming's Josh Allen has a skill set different from any qb in this draft. He has GREAT pocket awareness. Something Andy lacks. He also has a cannon arm and isn't afraid to trust his receivers, he's a gunslinger, unlike Andy. This could be our future QB  that we should not pass up. We need to groom someone now behind Andy and let Andy start until he loses the job. We should draft Allen in the late first or 2nd. To me he looks like a mix between Ben Roethlisberger, and Phillip River with Brett Favres arm. Very fun to watch. Out of all QB's Allen has caught my eye the most. This guy would get us over the hump in the playoffs. He's a winner and talks to his teammates. I would actually take this guy with our top 10 pick if he is ranked that high in the draft..If we are taking a lineman in the 1st Round it had better be Orlando Brown if anyone. Orlando is a good tackle but not a great one, but he would be our best option if we took a lineman. I would not pass up on Allen he looks like a franchise QB that we can be forsure about.

https://youtu.be/QTuKHNz9vbA

Yeah, Allen probably does have the most upside of any QB in this class. As long as the O-line is taken care of like your
mock i would be for grabbing him and letting him sit behind Dalton for a year or two. Allen is that talented, best arm in
this draft, maybe the best in years, great at throwing on the run, hard to tackle and can throw WR's open.

Extremely raw though and had a tough year which is why he might fall to the 2nd.

But i have to add that i don't think Dalton is the problem here. Our coaches are.

Looking at the QB-needy teams picking ahead of us, I'd say Baker Mayfield is the only guy we'll have a shot at. And that's assuming all of the big names actually declare (Darnold, Allen, Rosen, Mayfield). I know Rosen has hinted that he may not declare.

(12-28-2017, 04:36 PM)Stewy Wrote: [ -> ]Really?  And what system is what?  Gruden's system?  Hue's system?  Zampese's system?  The system has changed on him 4 times and he's produced every time aside from the shyt show Zampese put on the field earlier this year.

Your argument holds zero weight.  Sorry.  Try again with an actual argument.

I'm sorry is he the only q.b that has multiple coordinates.  You Dalton apologist have gotten worse over time.  Blame the oline,  blame the #2 wr, blame the coach. In the mean time your no arm, no accuracy,  zero leadership, keeps fumbling away victories.  

(12-28-2017, 07:32 PM)Socal Bengals fan Wrote: [ -> ]I'm sorry is he the only q.b that has multiple coordinates.  You Dalton apologist have gotten worse over time.  Blame the oline,  blame the #2 wr, blame the coach. In the mean time your no arm, no accuracy,  zero leadership, keeps fumbling away victories.  

Andy was successful in Gruden and Hue's system. Now if watch 2016 you can see where Zampese's offense was just awful. 

(12-28-2017, 07:32 PM)Socal Bengals fan Wrote: [ -> ]I'm sorry is he the only q.b that has multiple coordinates.  You Dalton apologist have gotten worse over time.  Blame the oline,  blame the #2 wr, blame the coach. In the mean time your no arm, no accuracy,  zero leadership, keeps fumbling away victories.  

No Dalton is not the only QB that has had multiple Coordinators but there are tons of examples of it hampering a QB's
development. Going from different OC to different OC sets QB's back. Look at Alex Smith when he went through all those
different OC's in San Fran. Now look what he is doing in KC under Nagy and Andy Reid.

Dalton has won a hell of a lot more games than he has fumbled away BTW.

It is not all on him, as a matter of fact it is more on the coaches than our QB as to why we are a below average team.

But not against drafting a QB like Allen if the O-line is taken care of. Tom Brady would of sucked this year behind this
O-line IMHO. But that is the thing, Brady has great coaches all around him and the best O-line coach in the NFL.

(12-26-2017, 09:48 PM)pally Wrote: [ -> ]sure if the right QB falls to the right place but I don't think we should push it because we have other more pressing immediate needs

This! I doubt a really good QB is going to fall to the Bengals. I think all the elites will be gone in first 5 picks. But, if one of the "can't miss" types were available I would take him. We know AJ McCarron is NOT the answer. Driskel won't get enough reps for us to know unless we get an offensive-minded HC. Marvin won't play him that's for sure.

(12-28-2017, 07:32 PM)Socal Bengals fan Wrote: [ -> ]no arm

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand there goes any credibility you had when it comes to analyzing Dalton. 

I want baker or Lamar for a lot of reasons . I like darnold too but don't see him as a Superbowl winner neither do I see Allen a Superbowl winner,but I think all 4 would be a upgrade from Dalton. Daltons only strength is good velocity and his quick throws ,the rest of his game sucks. If we had a actual good qb this team would be fun to watch and really win playoff games with the stars we already have. Not only talent but bandwagon fans would jump on board and root for our qb with baker and Jackson and that would most likely mean more wins with call a going our way.

(12-28-2017, 08:01 PM)PhilHos Wrote: [ -> ]Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand there goes any credibility you had when it comes to analyzing Dalton. 

YesYes, because it's known around the league Dalton has a cannon for an arm..fml 

(12-26-2017, 09:48 PM)pally Wrote: [ -> ]sure if the right QB falls to the right place but I don't think we should push it because we have other more pressing immediate needs

Sure. McCarron is a FA so...odds are he escapes and.. I think any hope to trade him for a pick is GONE.  Replacing him? Think rd 4 or 5.  
the Bengals have OTHER priorities... like ..O Line?    We're a tad thin at TE if Eifort escapes and we'll want a LB at some point.

(12-28-2017, 07:58 PM)Derrick Wrote: [ -> ]This! I doubt a really good QB is going to fall to the Bengals. I think all the elites will be gone in first 5 picks. But, if one of the "can't miss" types were available I would take him. We know AJ McCarron is NOT the answer. Driskel won't get enough reps for us to know unless we get an offensive-minded HC. Marvin won't play him that's for sure.

A.J. isn’t the answer based on what, exactly? He hasn’t been given an extended look in the regular season, save for the few games he played after Dalton got hurt in 2014. A.J finished that stretch with a pretty good passer rating, and had the Bengals in position to win a Playoff game until Hill fumbled and Vontaze/Pac-Man did Vontaze/Pac-Man things. You can hate A.J. because of the unrealistic McCarron homers, but no one knows how A.J. will fare as a starter because he’s only started in about 4 meaningful NFL games.

(12-28-2017, 07:13 PM)Big Boss Wrote: [ -> ]Looking at the QB-needy teams picking ahead of us, I'd say Baker Mayfield is the only guy we'll have a shot at.  And that's assuming all of the big names actually declare (Darnold, Allen, Rosen, Mayfield).  I know Rosen has hinted that he may not declare.

why on earth is J Allen seen as a legit high pick? He hasn't DONE much.   oh... he's a BIG guy. so what? MANY others at least complete 60%, have more yards, more TD's.  Allen is PERFECT for the BROWNS.

let's see who's there rd 5.

(12-28-2017, 08:01 PM)PhilHos Wrote: [ -> ]Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand there goes any credibility you had when it comes to analyzing Dalton. 

He has velocity on his throws but he doesn't have a live arm or really have the arm to lead his receivers or put it in tight windows. Watch even Lamar jackson,he even looks to have a better arm then dalton.

(12-29-2017, 01:00 AM)redwood Wrote: [ -> ]why on earth is J Allen seen as a legit high pick? He hasn't DONE much.   oh... he's a BIG guy. so what? MANY others at least complete 60%, have more yards, more TD's.  Allen is PERFECT for the BROWNS.

let's see who's there rd 5.

That's why I'd only take him round 2 ,and the last guy I'd take. People are just going by his tools. I even see him doing the Dalton dive losing the football a lot that scares me lol.

(12-28-2017, 03:41 AM)Stewy Wrote: [ -> ]Are you this clueless as to the state of the team or is it a natural state?

How many playoffs games he won?

(12-29-2017, 04:02 AM)ah5 Wrote: [ -> ]How many playoffs games he won?

Are playoff wins a good way to measure how good a player really is? If so Geno Green Dunlap Burfict aren't good either.

Lol I think the best defensive preformance we've seen during the playoff streak was from Vinny Rey.