Why do people keep screaming freedom and rights when talking about something other than the government? If government employees start tackling people and shooting them with the shot and throwing people in prison, that is a discussion on rights.

A private company can do a whole lot to keep their company running the way they want it. You have the Constitution, but want to carry a gun to work? Nope, 2nd Amendment doesn't apply. Want to go into the break room and say the boss is an idiot and not get fired? 1st Amendment doesn't apply.

Employers have their rights and freedoms, too. Yet you just say they have to take whatever any employee does or does not do, when it can have a major impact on their company/product? That's that false sense of entitlement that the whole world must bend to conform to YOUR sense of rights and freedoms, when it is not their responsibility to do so. Your sense of right and wrong for you has a cost. Do it or don't, but do not think everyone has to suck it up.

(07-22-2021, 07:53 PM)jason Wrote: You're wasting your breath... Everyone is their own expert these days, and there's no use trying to reason with someone so dug in. It's best to let the experts whine about their rights and freedoms and whatever else they're babbling about... I personally stopped paying attention to them long ago.

I don't think the NFL cares about safety as much as they care about money, and they're not going to lose money over games bring cancelled because of a completely avoidable outbreak

In theory this enforcementshould work but the reality is we are over testing and what will happen vaccinated  players will test positive and probably cause games to be cancelled anyway. They need to fix how and who they test.

(07-23-2021, 12:11 AM)SuperBowlBound! Wrote: I have had Covid so I feel getting the vaccine shot is a risk I do not need to take. In fact Science is proving the antibodies from having Covid is just as strong or stronger than the shot. 

That's not really a solution for people who rely on herd immunity unless the government is literally going to round up everyone who doesn't want to get vaccinated and expose them to the virus.

(07-23-2021, 09:04 AM)Essex Johnson Wrote: In theory this enforcementshould work but the reality is we are over testing and what will happen vaccinated  players will test positive and probably cause games to be cancelled anyway. They need to fix how and who they test.

How many false positives forced games to be cancelled or rescheduled last season in the NFL?

(07-23-2021, 09:39 AM)Whatever Wrote: That's not really a solution for people who rely on herd immunity unless the government is literally going to round up everyone who doesn't want to get vaccinated and expose them to the virus.

We will never achieve herd immunity and “get back to normal” with a 50-60% vaccination rate nationally.

(07-23-2021, 09:51 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: We will never achieve herd immunity and “get back to normal” with a 50-60% vaccination rate nationally.

There will likely never be herd immunity. We don't have herd immunity for colds and flus 

Not sure I expect one for this 

(07-23-2021, 08:09 AM)Goalpost Wrote: Sounds like some players aren't happy about this.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/31864185/deandre-hopkins-players-react-nfl-vaccine-memo-questions-future-nfl

Players were unhappy when the NFL took away their freedom to play with single bar facemasks, too.  Ain't nothing new. 

(07-23-2021, 10:35 AM)Big_Ern Wrote: There will likely never be herd immunity. We don't have herd immunity for colds and flus 

Not sure I expect one for this 

I agree with you.   I think that long term, Covid is going to be another seasonal virus.   Also, in terms of herd immunity, I think that the vaccine only plays into part of the story.   There are folks out there that have anti-bodies due to already having Covid.   It doesn't make sense to me that your body could make anti-bodies that are effective via a vaccine but aren't effective if you have already had the virus.   I understand there may be differences due to various strains but to fully discount it the way it has been - to me - doesn't make sense and is missing a part of this.    I'd be curious as to how many of the variant D deaths among the unvaccinated population had already had Covid in the past.   Don't know if that stat exists or not, but it would be interesting to see.  

(07-23-2021, 08:54 AM)Destro Wrote: Why do people keep screaming freedom and rights when talking about something other than the government? If government employees start tackling people and shooting them with the shot and throwing people in prison, that is a discussion on rights.

A private company can do a whole lot to keep their company running the way they want it. You have the Constitution, but want to carry a gun to work? Nope, 2nd Amendment doesn't apply. Want to go into the break room and say the boss is an idiot and not get fired? 1st Amendment doesn't apply.

Employers have their rights and freedoms, too. Yet you just say they have to take whatever any employee does or does not do, when it can have a major impact on their company/product? That's that false sense of entitlement that the whole world must bend to conform to YOUR sense of rights and freedoms, when it is not their responsibility to do so. Your sense of right and wrong for you has a cost. Do it or don't, but do not think everyone has to suck it up.

That reminds me of when I worked event security and people would insist they had the right to carry knives into stadium because the city ordinance said knives of X amount of inches were permissible and theyd accuse me of not knowing the laws.  I'd have to explain that this is private property and the team/venue had the rights to set their own rules and so on and so forth. 

So, the real question is.. how many players will "retire" to avoid getting vaxxed.

(07-22-2021, 03:18 PM)George Cantstandya Wrote: From what I have read about this:

"This rule on forfeits applies only to cancellations due to an outbreak among non-vaccinated players and/or staff. In the same memo, the league explains that it, “if a club cannot play due to a Covid spike in vaccinated individuals, we will attempt to minimize the competitive and economic burden on both participating teams.” In other words, there won’t be a forfeit if a game is scrapped due to vaccinated players testing positive."

I guess its a crap shoot then, considering that a lot of vaccinated people are still getting covid, and I read on NYT that officials from Israel are reporting that a lot of people who have had the pfizer vaccine are getting Covid Delta, making it look at this point like the pfizer vaccine isnt very effective against the new strain. So do they punish players who had the pfizer vaccine if it turns out its not very effective against Covid Delta? Or are those players/teams safe from punishment? 

It just seems like there are still too many unknowns to start making rules and punishments over this whole thing. And we are still talking about a virus that has a higher survival rate % than the vaccine effectiveness % at this point in time.

(07-23-2021, 10:35 AM)Big_Ern Wrote: There will likely never be herd immunity. We don't have herd immunity for colds and flus 

Not sure I expect one for this 

From the industrial revolution to the AI/technology revolution. You'll be experiencing the AI/technology revolution for the coming years.
Expect the NFL to be very, very, different in 5 yrs from now.

Some of these player tweeting, and some posters here, just don't get it. No one has a right to play in the NFL. If you want to play in a league, you have to play by the league's rules. Remember Burfict? He couldn't seem to play within the rules, so he's gone. The courts have already said employers can mandate vaccines for their employees. If the employee doesn't want to take it, they are free to find another job. It's really that simple. Just because they can't take their sub par educations and make millions elsewhere has nothing to do with it. Now if the Govt. was saying you have to get it or else, then I have a problem. If an employer says you have to get it, or suffer the consequences if you bring it into the locker room and spread it to your teammates, I have no problem with it at all. Don't want it, opt out. They will still make more than 99% of the country with their opt out salary.

(07-23-2021, 10:35 AM)Big_Ern Wrote: There will likely never be herd immunity. We don't have herd immunity for colds and flus 

Not sure I expect one for this 

There are more than 200 viruses that cause colds. Would you take over 200 vaccinations to prevent a cold? And by the time you completed the series of 200 shots at least one virus would probably mutate rending the vaccine ineffective or less effective.

The flu virus mutates annually.

That’s why herd immunity won’t be achieved for those conditions.

Now when was the last time you saw someone with polio?

(07-23-2021, 01:45 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: There have been over 600K deaths in the US due to Covid and 303K occurred after the start of the vaccine rollout.  Less than 6K were among the fully vaccinated. Of the 18K Covid deaths in May 2021 only 150 were fully vaccinated. Texas has reported 9K Covid deaths since February. Only 43 were fully vaccinated. Since January in Virginia 99.4% of Covid cases were in the unvaccinated; 2,447 unvaccinated people died compared to 18 deaths in fully vaccinated people. Between January and June of this year 7,091 unvaccinated people died of Covid in Georgia compared to 14 fully vaccinated people. 99.4% of Georgians hospitalized for Covid during the same period were not fully vaccinated.

Some of you act as if you’ve never heard of mandatory school vaccines. Are kids having their rights stripped because they have to get a tetanus shot?

I work on covid floors and Emergency room where they arrive at hospital and am well aware of how bad it is and how the numbers are padded to get that payday as well. 
My mother who has a history of heart problems went to her heart Dr with chest pains and tiredness and was told to go immediately to the ER but not to drive per a heart attack may be imminent but no covid was suspected. I  helped her in vehicle and took her to the door of hospital and then parked my vehicle. Came in about 10 minutes later and was told she had "covid symptoms" per saying she was short of breath and was listed as covid patient. Nobody was allowed to be with her because of this diagnosis even. This person will no longer look me in the eye at work and looks to the floor when passing. She ultimately had a blockage of main artery as suspected and it was cleared and stint added. Not before she was listed as a covid patient though. Money, money, money !

Do not believe these positives with no symptoms either. One person in my household of 3 was diagnosed with covid and we figured all 3 would have contracted since we were told to lockdown with her and expected it. Yet nobody contracted this while breathing same air and sharing bathroom. 

Should be noted that patients have been in isolation with deadly airborne diseases for as long as Ive worked at hospital and we've never come close to being overwhelmed and pneumonia deaths just strangely disappeared for a long time.

They do not mandate vaccines to those who treat the dying covid patients and in fact for the first two months we were denied masks per a shortage while there wasn't even a vaccine close to being available and very few people contracted this most contagious disease in world history whilst being directly exposed until they were put in isolation and then masks could be worn while entering the room. 

If it was so bad as you claim every grocery store clerk would have died long ago per the first thing everybody did was rush to the grocery store before lockdown and they were exposed to everybody during its peak when no masks or vaccines were available. Then everybody had to go back daily because of the toilet paper shortage.

It's a sad death to those who do pass from this horrid disease and know coworkers and friends who did die. But the #'s are far from being legit like you claim. As stated before I know Dr's who highly recommend and others that refuse to get it. 

Believe what you read and I will trust my eyes and experiences. 

But the NFL can definitely tell players they must or not play, its their business and players are free to walk away if not liking. I disagree but it is what it is and would expect anybody with a view like yourself to want all fans in attendance to show their vaccination card before entering too. 

Disagree with this stance though yet all are welcome to combat covid however they choose by becoming a recluse or whatever they think is best for them and their families. 

I shall choose to live my life and am still on fence about next vaccine. Will cross that bridge when it arrives per things can change quickly in between now and then. But as of now I do not see with my own eyes what is being claimed at all. Only thing that has changed is many people are being paid to stay home or are scared and quit. Only forcing the rest of us to be severely overworked during the last year and yet still few are contracting while being so stressed out and beat down from so many hours worked and around the most severe cases daily.   

P.S. NFL players are not school kids. Yet not telling anybody what they should choose to do in this matter. because as I stated I am vaccinated and still on fence about another. But never going to shame anyone who chooses not too per the masses are still walking amongst us and the amount of deaths is virtually the same as previous years before it hit.  

BREAKING NEWS

Vince McMahon has just trademarked NVL which stands for the No Vaccine League. Things are going to get interesting.

(07-23-2021, 12:22 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: There are more than 200 viruses that cause colds. Would you take over 200 vaccinations to prevent a cold? And by the time you completed the series of 200 shots at least one virus would probably mutate rending the vaccine ineffective or less effective.

The flu virus mutates annually.

That’s why herd immunity won’t be achieved for those conditions.

Now when was the last time you saw someone with polio?

It took 24 years for polio vaccine to rid the world of it and it took years to invent. Went through many studies and trials to prove safe unlike the current vaccine that was rushed through the red tape. 

We are the study, but I went with being a ginny pig in this matter in an effort to protect the elderly family members and friends since I will always be around covid patients daily.   

(07-23-2021, 12:02 PM)fredtoast Wrote: He has said that the vaccine does not work and the government is lying to people about it.

And he has NEVER showed any of the overwhelming evidence about how COVID is effecting unvaccinated people v vaccinated.

Split hairs all you want, but it is still silly conspiracy theory bullshit.

dont believe everything mainstream media tells you....

(07-23-2021, 09:51 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: We will never achieve herd immunity and “get back to normal” with a 50-60% vaccination rate nationally.

How many athletes died from these positives or were even hospitalized ?

(07-23-2021, 12:38 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: dont believe everything mainstream media tells you....

That's such a mainstream viewpoint now, though.  It's mainstream to think the mainstream is misleading you.  Much of the mainstream media preaches the deception of the mainstream media. 

We're in deep, folks.