Cincinnati Bengals Message Board / Forums - Home of Jungle Noise

(03-23-2019, 04:36 PM)Au165 Wrote: [ -> ]Yea I’m thinking attitude alone I’d rather have Bush now.

I agree and maybe thethe Cincinnati Bengals can trade back a couple spots and get an extra third rounder

(03-23-2019, 02:56 PM)McC Wrote: [ -> ]TE's get hurt too much too spend that high a pick on one, especially with the number of quality TE's in this draft.  And a big fat no to Greedy Williams.  He will not be the first CB taken and I hope we don't take him and it seems unlikely we would.

Haskins won't get to 11.  Dillard seems to be strictly a LT.  Does he sit behind Glenn for a year or two?

I could get on board with Wilkins but isn't he a 3 tech?  Would he play next to Geno or for Geno?

Seems like we're looking for a guy to play right away and fill an existing hole and not take over later for someone we already have unless the pick is a transcendent talent.  Are any of the guys you mentioned one of those?

Not sure I would agree with your assessments at all so I would say virtually everyone of the guys I mentioned outside of a CB would be that guy you are talking about.

TE's get hurt too much? Can you please provide me the data showing that TEs are injured more often than any other position? I doubt you can so yes the TJ Hockenson selection stands. He is a rare talent and a hell of a weapon.

Dillard is strictly a LT? Why exactly is that? You do realize now more than ever you need to have a more athletic RT. You have several speed rushers like Von Miller coming on that side these days so the days of simply having a bulldozer RT are over. So nope do not see him strictly as a LT. Could he play LT? Absolutely. Could he get exposure to the pro game on the right side? Absolutely.

At 6'3" 315 I am not sure that you can slate him as only a 3 technique. Not to mention that you are in the Nickel in the NFL probably 70% of the time now. Clemson played him all along the line and I could see him doing the same thing at this level. However, spelling Geno or playing downs beside Geno either way are fine. Have no problem with liberally rotating interior line players to keep them fresh and explosive.

(03-23-2019, 08:47 PM)OSUfan Wrote: [ -> ]Not sure I would agree with your assessments at all so I would say virtually everyone of the guys I mentioned outside of a CB would be that guy you are talking about.

TE's get hurt too much? Can you please provide me the data showing that TEs are injured more often than any other position? I doubt you can so yes the TJ Hockenson selection stands. He is a rare talent and a hell of a weapon.

Dillard is strictly a LT? Why exactly is that? You do realize now more than ever you need to have a more athletic RT. You have several speed rushers like Von Miller coming on that side these days so the days of simply having a bulldozer RT are over. So nope do not see him strictly as a LT. Could he play LT? Absolutely. Could he get exposure to the pro game on the right side? Absolutely.

At 6'3" 315 I am not sure that you can slate him as only a 3 technique. Not to mention that you are in the Nickel in the NFL probably 70% of the time now. Clemson played him all along the line and I could see him doing the same thing at this level. However, spelling Geno or playing downs beside Geno either way are fine. Have no problem with liberally rotating interior line players to keep them fresh and explosive.

You don't know about TE's and injuries?  You ever hear of Tyler Eifert?  How about Gronk?  How many TE's did the Bengals alone put on IR last year?

It's the nature of the position.  They block bigger guys on the line and they play in the middle of the field and it often takes more than one guy or a lower leg shot to bring them down.  How can anyone watch football and not know that?  And in what round were the best TE's in the game drafted?  No need to spend a first on a guy who will top out at 50 catches and 500-600 yards.  Chances are very strong we can better use that pick.
 
So, almost undoubtedly no to a TE in the first.  Too many others available later.  The new HC and OC don't even feature the TE in their offense and have repeatedly said so.

I'd rather have a top notch Guard than a TE at 11.

I said I could get on board with Wilkins and just asked what the plan would be for him.  No argument there.

Dillard is a LT.  He does have athleticism but he lacks anchoring strength to play RT and is not a good run blocker, both of which are basic requirements for a RT.  Plus, I hear people say he has a tendency to lunge, is a waist bender and needs definite hand work.  Will he even be ready to play this year?

Can someone tell me which game to watch to see this monster of a LB that is a consensus top 15 selection? So far I have watched the Florida, Miami(Fla.), second half of Bama(he was out the first half because of targeting), and I am now watching the Georgia game which so far in the first half he is getting pushed around rather regularly by the TE and O line.

Nope did not see that guy in the Georgia game. What I did see was Holyfield run thru him several times.

(03-23-2019, 01:00 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: [ -> ]

Devin White: I'll be looking for $100 million in five years https://t.co/b3mRtzkIiR

— ProFootballTalk (@ProFootballTalk) March 23, 2019

“People know ‘Devin isn’t going to be on the board long, and we’re not going to find another Devin 10 years from now. He’s rare,’' White said, via Roy Lang of the Shreveport Times. “Draft me, because when I hit free agency in five years, the price will go up. I’ll be looking for $100 million then.”

“It just shows my competitive nature, my hard work,” White said. “I’m not trying to do what anybody else did. I’m trying to create a lane for myself. I want to go in the top five.”

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/03/22/devin-white-ill-be-looking-for-100-million-in-five-years/

Good.
I want a linebacker with this type of attitude. Someone who wants to be the best of the best.

Not sure why so many of you guys are upset that he wants to be good enough to earn $100 million

(03-24-2019, 03:35 PM)OSUfan Wrote: [ -> ]Nope did not see that guy in the Georgia game. What I did see was Holyfield run thru him several times.

White recorded 13 tackles and 1 fumble recovery against Georgia.
Holyfield also only had 7 carries.

Against that defense, Georgia scored only 16 points.
Their lowest amount of points since November 12, 2016.

(03-24-2019, 05:43 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: [ -> ]Good.
I want a linebacker with this type of attitude. Someone who wants to be the best of the best.

Not sure why so many of you guys are upset that he wants to be good enough to earn $100 million

There is a difference between saying you want to be the best and negotiating your second contract before you take an NFL snap.

(03-24-2019, 05:50 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: [ -> ]White recorded 13 tackles and 1 fumble recovery against Georgia.
Holyfield also only had 7 carries.

Against that defense, Georgia scored only 16 points.
Their lowest amount of points since November 12, 2016.

12 of those 13 were assisted tackles and honestly the stat guy was being very generous calling some of them assisted.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=j7x6v21BHOI

That is Devin White vs Georgia. He did not have a good game.

(03-24-2019, 05:50 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: [ -> ]White recorded 13 tackles and 1 fumble recovery against Georgia.
Holyfield also only had 7 carries.

Against that defense, Georgia scored only 16 points.
Their lowest amount of points since November 12, 2016.

Have you watched the game? Someone was being extremely generous with their stats. If Holyfield only had 7 carries then on probably 4 of those he ran thru the tackle of White.

You are talking about "that" defense. Yeah LSU had a pretty darn good defense. That is not the question at hand. The question at hand is where is this consensus top 15 selection in those games. I see you only mention the Georgia game.

I know you like the guy and that is fine he is a good athlete. Top 15 LB I am starting to question the more film I watch. Top 15 I am at least looking for at least a small amount or wow factor from a LB other than he is fast.

(03-24-2019, 05:50 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: [ -> ]White recorded 13 tackles and 1 fumble recovery against Georgia.
Holyfield also only had 7 carries.

Against that defense, Georgia scored only 16 points.
Their lowest amount of points since November 12, 2016.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sYaQyNKIW0

I encourage you to watch this film. I see a guy that may struggle at the next level. He does not show very good instincts and seems to be rather easily blocked out of a play and really struggles to get off of a block. I counted at least 5 missed tackles that he should have certainly had.

(03-24-2019, 07:53 PM)OSUfan Wrote: [ -> ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sYaQyNKIW0

I encourage you to watch this film. I see a guy that may struggle at the next level. He does not show very good instincts and seems to be rather easily blocked out of a play and really struggles to get off of a block. I counted at least 5 missed tackles that he should have certainly had.

Devin White:

Prospect rankings--

CBS--#5
Sporting News--#10
Daniel Jeremiah--#8
SI--#5
Draftwire--#5
Drafttek--#11

Suffice it to say, there are some who do not share your opinion of Devin White.

(03-24-2019, 05:43 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: [ -> ]Good.
I want a linebacker with this type of attitude. Someone who wants to be the best of the best.

Not sure why so many of you guys are upset that he wants to be good enough to earn $100 million

I don't have an issue with a guy wanting to earn a $100 mil contract.  I have an issue with a guy who has never taken an NFL snap declaring that he is worth $100 mil.  Get good enough, and the money will take care of itself.

For the Bengals, he loses value because we will never resign him if he is as advertised.  We'll have him 5-6 years and then he's gone to team with more cap room than sense.

(03-24-2019, 08:20 PM)Whatever Wrote: [ -> ]I don't have an issue with a guy wanting to earn a $100 mil contract.  I have an issue with a guy who has never taken an NFL snap declaring that he is worth $100 mil.  Get good enough, and the money will take care of itself.

For the Bengals, he loses value because we will never resign him if he is as advertised.  We'll have him 5-6 years and then he's gone to team with more cap room than sense.

He's a kid.  I don't know him personally, obviously, so I don't know who he really is, but he's what, 21, 22, something like that.  I don't know about you, but I said a whole lotta stupid shit when I was that age.  And that was without anyone ever holding a mic up to my stupid kid face.

(03-24-2019, 09:25 PM)McC Wrote: [ -> ]He's a kid.  I don't know him personally, obviously, so I don't know who he really is, but he's what, 21, 22, something like that.  I don't know about you, but I said a whole lotta stupid shit when I was that age.  And that was without anyone ever holding a mic up to my stupid kid face.

When I was in my early 20's, I knew when and where I could say stupid shit and when and where I needed to put my best foot forward.  99% of us did.  Otherwise we'd have all been talking the same way having dinner with our fiancee's parents as we did hanging out with our buddies.  

If he didn't have the warts he does in his game, then maybe you can overlook a bit of an ego.  However, he's not a clean prospect by any stretch, and this is just one more concern.  He isn't a finished product, and if he's this overconfident it's fair to wonder whether he will reach his potential.

(03-24-2019, 05:43 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: [ -> ]Good.
I want a linebacker with this type of attitude. Someone who wants to be the best of the best.

Not sure why so many of you guys are upset that he wants to be good enough to earn $100 million

You know A LOT of these guys are thinking it whether they say it or not.

re: As far as concerns with White, the only one I'd be a bit leery of is that he has freak athleticism numbers and that he may be moving up slightly in the draft because of this. That said, IF he's there at 11, I'm drafting him. Guys sometimes drop weight to get a faster 40 yard time, and I see he was 237 at the combine.

I don't really recall too many Top 15 MLB misses recently. I feel like LB is one of the 'safer' picks in the draft, if there is a safe pick.

As far as the $100 million contract comment, our defense really doesn't have that guy with swagger that makes the whole unit believe they can win. Maybe White can be that guy? Burfict had some of that swagger, but a lot of it came from dirty hits which isn't productive. IF White can come in and be a leader, that's great for us.

As far as the tape of him getting blocked and pushed around...you're not going to see LB's running clear many times.

IF he's not, then it gets a little tougher. Could go TE I suppose. OT might be a reach at our spot as the really good ones might be gone before we pick.

I do like DK Metcalf at WR, but he definitely has some risk.

I REALLY like Christian Wilkens at DT, but 11 is too high for him.

(03-24-2019, 08:17 PM)McC Wrote: [ -> ]Devin White:

Prospect rankings--

CBS--#5
Sporting News--#10
Daniel Jeremiah--#8
SI--#5
Draftwire--#5
Drafttek--#11

Suffice it to say, there are some who do not share your opinion of Devin White.

True, but the one BIG concern with White is his instincts and feel for the game.

(03-24-2019, 08:17 PM)McC Wrote: [ -> ]Devin White:

Prospect rankings--

CBS--#5
Sporting News--#10
Daniel Jeremiah--#8
SI--#5
Draftwire--#5
Drafttek--#11

Suffice it to say, there are some who do not share your opinion of Devin White.

Oh no doubt about it. Did you watch the video?

(03-25-2019, 04:30 PM)OSUfan Wrote: [ -> ]Oh no doubt about it. Did you watch the video?

No.  It's one game.  I'll take your word for it on what happened in that game. 

I'm just saying people who know a lot more about it than me seem to rate him highly and it must be for a reason.

If you ask me, the biggest issue on our entire team last year was LB.  One of the Devins would go a long way toward fixing that.  I can't bear the thought of seeing that mess for another season.  I'm hoping we have a HC now who does not believe he can play any ol' bum at LB and knows he needs to do something about it.

(03-24-2019, 06:42 PM)Synric Wrote: [ -> ]There is a difference between saying you want to be the best and negotiating your second contract before you take an NFL snap.


12 of those 13 were assisted tackles and honestly the stat guy was being very generous calling some of them assisted.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=j7x6v21BHOI

That is Devin White vs Georgia. He did not have a good game.

Nothing wrong with saying you want to earn $100 million and betting on yourself.

00:32 he squeezes through the trenches to apply pressure to the quarterback
00:49 he disrupts the middle of the offensive line
1:06 he waits too long, allows block to come to him
1:16 he does the same thing, allowing the block to come to him
2:22 he waits for the running back, but decides to apply pressure and rushes the quarterback
2:50 he blows up the block and comes close to sacking the quarterback, also hurries the throw
3:45 he continues to pursue the ballcarrier and brings him down
4:05 covers the receiver, not allowing a throwing lane and making the quarterback have to go away from his primary read
4:35 he reads the offense and knows exactly where the quarterback is going to throw it, running across the field to get there before the quarterback even throws
4:45 jumps instead of going after the quarterback, making him off balance
4:55 in coverage he takes away the quarterbacks read, making him panic
5:23 reads the lineman and reacts, tackling the ball carrier for a 2 yard gain
5:58 hesitates a bit, runs into his own teammate before engaging in blocker
6:10 pushes the blocker back towards the quarterback, making him throw sooner than he wanted
7:01 has the ball carrier in the backfield, sneaks his way there, but overpursues, missing a tackle for loss
7:15 has tight coverage, but never looks for the ball resulting in a completed pass
7:36 once realizing it's a flea-flicker, he reacts to go after the quarterback
8:07 doesn't disengage block, basically pushed into play
8:28 reads the offense and makes a stop on the 2-point coversion, outruns the running back
8:38 reads the offense, again, and moves into position to make the tackle at the line of scrimmage
9:03 can't get in on play due to blocker
9:41 applies pressure, gets a QB hit, and the ball is intercepted

Doesn't seem like a bad game at all. Sure, not amazing. But there's more to his play than stats

(03-24-2019, 07:41 PM)OSUfan Wrote: [ -> ]Have you watched the game? Someone was being extremely generous with their stats. If Holyfield only had 7 carries then on probably 4 of those he ran thru the tackle of White.

You are talking about "that" defense. Yeah LSU had a pretty darn good defense. That is not the question at hand. The question at hand is where is this consensus top 15 selection in those games. I see you only mention the Georgia game.

I know you like the guy and that is fine he is a good athlete. Top 15 LB I am starting to question the more film I watch. Top 15 I am at least looking for at least a small amount or wow factor from a LB other than he is fast.

I only mentioned the Georgia game because you did. Also look up and see what I wrote.
Reactionary. Fast. Great in coverage. Can read what the offense is going to do. Instinctual and can read-and-react quickly. He's easily a great player.

(03-24-2019, 07:53 PM)OSUfan Wrote: [ -> ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sYaQyNKIW0

I encourage you to watch this film. I see a guy that may struggle at the next level. He does not show very good instincts and seems to be rather easily blocked out of a play and really struggles to get off of a block. I counted at least 5 missed tackles that he should have certainly had.

Alright, let's do this again.

0:00 literally starts the game by getting off a block and making a tackle for a 1 yard gain
0:32 even though it's a dead call, White pursues to the ball quickly and found a lane to where the ball was in case it was a fumble
1:17 missed tackle, went too far outside, assist tackle but could have made a play sooner
1:34 makes a tackle to stop them on 3rd down on a 3rd and 1
1:40 goes through blocker to hit the running back behind the line of scrimmage on 4th down, creating a turnover on downs
2:53 disengages his blocker to make a tackle
2:58 while it's unsure if he was supposed to be a blitzer and someone was supposed to pick up the RB or if he had that player, it went for a positive play
3:09 does get pushed back by blocker, while also completely out of the play
3:18 reads the offense and plays zone, even while engaged in a block he is in the passing lane and almost gets a hand on the ball
3:25 engaged with a blocker and misses the tackle
4:20 runs to the sideline to make a tackle and doesn't get it
4:29 attacks the gap he's supposed to. Other linebackers didn't attack the hole
4:37 gets engaged and stays that way
6:34 doesn't allow blocker to engage and makes a tackle
7:00 gets through blockers and hits ball carrier well behind the line of scrimmage, but doesn't take him down. Other teammates finish the play
8:10 squeezes through blockers to hit the ball carrier at the line of scrimmage, then another player basically tackles White, but running back is still taken down
8:20 doesn't engage with blockers, squeezes through and applies pressure to the quarterback quickly
8:40 gets past his block and literally gets held so he doesn't sack the quarterback
8:52 waited too long for the play to come to him, blockers came aking him out of the play
9:10 shoots after the quarterback and gets tackled by a offensive lineman just so he doesn't get to the quarterback