don't be shocked if Burrow becomes the next David Carr.

The lack of maximum attention to o line is truly amazing.

If Burrow goes down for a second year the staff and senior front office should be fired ( they won't of course)

Saw this and could not believe it is true:

https://giantswire.usatoday.com/2021/07/24/new-york-giants-attempted-claim-center-lamont-gaillard/?utm_campaign=trueanthem&utm_medium=trueanthem&utm_source=facebook&fbclid=IwAR2snb3o3j1Z3RBQbgh3G-KcrW3NOxARXGk-O36qaqTutsflXanDAolh2_s

Is this a good move? It's only waivers so no risk.

(07-25-2021, 07:46 PM)bengals67 Wrote: don't be shocked if Burrow becomes the next David Carr.

The lack of maximum attention to o line is truly amazing.

If Burrow goes down for a second year the staff and senior front office should be fired ( they won't of course)

We swung and missed in free agency.  That was the time to really make a difference if they were going with Chase with the fifth pick. Even the most optimistic people on this board can't help but get excited when there's talk of bringing in more offensive line help.   Obviously our OL is substandard.  We needed three starters and we only managed to get one.  

It still stinks of Mike Brown around here I don't care what kind of spin they put on it.

(07-25-2021, 07:58 PM)Chezaugie Wrote: Saw this and could not believe it is true:

https://giantswire.usatoday.com/2021/07/24/new-york-giants-attempted-claim-center-lamont-gaillard/?utm_campaign=trueanthem&utm_medium=trueanthem&utm_source=facebook&fbclid=IwAR2snb3o3j1Z3RBQbgh3G-KcrW3NOxARXGk-O36qaqTutsflXanDAolh2_s

Is this a good move? It's only waivers so no risk.

Makes me feel a little better about it.......

We need all the help we can get. Our success this season hinges on the offensive line.

Good find 

(07-25-2021, 06:53 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: I have to agree with his wife's statement, that does seem personal.  Even if that truly was the most they were willing to offer him, there's a million different ways to word that.  There's absolutely no reason to describe him as aging, to reiterate "it will not increase" after just saying the offer stands.  And to conclude it with an "I guess" at the end reads like complete indifference.

I really do not like this man (Troy).  Every time he opens his mouth, or I read a quote like this he strikes me a smug, pretentious piece of shit.  And to make matters even worse, he has absolutely zero reason to be.  He married into this game, and he has nothing on his resume to support speaking to people this way. 

This is a player who gave a decade to this franchise and always did it the right way.  The least you could do if you're not prepared to offer him a competitive deal is to be a little more professional about parting.  There's absolutely no reason to sound this callous or standoffish.  It takes little to no effort to reply in a way that doesn't read so shitty, while still delivering the overall point.

This is the first I've read this (not sure how I missed it).  This really pisses me off.

I've never seen this before.  Idk what went on between him and the Blackburns, but it's very un-Bengal like for them to let a guy like him walk, even at an advanced stage in his career.  Maybe they were just dug in on the 2015 draft picks and ready to move on from a money standpoint.  It doesn't seem like they would have had to do much to sweeten the deal and get him to come back.  Sound like they just wanted to boot him out the door, which is pretty unimaginable to me.

I'm going to wait and see before I get shitty about the 2021 line. I was really disappointed that they didn't manage to snag any guards of note in free agency. Be that as it may, it's not the same line they trotted out in 2020. Having Spain, Carman, and XSF is much more manageable than having MJ and Redmond slated for major roles. None of the 3 are Thuney or Zeitler, but they are definitely not the garbage we're accustomed to. Reiff should help, too. I don't expect them to be top 5 in the league, but I could see them being capable of not sucking. A not-sucking line would be something we haven't seen since 2015 in this town. I'd take that.

(07-25-2021, 09:33 PM)samhain Wrote: I'm going to wait and see before I get shitty about the 2021 line.  I was really disappointed that they didn't manage to snag any guards of note in free agency.  Be that as it may, it's not the same line they trotted out in 2020.  Having Spain, Carman, and XSF is much more manageable than having MJ and Redmond slated for major roles.  None of the 3 are Thuney or Zeitler, but they are definitely not the garbage we're accustomed to.  Reiff should help, too.  I don't expect them to be top 5 in the league, but I could see them being capable of not sucking.  A not-sucking line would be something we haven't seen since 2015 in this town.  I'd take that.

The line may have four new starters (Spain, Reiter, Carman, Reiff). And in that case every one is a pretty considerable upgrade. We also don't have Turner coaching anymore. The key will be how long it takes all the new pieces to gel. Also the entire depth chart has been revised courtesy of us picking three OL in the draft. Our first Guard off the bench is now XSF who is an effective Guard. Johnson is the first Tackle off the bench and currently Hill the backup Center (if we sign Reiter than it's Hopkins). 

I really liked what the Bengals done in free agency on the defense.I thought we had a good draft for the most part.But,,,,the only part where I was disappointed is where they didn’t do enough on the OL.Just sort of put a band aide on it.Elite Quarterbacks are hard to come by,and Joe Burrow is just that.They Chiefs just went out and got Patrick Mahomes a new Elite Offensive Line.And paid big money.The Chiefs experienced first hand in Super Bowl LV just how important the OL is.The Tampa Bay Buccaneers absolutely obliterated them,even with a such an Elite Quarterback as Mahomes.

(07-25-2021, 07:46 PM)bengals67 Wrote: don't be shocked if Burrow becomes the next David Carr.

The lack of maximum attention to o line is truly amazing.

If Burrow goes down for a second year the staff and senior front office should be fired ( they won't of course)

David Carr's rookie year he was sack 76 times in 444 passing attempts (1 in every 5.8 attempts)

Joe Burrow's rookie year he was sacked 32 times in 404 passing attempts ( 1 in every 12.6 attempts)

What is similar? 

(07-25-2021, 09:04 PM)2MinutesHate Wrote: We swung and missed in free agency.  

By signing the tenth highest paid RT in the league?

You call Reiff a "miss"?

(07-25-2021, 05:35 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Yep. She wrote an article in some magazine about it;

As I remember, the first team to call was the Los Angeles Chargers. They made a good offer. The next was from the Bengals. It wasn’t a good offer. At all. “It’s just the first day,” Andrew’s agent, Pat Dye said. There was another offer that first day from the Los Angeles Rams. A really solid offer. We knew they wanted him.

The next morning, less than 24 hours into the free agency process, it did ramp up. Offers came in from Denver, Minnesota, the New York Jets, and another one from the Rams (an even better one). Each time, Dad would put pen to paper and make his calculations. We would all talk and weigh our options. Andrew called Pat back at dinner that night and said, “I really don’t want to go anywhere else. I want to finish my career in Cincinnati, but their offer isn’t even competitive with the others. Can you reach out to them and see if they will increase their offer?” The answer hit us like a ton of bricks… “Andrew, here’s the text I just received from Troy Blackburn (one of the Bengals’ owners),” Pat’s text read. “I wanted you to read it for yourself. I’m sorry.” “We don’t have Andrew valued at that price,” Blackburn said. “He is an aging left tackle. Our offer stands. It will not increase. If he chooses to leave Cincinnati, all good things must come to an end, I guess.”

Wow. That was it. Cincinnati didn’t “value Andrew” the way other teams seemed to. It was hurtful and felt personal. We sat in silence for a few minutes not believing what we had just read. Andrew finally broke the tension in the room and called Pat on speaker phone, “Well Pat, I’m still not sure these other offers are worth me leaving Cincinnati.”  He REALLY wanted to stay. Pat said, “Let me call the Rams back. They want you badly. I’ll tell them to make an offer you can’t refuse.”

Don't forget at this time they drafted with high round picks their future starting tackles. The OL coach basically said we have our 2 starting tackles from the draft. Why would the Brown family sign Whit at his age to such an enormous contract when we had other people to sign like AJ Green, Dunlop, Atkins? They listened to their coaches who unfortunately were wrong. Imagine if they would have signed Whit and Ogbuehi and Fisher turned into starting tackles. We would not have been able to sign Atkins or Green and the same people would be saying how stupid the Bengals are to have signed Whit. 

(07-26-2021, 09:29 AM)SuperBowlBound! Wrote: Don't forget at this time they drafted with high round picks their future starting tackles. The OL coach basically said we have our 2 starting tackles from the draft. Why would the Brown family sign Whit at his age to such an enormous contract when we had other people to sign like AJ Green, Dunlop, Atkins? They listened to their coaches who unfortunately were wrong. Imagine if they would have signed Whit and Ogbuehi and Fisher turned into starting tackles. We would not have been able to sign Atkins or Green and the same people would be saying how stupid the Bengals are to have signed Whit. 

Yep, hindsight is always 20/20 and Father Time always wins in the end. Whitworth remaining a top tackle for as many years as he has was not a good bet then, nor would it be a good bet now. And, if he really wanted to stay in Cincinnati, he could have. When you have that many millions of dollars, how many more do you really need? 

(07-26-2021, 09:41 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Yep, hindsight is always 20/20 and Father Time always wins in the end. Whitworth remaining a top tackle for as many years as he has was not a good bet then, nor would it be a good bet now. And, if he really wanted to stay in Cincinnati, he could have. When you have that many millions of dollars, how many more do you really need? 

In Whits defense, I don’t think it was necessarily about the money, more about the principle of rewarding his loyalty. Also think he saw what was happening and wanted to go to a team that wasn’t about to hit a rebuild period. He wanted to win a Super Bowl and got close!

(07-26-2021, 09:29 AM)SuperBowlBound! Wrote: Don't forget at this time they drafted with high round picks their future starting tackles. The OL coach basically said we have our 2 starting tackles from the draft. Why would the Brown family sign Whit at his age to such an enormous contract when we had other people to sign like AJ Green, Dunlop, Atkins? They listened to their coaches who unfortunately were wrong. Imagine if they would have signed Whit and Ogbuehi and Fisher turned into starting tackles. We would not have been able to sign Atkins or Green and the same people would be saying how stupid the Bengals are to have signed Whit. 

That does not excuse the way Troy Blackburn handled it. Not bringing Whit back is one thing, disrespecting one of the best players (and humans) the franchise has ever had is quite another. There was absolutely no reason to word that message they way he did.

(07-26-2021, 09:29 AM)SuperBowlBound! Wrote: Don't forget at this time they drafted with high round picks their future starting tackles. The OL coach basically said we have our 2 starting tackles from the draft. Why would the Brown family sign Whit at his age to such an enormous contract when we had other people to sign like AJ Green, Dunlop, Atkins? They listened to their coaches who unfortunately were wrong. Imagine if they would have signed Whit and Ogbuehi and Fisher turned into starting tackles. We would not have been able to sign Atkins or Green and the same people would be saying how stupid the Bengals are to have signed Whit. 

I remember well.  We had money to sign all of them.  When were we cap strapped?

(07-26-2021, 09:41 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Yep, hindsight is always 20/20 and Father Time always wins in the end. Whitworth remaining a top tackle for as many years as he has was not a good bet then, nor would it be a good bet now. And, if he really wanted to stay in Cincinnati, he could have. When you have that many millions of dollars, how many more do you really need? 

I will never fault an athlete for trying to make as much as they can, as they have a limited amount of time to do so.  At the same time, NFL players who want to retire with a specific team typically have to take a lot less than market value to do so.  

I don't want to speak on how much more money he needed to make.  An alarmingly high % of lottery winners wind up going bankrupt.  Managing that kind of money is nowhere near as easy as people think. There is also the issue of ego with professional athletes.  One of my sister's college friends married an NFL player and she would relate constant struggles with trying to get him to save money because he would just burn through it with the attitude that he would worry about retirement when he got that huge next contract.

I have no problem with the Bengals and Whit not being able to reach a deal.  I find the the Whitworth camp acting like a high school girl who's boyfriend just broke up with them a little sad, though.

(07-26-2021, 09:41 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Yep, hindsight is always 20/20 and Father Time always wins in the end. Whitworth remaining a top tackle for as many years as he has was not a good bet then, nor would it be a good bet now. And, if he really wanted to stay in Cincinnati, he could have. When you have that many millions of dollars, how many more do you really need? 

Tell that to the family who has a net worth of probably around 3 BILLION dollars and who refuses to build a practice facility.

(07-26-2021, 10:11 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: That does not excuse the way Troy Blackburn handled it. Not bringing Whit back is one thing, disrespecting one of the best players (and humans) the franchise has ever had is quite another. There was absolutely no reason to word that message they way he did.

There was absolutely nothing disrespectful in the way the message was worded.

WTF was he supposed to say? "We value Andrew at $15 million a year, but we are not going to offer him that much."  How is that more respectful?

(07-26-2021, 09:29 AM)SuperBowlBound! Wrote: Don't forget at this time they drafted with high round picks their future starting tackles. The OL coach basically said we have our 2 starting tackles from the draft. Why would the Brown family sign Whit at his age to such an enormous contract when we had other people to sign like AJ Green, Dunlop, Atkins? They listened to their coaches who unfortunately were wrong. Imagine if they would have signed Whit and Ogbuehi and Fisher turned into starting tackles. We would not have been able to sign Atkins or Green and the same people would be saying how stupid the Bengals are to have signed Whit. 

Imagine the trade bait you would've had if Og & Fisher turned into starting OT in the NFL.  You'd have your anchor and team leader Whit at LT and one of the other 2 at RT.  

Do i think the Bengals were wrong with letting Whit go? not really.  He was an aging OT.  However, IMO, a team leader who hasn't had a history with injuries. Was still playing at high level I think they could've taken the risk in paying him because if the other 2 turn into starting NFL OL then you probably could've trade that piece for an extra 1st round pick. 

A competent NFL Front Office would've realized that.  

I also think it's shitty that Troy Blackburn didn't reach out to Whit directly.  As much as Whit meant to this organization, they really screwed the pooch on that one. 

(07-26-2021, 11:02 AM)fredtoast Wrote: There was absolutely nothing disrespectful in the way the message was worded.

WTF was he supposed to say? "We value Andrew at $15 million a year, but we are not going to offer him that much."  How is that more respectful?

There absolutely was. This isn’t that hard to understand. All Troy had to say is “we are not comfortable going any higher than our current offer (an offer that was a complete joke - - reportedly about 50-60% of what other teams were offering), and we’ve decided to go in a different direction. We wish Whit the best of luck if he decides to sign somewhere else.”

A little more professional than going on about “aging OT’s” and passive aggressive bullshit like “all good things have to come to end I guess.”

Seriously, I know you literally live to argue, but defending how Blackburn handled that situation is beyond ridiculous.