(03-16-2021, 12:22 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Good article but i don't believe that 11 of his sacks were considered "clean up". I watched each one on GamePass and, admittedly a liiiitle bit generouisly, gave him 6 1/2 legit sacks. Slightly less than half his total. 

I only had him at 4. I think Goodbery had him around 3.

(03-16-2021, 12:20 PM)C0de_M0nkey Wrote: We didn't throw money at anyone. We came into free agency with a plan to re-sign Lawson and went with the backup plan when that didn't work out. We would have overpayed either way.

Hendrickson outproduced Lawson's raw numbers last year using your own metrics. If you did an apples to apples comparison and took away Lawson's coverage sacks too the difference would be even more pronounced. 

And let's not pretend that Hubbard and Hendrickson are equivalent. Or that Lawson hasn't played with the best defensive linemen in franchise history for most of his career. Do you think Hubbard would have come second in NFL sacks if he played for New Orleans last year?

He had more sacks. That's it. 

As far as taking Lawson's coverage sacks away. When i said Hendrickson had 6 1/2 legit sacks where he got to the QB in 3 seconds or less, Lawson did it on 5 of his 5 1/2 sacks. Only his 1/2 sack was the result of an extended play. One other, against the Chargers, it took 3.5 seconds because as he got there, the QB started to take off and Lawson caught him after a couple steps. So that means Hendrickson had 6 1/2 sacks in 3 seconds and Lawson had 5 sacks in 3 seconds, while Lawson blew him out of the water on total pressures (64/49). 

We will see, this time next year, how equivalent Hubbard and Hendrickson are. I'm betting that they're pretty damn close. 

(03-16-2021, 12:20 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Mouth

Left Side: Pay no attention to that All Pro award it's not NFL official


Ride Side: Hey don't worry about the official sack stat look what PFF says about....

(03-16-2021, 12:59 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: He had more sacks. That's it. 

As far as taking Lawson's coverage sacks away. When i said Hendrickson had 6 1/2 legit sacks where he got to the QB in 3 seconds or less, Lawson did it on 5 of his 5 1/2 sacks. Only his 1/2 sack was the result of an extended play. One other, against the Chargers, it took 3.5 seconds because as he got there, the QB started to take off and Lawson caught him after a couple steps. So that means Hendrickson had 6 1/2 sacks in 3 seconds and Lawson had 5 sacks in 3 seconds, while Lawson blew him out of the water on total pressures (64/49). 

We will see, this time next year, how equivalent Hubbard and Hendrickson are. I'm betting that they're pretty damn close. 

Lawson had opportunities to get coverage sacks too. He just didn't have the motor. How many times did our piss poor line give the qb all day to pass without getting a coverage sack? Did Lawson take those plays off? Some of the coverage sacks Trey got in NO will translate to Cincinnati.

Lawson also blew him out in snaps played but let's say Trey is closer to Hubbard. We still saved $10 million. Carl Lawson is injury prone, hasn't produced numbers worth $15 million, and there's no guarantee that he will now that he has the money. You act like he's a surefire bet for DPOY. I'd rather have Trey and invest the $10 million elsewhere.  

(03-16-2021, 12:26 PM)Au165 Wrote: I only had him at 4. I think Goodbery had him around 3.

Ooops. I didn't realize that the GamePass vids didn't stop at 2020. Apparently i watched a couple games into 2019.

I went back and, using the 3 second rule, gave him sacks against Car in wk17, 2 against KC in wk15, Atl in wk11 and LAC in wk5. 

So, that's 5 i would give him at 3 seconds or less. 

EDIT: I'm probably being a bit more generous than you guys.

This All Pro plays like JJ Watt. 6'4" and 270 lbs. 13.5 sacks. Take a look at his google images of #91. This replaces Dunlap. Do you think the Bengals could use a 26 year old JJ Watt type All Pro Defensive End. They must think so, they are paying him 15 mil to the tune of 60 mil over 4 years. ....This guy with Saints gets in other teams backfields ruining their plays, and can get after any QB. He has had some of his best All Pro Games in Prime Time against Super Bowl Teams. He is a high motor gamer that gets after it every play. The NFL didn't make him ALL PRO for nothing.

Bengals then went after Steelers CB, but looks like they landed Cowboys CB. With WJ3 a free agent, Bengals landed a CB. So Bengals add an ALL PRO DE and a quality CB, both around 26 years old, not ready to retire guys. DEFENSE THE MAIN FOCUS of Bengals at start of Free Agency. If you play AFC NORTH Football of tough Defenses, you better show up with a tough Defense, or you will finish in last place as Bengals have been doing. Steelers and Ravens don't give up many points and Browns may be rising to that level. So these AFC North Games are DEFENSIVE WARS, so you better pack a lunch and bring some Defense also.

How’s his run stop ability compared to Lawson?

(03-16-2021, 01:43 PM)Rubekahn29 Wrote: How’s his run stop ability compared to Lawson?

He is ALL PRO and Lawson isn't.....Face it, Last Place Bengals just leveled up.  Mike Brown would not shell out 60 mil if they questioned his run stop ability. This guy plays like a JJ Watt, which Bengals are in dire need of.

Go on Wikipedia, Go on Images of him, go on video of him playing, look again at 26 year old ALL PRO Honors....a smile will come across Bengal Fan faces use to frowning. Number 91 is a Monster. Good News for us, Bad News for opponents.

(03-16-2021, 08:18 AM)Sled21 Wrote: https://www.bengals.com/news/reports-bengals-bag-13-5-sacker-hendrickson.

I am really happy with this signing, really helps the pass rush. Wanted this guy all along. Now bring in some OL and a 3-tech.

(03-16-2021, 01:56 PM)kevin Wrote: He is ALL PRO and Lawson isn't.....Face it, Last Place Bengals just leveled up.  Mike Brown would not shell out 60 mil if they questioned his run stop ability.  This guy plays like a JJ Watt, which Bengals are in dire need of.

Go on Wikipedia, Go on Images of him, go on video of him playing, look again at 26 year old ALL PRO Honors....a smile will come across Bengal Fan faces use to frowning. Number 91 is a Monster. Good News for us, Bad News for opponents.

Is he replacing Lawson? or Dunlap?

PRobly both can he do that?

(03-16-2021, 02:32 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: Is he replacing Lawson? or Dunlap?

PRobly both can he do that?

If he is replacing Dunlap only, it's a good move.

(03-16-2021, 01:38 PM)kevin Wrote: This All Pro plays like JJ Watt.   

Put the crack pipe away, Kevin.

New #Bengals addition Trey Hendrickson has improved his @PFF grade every season, resulting in a career-high 70.9 grade in 2020.

Hendrickson has also improved his pass rushing productivity since entering the league. Here’s his PRP by year:

2017: 5.5
2018: 6.8
2019: 6.7
2020: 9.2

— PFF CIN Bengals (@PFF_Bengals) March 16, 2021

 

(03-16-2021, 02:39 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Put the crack pipe away, Kevin.

You will see. You could look at tape of him. He is not ALL PRO for nothing.  You will see. This is a high motor game changer like a JJ Watt type and why Bengals known for cheapness just shelled out the mega bucks for him.  Don't just look at sacks. look at fumbles he causes.  Look at how he starred in Prime Time against Super Bowl Tampa and Kansas City.  Throw out stats and just watch video of the monster getting after offenses.  I know Negativity is the food of choice in Bengal Land, but nothing negative about landing an ALL PRO Defensive End only 26 years old, 6'4" and 270 lbs. 

He fits. Keep loading the shopping cart.

(03-16-2021, 02:50 PM)kevin Wrote: You will see. You could look at tape of him. He is not ALL PRO for nothing.  You will see. This is a high motor game changer like a JJ Watt type and why Bengals known for cheapness just shelled out the mega bucks for him.  Don't just look at sacks. look at fumbles he causes.  Look at how he starred in Prime Time against Super Bowl Tampa and Kansas City.  Throw out stats and just watch video of the monster getting after offenses.  I know Negativity is the food of choice in Bengal Land, but nothing negative about landing an ALL PRO Defensive End only 26 years old, 6'4" and 270 lbs. 

(03-16-2021, 02:59 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote:

He outplayed JJ Watt last year, as much as I usually disagree with Kevin, he isn't wrong here. 

Made me laugh though lol

(03-16-2021, 02:32 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: Is he replacing Lawson? or Dunlap?

Depends:

Is he hurt or whining? 

(03-16-2021, 02:32 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: Is he replacing Lawson? or Dunlap?

PRobly both can he do that?

Lawson, he is a Left End. Comes off the QB's blindside. Need to add another End like Boogie Basham in the 2nd round to replace 
Dunlap. Hubbard I bet works his ass off this Offseason too with his pass rush like he did with his run stopping game last Offseason.

(03-16-2021, 11:27 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: You can't...well you can, but it's stupid...stick your head in the sand and say OhHhH, 13.5 SaCkS!!!!11!!! SouperBowlzzzzz.

6 1/2 of his sacks last year were a result of him beating his man and getting to the QB in 3 seconds or less. 7 of his sacks were a result of coverage or another player(s) washing the QB to him and him cleaning it up. A couple of his sacks, it took so long that Brad could have rolled out of the stands and chased the QB down for sack himself. 

If a team is going to shell out 60M for a player, you damn well better believe that i want them to do their homework and see if the guy is truly worth that money. It looks like another Bengals 'let's wait and see' with the typical outcome of disappointment, that should and could have been avoided. 

Would you rather shell out the kind of money Lawson got and then bet on him being able to stay healthy?