Cincinnati Bengals Message Board / Forums - Home of Jungle Noise

(12-24-2019, 05:39 PM)fredtoast Wrote: [ -> ]No coincidence that he never won anything without Belichick as his DC.

Are you insinuating that Belichick learned how to "cheat" from Parcells??

(12-24-2019, 05:39 PM)fredtoast Wrote: [ -> ]No coincidence that he never won anything without Belichick as his DC.

How does that make him a bad coach?

(12-24-2019, 04:38 PM)J24 Wrote: [ -> ]Worst case is he becomes a bust.

I sincerely hope some fan base has to watch a bust QB with HURTS on his nameplate. 

Antiquated way of thinking.

It’s already been pointed out the best QB’s in the league right now (Mahomes, Jackson, Watson) didn’t meet that criteria.

(12-24-2019, 01:00 PM)spazz70 Wrote: [ -> ]Bill Parcells has 7 rules for drafting a (IHO) a top college QB.....They are as follows......

Be a three-year starter
Be a senior in college
Graduate from college
Start 30 games
Win 23 games
Post a 2:1 touchdown-to-interception ratio
Compete at least 60-percent of passes thrown

Burrow has 5 of the 7 though the last 2 he only did for one year so I am not sure how they count that one but we will give him 5

Tua if he comes out this year will have 5, not a Sr. and graduate

Herbert would fit the bill for all 7 categories ( I am assuming he is graduating?)

Love gets 5 of 7...no graduation, not a Sr.


I personally see an upside to trading that number one pick and getting as many picks as possible for this draft...I like Burrow but I am just not sold on him being THE GUY after just one year....Tua is a huge ???? and may even go back to BAMA.....Herbert may be the guy, meets all the criteria and would be a top 10 draftee, just not #1.......Love is the flyer, maybe as late as 3-4th round.....There are others to consider, Fromm, Eason, Newman, Mond and so on.

I would not be unhappy if we trade the pick....To Miami (No 5, 24 and 37, trade value is correct for this)...Draft Herbert at 5....fill OL and LBer spots with the other 1st and 2-2nd round picks....This team needs a lot of help and players....If they live by the draft and not Free Agency and this team wants to turn it over then it needs to be done....The only threat I see to this is the Raiders, they want a QB and have stated they want to move up and they have the capital with 2 1st rounders.  

I would like to see the Bengals turn some heads on draft day or prior...Make some moves....Worse case scenario is you get the picks, draft some solid OL and LBer and get your QB in the 2nd or 3rd round to sit behind Dalton for one more year.  There are lots of possibilities with this pick and I am just throwing out something to talk about.

Merry Christmas!!

I'd say these days this list would favor some guys who played at small schools/easy conferences and had reasonably good players around them. 

Every year there's a handful of players in the draft you go "from where?" You Google them and they look good on paper. But you don't hear a lot about them after.

And yeah, there's always exceptions. 

I do not understand why some fans are overthinking the pick for the Bengals. It is quite clear what the Bengals will do; that is draft Burrow.

Do not try to fix the Bengals in a year. More draft picks over 2-3 years works. Not sure the front office is competent with those picks. If Burrow is the pick, they need to build a team around him.

Burrow has set records against the best competition in college. He isn't from a small school like Klingler nor are his stats skewed because of short screen passes. He was good his junior year and amazing his senior year. He is a leader with fire in his belly, a chip on his shoulder. He makes difficult passes in small windows and his arm strength, while not elite is a plus. Burrow has a high football IQ and has picked apart defenses in the SEC.

There are so many holes on this team yet the team lost 8 games by one score. You have to start the rebuild somewhere, why not at the most important position on the team at QB?

Just relax and welcome Burrow to the Bengals.

(12-24-2019, 08:01 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: [ -> ]Antiquated way of thinking.

It’s already been pointed out the best QB’s in the league right now (Mahomes, Jackson, Watson) didn’t meet that criteria.

Although he may be on the decline, the best QB in the league resides in NE. The rings do the talking in this league. 

For the record, I do want the kid to succeed! I've followed him since he came out of HS. You know what thread that I'm referring to.

Contrary to what Bonnie presumes, the vast majority of Bucks fans love the kid and have followed his success with pride. Many of us have watched him on a weekly, especially those of us that live less than four hours away from NO. We know his journey.
We also know his weaknesses, but he has worked hard at trying to overcome them.

I love Bill, but that philosophy is somewhat antiquated.

(12-25-2019, 04:07 AM)coachmcneil71 Wrote: [ -> ]Although he may be on the decline, the best QB in the league resides in NE. The rings do the talking in this league. 

For the record, I do want the kid to succeed! I've followed him since he came out of HS. You know what thread that I'm referring to.

Contrary to what Bonnie presumes, the vast majority of Bucks fans love the kid and have followed his success with pride. Many of us have watched him on a weekly, especially those of us that live less than four hours away from NO. We know his journey.
We also know his weaknesses, but he has worked hard at trying to overcome them.

I love Bill, but that philosophy is somewhat antiquated.

No he doesn’t. He’s the GOAT when looking at his overall body of work, but he’s not even been close to one of the best QB’s this year.

3836 yds 22 TD 7 INT 88.0 PR


Do you also think Larry Fitzgerald is currently the best WR in the league?

(12-24-2019, 01:00 PM)spazz70 Wrote: [ -> ]Bill Parcells has 7 rules for drafting a (IHO) a top college QB.....They are as follows......

Be a three-year starter
Be a senior in college
Graduate from college
Start 30 games
Win 23 games
Post a 2:1 touchdown-to-interception ratio
Compete at least 60-percent of passes thrown

Burrow has 5 of the 7 though the last 2 he only did for one year so I am not sure how they count that one but we will give him 5

Tua if he comes out this year will have 5, not a Sr. and graduate

Herbert would fit the bill for all 7 categories ( I am assuming he is graduating?)

Love gets 5 of 7...no graduation, not a Sr.


I personally see an upside to trading that number one pick and getting as many picks as possible for this draft...I like Burrow but I am just not sold on him being THE GUY after just one year....Tua is a huge ???? and may even go back to BAMA.....Herbert may be the guy, meets all the criteria and would be a top 10 draftee, just not #1.......Love is the flyer, maybe as late as 3-4th round.....There are others to consider, Fromm, Eason, Newman, Mond and so on.

I would not be unhappy if we trade the pick....To Miami (No 5, 24 and 37, trade value is correct for this)...Draft Herbert at 5....fill OL and LBer spots with the other 1st and 2-2nd round picks....This team needs a lot of help and players....If they live by the draft and not Free Agency and this team wants to turn it over then it needs to be done....The only threat I see to this is the Raiders, they want a QB and have stated they want to move up and they have the capital with 2 1st rounders.  

I would like to see the Bengals turn some heads on draft day or prior...Make some moves....Worse case scenario is you get the picks, draft some solid OL and LBer and get your QB in the 2nd or 3rd round to sit behind Dalton for one more year.  There are lots of possibilities with this pick and I am just throwing out something to talk about.

Merry Christmas!!

Big Tuna's rules for a QB may be a little dated.

(12-24-2019, 02:01 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: [ -> ]I am a Burrow fan and will not be mad if we take him at 1. But we are 1-14 and could use a lot of help. So i am all about trading down. We could clean up if we did it right. Load up on picks this year and in the future. First pick on the 2nd day and first pick on the 3rd day are usually hot commodities as well. We should trade those too.

Interesting.

I rooted for my team to win last weekend and some single digit IQ moron said I "must be one dumb mother *****" because I agree with you, trade down early and often. His argument was that "He wants to win" which is why he wanted the Bengals to . . . lose? I'm of the belief that people thinking a rookie QB is the answer to this mess are clueless about the history of this team. Klingler and Akili Smith took over crap teams and were never close to the QBs that they were in college. Palmer had his moments over a couple of seasons but was never the same after the injuries piled up.


People claiming Watson and Mahomes as examples of young 1st round QBs playing well, tend to leave out that they went to established good teams that traded up, not shit storms like Cincinnati. With all of the pressures that come with being the #1 overall pick, Baker Mayfield is starting to feel that, this is not the team to be drafting a QB early in the first round. They need to build up that roster first. Like Chicago, Cincinnati is a QB killer. Draft Burrow next year and you'll be drafting his replacement in 4-5 years.

(12-24-2019, 04:38 PM)J24 Wrote: [ -> ]Worst case is he becomes a bust.

Yeah well we're good at that with number ones, see Price, Ross, Obuehi (sp.), the list goes on.  I'd rather take my chances with a game changing position than to let it go.  Take Burrow and hope for the best.

(12-25-2019, 11:20 AM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: [ -> ]Interesting.

I rooted for my team to win last weekend and some single digit IQ moron said I "must be one dumb mother *****" because I agree with you, trade down early and often. His argument was that "He wants to win" which is why he wanted the Bengals to . . . lose? I'm of the belief that people thinking a rookie QB is the answer to this mess are clueless about the history of this team. Klingler and Akili Smith took over crap teams and were never close to the QBs that they were in college. Palmer had his moments over a couple of seasons but was never the same after the injuries piled up.


People claiming Watson and Mahomes as examples of young 1st round QBs playing well, tend to leave out that they went to established good teams that traded up, not shit storms like Cincinnati. With all of the pressures that come with being the #1 overall pick, Baker Mayfield is starting to feel that, this is not the team to be drafting a QB early in the first round. They need to build up that roster first. Like Chicago, Cincinnati is a QB killer. Draft Burrow next year and you'll be drafting his replacement in 4-5 years.

My thoughts exactly.

The Bengals currently have a handful of starters who would be starters on playoff-caliber teams ... Mixon, AJ, Boyd, Geno and maybe Dunlop all come to mind. The rest of our starters would be backups on playoff-caliber teams. 

So we need 17 starters. Trading the #1 pick for a 1st, 2nd and 3rd round pick will get us closer.

If we draft Burrow and he can play 16 games next season, that alone is a win with this org's history.

(12-25-2019, 04:24 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: [ -> ]No he doesn’t. He’s the GOAT when looking at his overall body of work, but he’s not even been close to one of the best QB’s this year.

3836 yds 22 TD 7 INT 88.0 PR


Do you also think  Larry Fitzgerald is currently the best WR in the league?

Merry Christmas! What QB won the last SB? What QB has a great opportunity to win it again this year? He IS the GOAT, and the king is not yet dethroned.

Once again, I will reiterate, rings are all that matters. There is nothing that young can bring that changes who the best QB in the league is. This one's bulletproof bud.

Super Bowl rings are you listening, the rest of the stats aren't worth pissin.
A beautiful sight, in New England tonight. 
Walking around with multiple Championship rings!

Chicago would be an excellent place for a good young QB. Top 10 defense, decent line, multiple RB and WR’s, decent when healthy TE. The problem is Chicago screwed themselves drafting Trubisky over Mahomes and Watson. Draft either of those two and they likely play in the Super Bowl last year. Trubisky is a bust, period.

(12-25-2019, 02:17 PM)coachmcneil71 Wrote: [ -> ]Merry Christmas! What QB won the last SB? What QB has a great opportunity to win it again this year? He IS the GOAT, and the king is not yet dethroned.

Once again, I will reiterate, rings are all that matters. There is nothing that young can bring that changes who the best QB in the league is. This one's bulletproof bud.

Super Bowl rings are you listening, the rest of the stats aren't worth pissin.
A beautiful sight, in New England tonight. 
Walking around with multiple Championship rings!

Rings are team awards. Tom plays on the perennial best team. His body of work ensues he’s Top 3 all-time at QB. That said, he’s in the decline phase, and is not Top 3 currently. It’s obvious that he has lost a few steps, and a few rpm on his fastball. We all know he’s still very good. That said, by your logic, Dilfer, Flacco, and Brad Johnson were the best in the league after they won a title. They were the reigning QB’s with a ring.

The fact that Herbert hits all 7 rules and has prospect upside but is still not in consideration for the #1 overall pick by your own admission (That and the fact that Ryan Finley also hit all 7 rules...) tells me that the rules are outdated and don't really serve a purpose.

Joe Burrow is a Heisman record breaking QB from a major conference known for great decisions, mobility in the pocket, absurd deep ball accuracy (as well as accuracy in general) with no real weaknesses outside of "not a cannon arm but good enough to succeed in the NFL."

I don't think overthinking this selection will do us any good. Burrow is the man to lead this team into the future. Let's go get it.

(12-24-2019, 01:00 PM)spazz70 Wrote: [ -> ]Bill Parcells has 7 rules for drafting a (IHO) a top college QB.....They are as follows......

Be a three-year starter
Be a senior in college
Graduate from college
Start 30 games
Win 23 games
Post a 2:1 touchdown-to-interception ratio
Compete at least 60-percent of passes thrown

Burrow has 5 of the 7 though the last 2 he only did for one year so I am not sure how they count that one but we will give him 5

Tua if he comes out this year will have 5, not a Sr. and graduate

Herbert would fit the bill for all 7 categories ( I am assuming he is graduating?)

Love gets 5 of 7...no graduation, not a Sr.


I personally see an upside to trading that number one pick and getting as many picks as possible for this draft...I like Burrow but I am just not sold on him being THE GUY after just one year....Tua is a huge ???? and may even go back to BAMA.....Herbert may be the guy, meets all the criteria and would be a top 10 draftee, just not #1.......Love is the flyer, maybe as late as 3-4th round.....There are others to consider, Fromm, Eason, Newman, Mond and so on.

I would not be unhappy if we trade the pick....To Miami (No 5, 24 and 37, trade value is correct for this)...Draft Herbert at 5....fill OL and LBer spots with the other 1st and 2-2nd round picks....This team needs a lot of help and players....If they live by the draft and not Free Agency and this team wants to turn it over then it needs to be done....The only threat I see to this is the Raiders, they want a QB and have stated they want to move up and they have the capital with 2 1st rounders.  

I would like to see the Bengals turn some heads on draft day or prior...Make some moves....Worse case scenario is you get the picks, draft some solid OL and LBer and get your QB in the 2nd or 3rd round to sit behind Dalton for one more year.  There are lots of possibilities with this pick and I am just throwing out something to talk about.

Merry Christmas!!

I got killed for suggesting this a number of times....And there is some truth that Miami would rather take what is left than give up all that draft equity.  

I think the TEAM would be better this way (immediately), but if the belief is Burrow has the intangibles to be the leader you need at the position and has all the skills needed to excel, they will be taking him and not risking losing out on him.

And FWIW, I think in today's game (even in college) if you are less than a 65% completion %, I might have doubts.  Herbert is right around that number.  For some reason, when I see him play I come away very unimpressed with his play, but then you look at his stats and say he isn't too bad.  I think that is a product of some plays that the ball are thrown 5 yards but goes for 50.  

The one thing that seems evident is that Herbert simply doesn't see the field as well as Burrow.  Although I like the idea of a big, strong QB in Herbert, he just doesn't seem to have the QB over athlete designation.  Reminds me a LOT of Josh Allen at Buffalo.  I like the kid's (Allen) effort and moxy, but he simply can't hit water if he fell out of a boat on downfield passes.  

If the Bengals were even to get 2nd round picks for, say, Atkins and Dunlap, I would be a lot more optimistic in their ability to draft another burner at WR, line help, and still get the QB.  Their $ savings could be used to get solid FA at LB and S.  That's probably our best bet.  I don't see any way they pass on Burrow.  

(12-24-2019, 02:01 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: [ -> ]I am a Burrow fan and will not be mad if we take him at 1. But we are 1-14 and could use a lot of help. So i am all about trading down. We could clean up if we did it right. Load up on picks this year and in the future. First pick on the 2nd day and first pick on the 3rd day are usually hot commodities as well. We should trade those too.

Indy has been an example twice with Luck and Manning. There are no guarantees that Burrow will be like either of them but he is well worth the risk. Using the 35 million you save by letting Dalton and Green walk you give the possibility of shortening the rebuild by years. 

(12-25-2019, 05:40 PM)t3r3e3 Wrote: [ -> ]Rings are team awards.  Tom plays on the perennial best team.  His body of work ensues he’s Top 3 all-time at QB.  That said, he’s in the decline phase, and is not Top 3 currently.  It’s obvious that he has lost a few steps, and a few rpm on his fastball.  We all know he’s still very good.  That said, by your logic, Dilfer, Flacco, and Brad Johnson  were the best in the league after they won a title.  They were the reigning QB’s with a ring.

Three examples out of fifty + Super Bowls only reinforces the argument. Burrow #1