Cincinnati Bengals Message Board / Forums - Home of Jungle Noise

I hope Carman and Volson both end up being good at guard. The O-line needs it as well as depth. Having them both play well would beneficial to the team as a whole.

(05-05-2022, 12:14 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: [ -> ]Good point on Cappa, as long as these tall Guards have bend and good technique they can be just fine.

Also helps that Burrow is 6'4".


Same here, really like both of these guys a lot as D'Ante came around before the injury much better than I thought as a Guard.

Wasn't expecting D'Ante to be that good at Guard that early. I thought he would be a future OT down the road but he was too 
raw to expect any good out of him for a year or two. He worked his butt off last year before Preseason and impressed me.

D'Ante once again has been working his ass off this Offseason already from the vid I saw.


Kind of goes that way when a guy has a season ending injury before the season starts...


Thinking the same, too bad. I liked Spain but that effort on the last play of the SB might of kept him from coming back here.

Even if he was injured there was no excuse to not at least get in front of AD.

FWIW, D'Ante Smith didn't have a season-ending injury last season before the season started.
He started last season inactive, then got hurt for about 12 games.
He played in Week 14 and Week 17.

(05-05-2022, 12:25 PM)ochocincos Wrote: [ -> ]FWIW, D'Ante Smith didn't have a season-ending injury last season before the season started.
He started last season inactive, then got hurt for about 12 games.
He played in Week 14 and Week 17.

Thanks Ocho, still, he was either Inactive or hurt. This puts a kibosh on any high hopes for a young player mid to late season.

Hope D'Ante stays healthy this year cause I think at the very least he can be quality depth at Guard or Tackle and be Active.

(05-05-2022, 12:19 PM)ochocincos Wrote: [ -> ]He may have been.
All I know is the Bengals haven't had a good pass blocking OL in about the last 5 years.
Pollack has been the OL coach for two of those years (2018, 2021).
Bengals are essentially having 4 new starting OL this year, all of which have been selected with Pollack as the head OL coach, so hopefully it pans out.
I definitely expect the run game to be better, as Karras is (far) better compared to Hopkins in the run game, Cappa is an upgrade over Adeniji, and Collins is an upgrade over Reiff/Prince.

Yes, Pollack is a better run blocking OL Coach than a pass blocking coach. You could tell when we brought in guys who were at
the time better pass blockers than run blockers and this switched. Reiff for example was a much better pass protector than a run
blocker when he came here but last year he was a decent run blocker for once when he was healthy.

(05-05-2022, 09:40 AM)ochocincos Wrote: [ -> ]The difference is Pollack wasn't the head OL coach when much of that DAL OL was acquired.
The only OL acquired out of that great group when Pollack was the head OL coach was Collins.

I'm not going to knock Pollack for talent acquisition in Dallas because he wasn't involved in scouting there.

I just find it mind blowing that we brought in 3 good-great starters in FA and have spent 7 picks in the last four drafts on OL and people still want to bring in more OL before the coaches get a look at the guys in OTA's.

(05-05-2022, 12:52 PM)Whatever Wrote: [ -> ]I'm not going to knock Pollack for talent acquisition in Dallas because he wasn't involved in scouting there.

I just find it mind blowing that we brought in 3 good-great starters in FA and have spent 7 picks in the last four drafts on OL and people still want to bring in more OL before the coaches get a look at the guys in OTA's.

I think it's because the fans didn't see Carman, Adeniji, or Prince play well, nor have they seen much of Smith or Hill, and it's also hard to have any confidence in a Day 3 draft pick making any sort of impact as a rookie.

(05-05-2022, 12:52 PM)Whatever Wrote: [ -> ]I'm not going to knock Pollack for talent acquisition in Dallas because he wasn't involved in scouting there.

I just find it mind blowing that we brought in 3 good-great starters in FA and have spent 7 picks in the last four drafts on OL and people still want to bring in more OL before the coaches get a look at the guys in OTA's.

Yes, they cannot say we have ignored the OL lately.

Speaking of Pollack with Dallas, La'el said he was his favorite OL coach he has ever had even if he was just an Assistant he made a
clear great impression on La'el Collins and he even said it was one of the main reasons he came here. This and Burrow of course.

(05-05-2022, 01:07 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: [ -> ]Yes, they cannot say we have ignored the OL lately.

Speaking of Pollack with Dallas, La'el said he was his favorite OL coach he has ever had even if he was just an Assistant he made a
clear great impression on La'el Collins and he even said it was one of the main reasons he came here. This and Burrow of course.

Pollack was not an assistant when Collins was signed as a UDFA, he was the head OL coach.

OL drafted while Pollack was assistant with DAL (2013-2014):
Frederick (Rd 1)
Zach Martin (Rd 1)

OL drafted was the head OL coach with DAL (2015-2017):
Chaz Green (bust)
Laurence Gibson (who?)
La'el Collins (UDFA but Rd 1 talent)

OL drafted with NYJ (2019-2020):
Chuma Edoga (who?)
Mekhi Becton (Rd 1)
Cameron Clark (who?)

OL drafted with CIN (2018, 2021-2022):
Price (bust)
Rod Taylor (did nothing, can't really call a bust if a late round pick I guess)
Carman
Smith
Hill
Volson

(05-05-2022, 04:08 PM)ochocincos Wrote: [ -> ]Pollack was not an assistant when Collins was signed as a UDFA, he was the head OL coach.

OL drafted while Pollack was assistant with DAL (2013-2014):
Frederick (Rd 1)
Zach Martin (Rd 1)

OL drafted was the head OL coach with DAL (2015-2017):
Chaz Green (bust)
Laurence Gibson (who?)
La'el Collins (UDFA but Rd 1 talent)

OL drafted with NYJ (2019-2020):
Chuma Edoga (who?)
Mekhi Becton (Rd 1)
Cameron Clark (who?)

OL drafted with CIN (2018, 2021-2022):
Price (bust)
Rod Taylor (did nothing, can't really call a bust if a late round pick I guess)
Carman
Smith
Hill
Volson

Man Ocho, good job on clearing some stuff up for me today lol

Looking forward to watching Collins and hopefully Colson on the line this season.

(05-05-2022, 01:05 PM)ochocincos Wrote: [ -> ]I think it's because the fans didn't see Carman, Adeniji, or Prince play well, nor have they seen much of Smith or Hill, and it's also hard to have any confidence in a Day 3 draft pick making any sort of impact as a rookie.

Personally, I think the staff wants to work with what they have during OTA's and then evaluate LG and depth based on that.  

(05-05-2022, 11:39 PM)Whatever Wrote: [ -> ]Personally, I think the staff wants to work with what they have during OTA's and then evaluate LG and depth based on that.  

The staff may want to, but that doesn't mean the fans will like that approach.
As such, complaining :)

So pollack developed a talented udfa into a top notch lineman. What a bum. Somehow, 32 teams missed at least 7 times on a first round level talent?

(05-05-2022, 12:52 PM)Whatever Wrote: [ -> ]I'm not going to knock Pollack for talent acquisition in Dallas because he wasn't involved in scouting there.

I just find it mind blowing that we brought in 3 good-great starters in FA and have spent 7 picks in the last four drafts on OL and people still want to bring in more OL before the coaches get a look at the guys in OTA's.

See my signature, it is more about how a coach/player can improve with experience and opportunity than anything else.

We as fans seem to forget not every player is great out of the gate regardless of their draft position. We tend to place unrealistic expaectations for their rookie or 2nd years.

But the great teams develop these players, they don't throw them under the bus and dismiss them. The coaches work hard with the player to improve their weaknesses and strengthen their strengths. 

Way too many examples of major improvement of NFL players from year 1 to year 2 or year 2 to year 3.

(05-06-2022, 11:24 AM)SladeX Wrote: [ -> ]So pollack developed a talented udfa into a top notch lineman. What a bum. Somehow, 32 teams missed at least 7 times on a first round level talent?

La'el Collins?
He was a 1st round talent but went UDFA due to off-field character concerns.
https://www.bucsnation.com/2015/5/16/8615065/why-did-no-one-draft-lael-collins-while-everyone-wanted-him-after-the

Quote:Seen as a top 15 pick before the 2015 NFL draft, his stock collapsed when police wanted to question him (not as a suspect) in connection with the murder of a pregnant ex-girlfriend. That and a threat of his agents that he'd hold out until next year if he was drafted after round three (which would be less lucrative than going undrafted, in his case) caused every team in the NFL to pass him up.

So he didn't really develop a UDFA-level talent.

(05-06-2022, 11:24 AM)SladeX Wrote: [ -> ]So pollack developed a talented udfa into a top notch lineman. What a bum. Somehow, 32 teams missed at least 7 times on a first round level talent?

Collins is a unique case. He was considered a first round pick but went undrafted after Louisiana State Police wanted to speak to him regarding the murder of a woman that he had previously been in a relationship with. His agents threatened that if he was drafted after the third round, he would sit the season out and re-enter the draft, so no one drafted him.

Here is a link to a mock draft from NFL.com that had him at #17 OA. Here is another that has him at #19 OA. A third at #29. He was a consensus first round talent with some off the field stuff that scared teams, and then he said don't bother. Here is an article that discusses his draft experience. 

TL;DR - He was a first round talent that had unique circumstances that caused him to fall. He wasn't a diamond in the rough or missed by all 32 teams in their evaluations. Most teams knew how talented he was.

Oh. Wow. Bizarre. All 32 teams behaved a bit irrationally.

Glad he’s with us now.

Will anxiously await our OL development.

(05-08-2022, 07:57 AM)SladeX Wrote: [ -> ]Oh. Wow. Bizarre. All 32 teams behaved a bit irrationally.

Glad he’s with us now.

Will anxiously await our OL development.

He actually didn’t want to be drafted later and was public about wanting to sign as a UDFA and negotiate a contract post draft.

(05-08-2022, 08:58 AM)Dr.Z Wrote: [ -> ]He actually didn’t want to be drafted later and was public about wanting to sign as a UDFA and negotiate a contract post draft.

Had too big of a head for a young man. He thought he was great and he was right, but he was wrong in the way he went about it.

It has cost him. But damn, to watch La'el block the best pass rushers in the league is downright fun. He dominates the best, just can
not stand him in a Dallas Cowboy jersey. Will be great seeing him in stripes.

We got the perfect RT for the Joe's.

(05-08-2022, 08:58 AM)Dr.Z Wrote: [ -> ]He actually didn’t want to be drafted later and was public about wanting to sign as a UDFA and negotiate a contract post draft.

Bad advice from J Maguire?