Cincinnati Bengals Message Board / Forums - Home of Jungle Noise

(10-01-2018, 04:19 PM)dnkw Wrote: [ -> ]How long do new schemes typically take to gel, Harley?

That depends on how good of a communicator the man trying to teach the scheme.

(10-01-2018, 04:19 PM)dnkw Wrote: [ -> ]How long do new schemes typically take to gel, Harley?

It takes until the players can react without thinking. Varies by scheme and player.

(10-01-2018, 02:56 PM)corpjet Wrote: [ -> ]Defense is concerning, Im hoping its because of a new system they are learning under Austin.

No doubt our DL is solid, Our LBers will get a boost with #55 coming back and our secondary is average.

With all that said we are a middle of the road defense thats going to rely on our offense to win us games unless we get a constant push from our front 4.

I thought the D line would be great this year but so far they are average- or worse.

I think Carolina had two backups playing and they were blowing our guys away play after play on running plays.

Something has to change. Maybe Burfict will be the change

As for the Defense, it's the scheme. Detroit never had a dominant D. It was either they got a turnover or gave up a score. Remember they couldn't stop our 32nd ranked Offense in 2017. Looks familiar.

I never trusted a Coordinator that coached from the booth. Austin needs to be on the field and in his players faces coaching them up and keeping up with the emotions of the D players. Not just checking on them at half time. That may be an easy correction Marvin can force. If not, it's going to be a long 10 years with Austin.

Without posting a new thread, my concern is (other than the entire defense), we are still a first half team other than Indy game.

Points per quarter:
Indy - 3,7,7,17
Balt - 14,14,0,6
Car - 7,7,7,0
Atl - 14,14,0,9

Total per quarter:
1 - 38
2 - 42
3 - 14 = why are we deferring the coin toss? Basically a TO before the game even starts.
4 - 32

Total per half:
1 - 80 points
2- 46 points

The numbers follow Marvin's MO. Come out strong. Fail to make adjustments at HT. Come alive again mid fourth quarter. Hence cardiac cats.

(10-01-2018, 10:19 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: [ -> ]I dont think we could have asked more from the Bengals with their 3-1 start. Im pumped and excited but lets talk about some of the things that worry you or that you would like to see this team improve upon:

1. Im worried about the overall health of this team. Ross, Price, Eiffert, AJ, Gio. The list goes on. Its early in the season and this team is banged up.

2. The defense. Im not really sure why this defense is struggling so bad. They have a TON of talent. I think the defensive line is going to be fine, they have talent - we all know this. The linebackers are another story. Im not sold on Vigil and Brown. Burfict coming back will hopefully be a big lift. Also, the secondary has talent, but they are getting torched at times.

Basically, whats up with the defense? Is it a scheme thing, the way they play, or what? I feel like they have WAY too much talent on that side of the ball to be playing this bad.

Those are really the only two concerns I have moving forward.

Here is what is wrong with our defense.Its called the defensive corr.He is a BUST.I WOULD replaced these three players NOW.Number one is Michael Johnson,the dude is just a body out there and gets beat every down.Number two is nick virgel.I know I misspelled his name.He gets beat a ton and makes the tackle after the fact.He is not a starter,just a backup.Number 3 Hardy Nickerson is too short and makes the plays after the dude has make his 1st down.Way to slow and I would also consider Dre Kirkpatrick.Dude was getting beat all game and that sucks.The reason I have said this is people want to know whats wrong with this defense. See above.

Now the offense,this line is okay but not great and they have to find some more top O-lineman to come in here and play lights out. The experiment with bobbi hart should be over.He is awlful and will get Dalton killed.I would sit him and play westerman.dude is a force and plays mean.   Our defensive corr.is a bust.He is not putting the right players out there.Sam Hubbard should be starting in place of M.Johnson. and wheres the guy we just brought in here from ohio state??? He should be starting in the rotation right frickin now.

(10-01-2018, 10:19 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: [ -> ]I dont think we could have asked more from the Bengals with their 3-1 start. Im pumped and excited but lets talk about some of the things that worry you or that you would like to see this team improve upon:

1. Im worried about the overall health of this team. Ross, Price, Eiffert, AJ, Gio. The list goes on. Its early in the season and this team is banged up.

2. The defense. Im not really sure why this defense is struggling so bad. They have a TON of talent. I think the defensive line is going to be fine, they have talent - we all know this. The linebackers are another story. Im not sold on Vigil and Brown. Burfict coming back will hopefully be a big lift. Also, the secondary has talent, but they are getting torched at times.

Basically, whats up with the defense? Is it a scheme thing, the way they play, or what? I feel like they have WAY too much talent on that side of the ball to be playing this bad.

Those are really the only two concerns I have moving forward.

Here is what is wrong with our defense.Its called the defensive corr.He is a BUST.I WOULD replaced these three players NOW.Number one is Michael Johnson,the dude is just a body out there and gets beat every down.Number two is nick virgel.I know I misspelled his name.He gets beat a ton and makes the tackle after the fact.He is not a starter,just a backup.Number 3 Hardy Nickerson is too short and makes the plays after the dude has make his 1st down.Way to slow and I would also consider Dre Kirkpatrick.Dude was getting beat all game and that sucks.The reason I have said this is people want to know whats wrong with this defense. See above.

Now the offense,this line is okay but not great and they have to find some more top O-lineman to come in here and play lights out. The experiment with bobbi hart should be over.He is awlful and will get Dalton killed.I would sit him and play westerman.dude is a force and plays mean.   Our defensive corr.is a bust.He is not putting the right players out there.Sam Hubbard should be starting in place of M.Johnson. and wheres the guy we just brought in here from ohio state??? He should be starting in the rotation right frickin now.

(10-01-2018, 10:19 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: [ -> ]I dont think we could have asked more from the Bengals with their 3-1 start. Im pumped and excited but lets talk about some of the things that worry you or that you would like to see this team improve upon:

1. Im worried about the overall health of this team. Ross, Price, Eiffert, AJ, Gio. The list goes on. Its early in the season and this team is banged up.

2. The defense. Im not really sure why this defense is struggling so bad. They have a TON of talent. I think the defensive line is going to be fine, they have talent - we all know this. The linebackers are another story. Im not sold on Vigil and Brown. Burfict coming back will hopefully be a big lift. Also, the secondary has talent, but they are getting torched at times.

Basically, whats up with the defense? Is it a scheme thing, the way they play, or what? I feel like they have WAY too much talent on that side of the ball to be playing this bad.

Those are really the only two concerns I have moving forward.

Here is what is wrong with our defense.Its called the defensive corr.He is a BUST.I WOULD replaced these three players NOW.Number one is Michael Johnson,the dude is just a body out there and gets beat every down.Number two is nick virgel.I know I misspelled his name.He gets beat a ton and makes the tackle after the fact.He is not a starter,just a backup.Number 3 Hardy Nickerson is too short and makes the plays after the dude has make his 1st down.Way to slow and I would also consider Dre Kirkpatrick.Dude was getting beat all game and that sucks.The reason I have said this is people want to know whats wrong with this defense. See above.

Now the offense,this line is okay but not great and they have to find some more top O-lineman to come in here and play lights out. The experiment with bobbi hart should be over.He is awlful and will get Dalton killed.I would sit him and play westerman.dude is a force and plays mean.   Our defensive corr.is a bust.He is not putting the right players out there.Sam Hubbard should be starting in place of M.Johnson. and wheres the guy we just brought in here from ohio state??? He should be starting in the rotation right frickin now.

(10-01-2018, 10:19 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: [ -> ]I dont think we could have asked more from the Bengals with their 3-1 start. Im pumped and excited but lets talk about some of the things that worry you or that you would like to see this team improve upon:

1. Im worried about the overall health of this team. Ross, Price, Eiffert, AJ, Gio. The list goes on. Its early in the season and this team is banged up.

2. The defense. Im not really sure why this defense is struggling so bad. They have a TON of talent. I think the defensive line is going to be fine, they have talent - we all know this. The linebackers are another story. Im not sold on Vigil and Brown. Burfict coming back will hopefully be a big lift. Also, the secondary has talent, but they are getting torched at times.

Basically, whats up with the defense? Is it a scheme thing, the way they play, or what? I feel like they have WAY too much talent on that side of the ball to be playing this bad.

Those are really the only two concerns I have moving forward.

I think the reasons you see offensives exploding is no one knows how to hit a QB anymore.

(10-01-2018, 05:54 PM)fortyyearfan Wrote: [ -> ]Here is what is wrong with our defense.Its called the defensive corr.He is a BUST.I WOULD replaced these three players NOW.Number one is Michael Johnson,the dude is just a body out there and gets beat every down.Number two is nick virgel.I know I misspelled his name.He gets beat a ton and makes the tackle after the fact.He is not a starter,just a backup.Number 3 Hardy Nickerson is too short and makes the plays after the dude has make his 1st down.Way to slow and I would also consider Dre Kirkpatrick.Dude was getting beat all game and that sucks.The reason I have said this is people want to know whats wrong with this defense. See above.

Now the offense,this line is okay but not great and they have to find some more top O-lineman to come in here and play lights out. The experiment with bobbi hart should be over.He is awlful and will get Dalton killed.I would sit him and play westerman.dude is a force and plays mean.   Our defensive corr.is a bust.He is not putting the right players out there.Sam Hubbard should be starting in place of M.Johnson. and wheres the guy we just brought in here from ohio state??? He should be starting in the rotation right frickin now.

Vigil has been solid but Nickerson is not getting it done.  Where is the 3rd rounder Jefferson?  I am not happy with backers in general but Vigil has improved.  I think the Bengals will draft another backer next year draft.  

(10-01-2018, 05:54 PM)fortyyearfan Wrote: [ -> ]Here is what is wrong with our defense.Its called the defensive corr.He is a BUST.I WOULD replaced these three players NOW.Number one is Michael Johnson,the dude is just a body out there and gets beat every down.Number two is nick virgel.I know I misspelled his name.He gets beat a ton and makes the tackle after the fact.He is not a starter,just a backup.Number 3 Hardy Nickerson is too short and makes the plays after the dude has make his 1st down.Way to slow and I would also consider Dre Kirkpatrick.Dude was getting beat all game and that sucks.The reason I have said this is people want to know whats wrong with this defense. See above.

Now the offense,this line is okay but not great and they have to find some more top O-lineman to come in here and play lights out. The experiment with bobbi hart should be over.He is awlful and will get Dalton killed.I would sit him and play westerman.dude is a force and plays mean.   Our defensive corr.is a bust.He is not putting the right players out there.Sam Hubbard should be starting in place of M.Johnson. and wheres the guy we just brought in here from ohio state??? He should be starting in the rotation right frickin now.

Thanks for helping us figure the problem out....

(10-01-2018, 04:19 PM)dnkw Wrote: [ -> ]How long do new schemes typically take to gel, Harley?

Good question. Let’s not only think about the new scheme, but everyone’s roll in it. Each player has to know what to do in certain situations. Take Jacksonville for instance, they are sharp on defense but there is a breakdown now and then. Then take into account that every offensive snap is meant to throw your defense off balance.

It’s unlikely Jacksonville would have given that many points to Atlanta yesterday. Yet, they have been playing a solid scheme for a few years now. They have veterans who are used to working with each other. Our guys get a pass because even though some are in their 2nd and 3rd year, well, we all know how much playing time rookies have received in the past. It’s gonna take a little time. How much? TBD.

We just got to rally behind these guys.

(10-01-2018, 06:15 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: [ -> ]I think the reasons you see offensives exploding is no one knows how to hit a QB anymore.

This has been a shock to all defenses. Doesn’t even seem like football.

I have concerns with the defense as well. My opinion is that Austin is too much a "players coach" which to me translates as soft.

The LBers will be instantly better with the return of 55.

This defense would be close to a top 10 defense if they would learn how to tackle. My dead grandmother could tackle better than 1/2 of these supposed pros...

Another by product of Marv's soft practices...

(10-01-2018, 01:09 PM)Wyche Wrote: [ -> ]One good thing.....the bye comes midseason this year.  I hate those early season byes.....good to get a break in the middle of the schedule to lick wounds.

The defense is concerning.....but they've held when they needed to.  That FG after the blocked punt was a HUGE stand.

Agreed on both points.

It seems like across the league these RPO offenses are tearing it up, but defenses will catch up and although they won't shut them down, when teams like ours keep rotating fresh bodies on the defensive line in the game while offensive linemen will be in there every down, every game and will begin to wear down.  

It is kind of like baseball:  Early on, it seems the pitchers have the upper hand, but the hitters always catch up. 

If there could be a bit more pressure out of the front four(it is coming), the secondary will benefit tremendously.  Right now, it seems like the secondary is being coached to not give up anything over the top, but some of the time they are so far off that when they "rally to tackle", they often miss.  Shawn Williams takes horrible angles in these cases.  

I would also like to see a few more corner and safety blitzes.  Dennard has shown to be a very solid pass rusher in very rare instances when given the opportunity.  

(10-01-2018, 04:02 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: [ -> ]Im kind of with you on this. I just feel like the middle of the field is always so open and the coverage is so soft. Im not sure if we are playing man or zone or what but there are guys that are just left wide open. There was a play on Sunday where Julio was literally line up with no one covering him, ran straight, and they threw him the ball for a 10 yard gain untouched. 

We've played more zone than not from what I saw. 

(10-01-2018, 08:39 PM)JSR18 Wrote: [ -> ] I have concerns with the defense as well. My opinion is that Austin is too much a "players coach" which to me translates as soft.

The LBers will be instantly better with the return of 55.

This defense would be close to a top 10 defense if they would learn how to tackle. My dead grandmother could tackle better than 1/2 of these supposed pros...

Another by product of Marv's soft practices...

It's the LBs more than anything. Last year they ranked 14th overall in missed tackle %, with best tacklers being Tez, Geno and Dennard. It's not good when a CB cracks top 3 for best tackler.

Like I said in the other thread, I'm not too down on the Defense as of yet due to the fact that we have played 4 teams and have had to face Flacco at home, Andrew Luck on the road, Cam Newton on the road, and Matt Ryan on the road. Those are 4 pretty outstanding quarterbacks to have to deal with, let alone on the road with 3 of them. It's not like we're playing Case Keenum. And we are 3-1. So that tells me the D is not as bad as it seemingly looks....(which is not good)

(10-02-2018, 08:27 AM)Sled21 Wrote: [ -> ]Like I said in the other thread, I'm not too down on the Defense as of yet due to the fact that we have played 4 teams and have had to face Flacco at home, Andrew Luck on the road, Cam Newton on the road, and Matt Ryan on the road. Those are 4 pretty outstanding quarterbacks to have to deal with, let alone on the road with 3 of them. It's not like we're playing Case Keenum. And we are 3-1. So that tells me the D is not as bad as it seemingly looks....(which is not good)

Lets see if we can lock up against Tannahil this week. 

(10-02-2018, 08:27 AM)Sled21 Wrote: [ -> ]Like I said in the other thread, I'm not too down on the Defense as of yet due to the fact that we have played 4 teams and have had to face Flacco at home, Andrew Luck on the road, Cam Newton on the road, and Matt Ryan on the road. Those are 4 pretty outstanding quarterbacks to have to deal with, let alone on the road with 3 of them. It's not like we're playing Case Keenum. And we are 3-1. So that tells me the D is not as bad as it seemingly looks....(which is not good)

Flacco and Newton are below average passers, Luck was having his first game back in almost two years.   They all shredded our defense and they are all weak run teams that shredded us as well.    We have been horrible.  End. Stop.