(09-07-2021, 02:58 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: The problem is that I truly don't think this team has the talent to win more than 4 games.

This is just ridiculous.  

We won 4 games last year and we have a lot more talent now.

You really think Zac is a good coach because he won more games than he should have with the talent he had last year?

(09-07-2021, 03:37 PM)fredtoast Wrote: You mean the same way we had to have coaches from Georgia when we had AJ Green, Robert Geathers, Clint Boling, Dennis Roland, Shawn Williams, and Geno Atkins all playing for us?

Were all those guys only known from one big year together at Georgia, or are you just being Fred?

(09-07-2021, 01:35 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: but why waste another half a season on something you know is bad

Mike Brown has stuck with numerous bad things longer than a half of year throughout his career as an owner!

(09-07-2021, 09:47 AM)bengalfan74 Wrote: So how you feeling about ZT & Co. ? What do you think are realistic expectations for this season ?

I must honestly say I just can't get onboard the Zac train. He's gonna have to put up some W's before my mind changes. I mean he just hasn't done anything for me to hang my hat on.

What do you think is the win level that would convince you he's gonna be worth keeping around ? I'm thinking 9, I'm thinking it's gonna take JB and the Offense 3 or 4 games to get clicking. I don't believe we're going to do very well early on.

But I feel the time for excuses is over, put up or shut up time.

I hope he does flip the switch this season and makes this team look like it belongs in the NFL. But I just can't help it. I have doubts.

I was all for changing coaches after the 2018 season. I really just didn't see the team advance beyond the weak playoff appearances it was doing.

But what we got instead was much worse than Marvin on his worst day. I had hoped the team would pull it together, but as I've said in other threads and posts, whenever I start hearing lots of excuses I know it's done.

Six wins in two years is not worthy of a head coaching position in the NFL.

Taylor has been given more free agent money to spend than Marvin ever had. He's gotten less out of more. Marvin got more out of less.

Frankly, Taylor needs a winning record to get another year. And even then he'll need a playoff appearance next season to get a 5th one.

In the Mike Brown era many coaches have come into an existing bad situation, in fact I believe each one of them has. Marvin took over a team with the worst record in the NFL and got 8 wins out of them. Taylor took over a 6 win team and got the worst NFL record out of them.

 

(09-07-2021, 03:43 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Were all those guys only known from one big year together at Georgia, or are you just being Fred?

Right now we have as many players from the 2016 Oklahoma team that finished #5 in 2016 as we have from the 2019 LSU team.

If by "being Fred" you mean "making my comment look silly" then the answer is "yes".

(09-07-2021, 01:35 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: but why waste another half a season on something you know is bad

(09-07-2021, 02:25 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Too early to talk about this.  There are new names that pop up every year.

When you are replacing a good coach that you think "can't get you over the hump" like Marvin then you need to be sure you have an upgrade.  But when you have a guy like Zac who just can't win then it is okay to go with an unproven prospect because it can't get worse.

Agree

If he comes this season 1-5 or something pull the plug.

(09-07-2021, 02:59 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: They've "been in games" his first two seasons though, and he continues to lose. At some point you have to start winning. 

Oh for sure !

I've never been on the oh we lost six games by 5 points or less so we're close bandwagon. 

I think 9 wins and being competitive all year is what I want to see. I do think Lewis did more with less and I think we have a pretty good roster put together. I've wondered recently with some of the breakdowns of Burrow on how he so quickly see's the field and picks up on his keys if he makes Taylor look a little better. These first 4 games are probably gonna tell us all we need to know on Taylor. I think they're all winnable games and we might have some rust on offense. So I think it will really fall on the coaches to make the difference and I'm not so confident in that happening. I think the latter part of our schedule is so tough I really don't see us doing any better than being competitive.

(09-07-2021, 02:50 PM)Pat5775 Wrote: I’ll be on cloud 9 if they bring in Bieniemy. It should have been Bieniemy after 2018 but whatever. There’s a great chance to get him after this season and he can get to work with Joe Burrow (all thanks to Zac Taylor sucking hardcore in 2019).

Wouldn’t hate Joe Brady either, but… honestly I’m kind of sick of the team trying to recreate the 2019 LSU Tiger magic at the pro level.

There's something going on with Bieniemy. We aren't the only team to pass on him. Maybe he is a bad interviewer, or maybe his vision of what he wants to do is not something team owners want to hear. 

As for Taylor, I think we can legitimately get to 10 wins. Obviously that brings him back. At 9 wins, I'd bring him back, but it would be a probation type year. Less than that, I think it's time to move on, unless there are extenuating circumstances like last year with all the injuries. If you look at the games that were close last year with our 4-6th string Dline and corners, and replace those guys with our starters and our improvements, you could say those should translate into wins. Tougher schedule this year, but a better team.

(09-07-2021, 03:40 PM)fredtoast Wrote: This is just ridiculous.  

We won 4 games last year and we have a lot more talent now.

You really think Zac is a good coach because he won more games than he should have with the talent he had last year?

The schedule isn't the same as last year. Tell me, what 4 games will we be favored in this year? 

(09-07-2021, 09:47 AM)bengalfan74 Wrote: So how you feeling about ZT & Co. ? What do you think are realistic expectations for this season ?

I must honestly say I just can't get onboard the Zac train. He's gonna have to put up some W's before my mind changes. I mean he just hasn't done anything for me to hang my hat on.

What do you think is the win level that would convince you he's gonna be worth keeping around ? I'm thinking 9, I'm thinking it's gonna take JB and the Offense 3 or 4 games to get clicking. I don't believe we're going to do very well early on.

But I feel the time for excuses is over, put up or shut up time.

I hope he does flip the switch this season and makes this team look like it belongs in the NFL. But I just can't help it. I have doubts.

I expect 6-8 wins.
I also think it will take around 4 games for the team to get comfortable together.
I also think the defense got overly hyped through the preseason games and will come back down to earth. I think this defense is in the 15-20 range when all is said and done, which would still be an improvement over last year.
I think the offense ends up also in the 15-20 range by season's end.

(09-07-2021, 09:47 AM)bengalfan74 Wrote: So how you feeling about ZT & Co. ? What do you think are realistic expectations for this season ?

I must honestly say I just can't get onboard the Zac train. He's gonna have to put up some W's before my mind changes. I mean he just hasn't done anything for me to hang my hat on.

What do you think is the win level that would convince you he's gonna be worth keeping around ? I'm thinking 9, I'm thinking it's gonna take JB and the Offense 3 or 4 games to get clicking. I don't believe we're going to do very well early on.

But I feel the time for excuses is over, put up or shut up time.

I hope he does flip the switch this season and makes this team look like it belongs in the NFL. But I just can't help it. I have doubts.

The 3rd year should be the year we see the most improvement since he was hired. If not, he needs to be fired. 

And by improvement, I pretty much mean being in the hunt for the playoffs at the end of the season.

(09-08-2021, 08:44 AM)Sled21 Wrote: There's something going on with Bieniemy. We aren't the only team to pass on him. Maybe he is a bad interviewer, or maybe his vision of what he wants to do is not something team owners want to hear. 

As for Taylor, I think we can legitimately get to 10 wins. Obviously that brings him back. At 9 wins, I'd bring him back, but it would be a probation type year. Less than that, I think it's time to move on, unless there are extenuating circumstances like last year with all the injuries. If you look at the games that were close last year with our 4-6th string Dline and corners, and replace those guys with our starters and our improvements, you could say those should translate into wins. Tougher schedule this year, but a better team.

I think the issue with Bienemy is he has the unfortunate situation of being on a legitimate superbowl contender and really isn't available until later. Teams looking for new coaches want to already have things moving along by the time he's available. I think with working so closely with Andy Reid and his Cincinnati connection he would be a really good hire for us. If we do move on from Taylor after this year he would be high on my list.

(09-08-2021, 11:12 AM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: I think the issue with Bienemy is he has the unfortunate situation of being on a legitimate superbowl contender and really isn't available until later. Teams looking for new coaches want to already have things moving along by the time he's available. I think with working so closely with Andy Reid and his Cincinnati connection he would be a really good hire for us. If we do move on from Taylor after this year he would be high on my list.

You'd have to think Bieniemy or Joe Brady would be the logical choices if the Bengals move on from Taylor.

I also really like Matt Eberflus as a dark horse. He's done a good job as DC in Indy for the past 3 seasons. He's turned a defense that was bottom-of-the-barrel in 2016 and 2017 into a legit upper-echelon defense. He's had two Top-10 defenses in his 3 seasons.

(09-07-2021, 09:47 AM)bengalfan74 Wrote: So how you feeling about ZT & Co. ? What do you think are realistic expectations for this season ?

I must honestly say I just can't get onboard the Zac train. He's gonna have to put up some W's before my mind changes. I mean he just hasn't done anything for me to hang my hat on.

What do you think is the win level that would convince you he's gonna be worth keeping around ? I'm thinking 9, I'm thinking it's gonna take JB and the Offense 3 or 4 games to get clicking. I don't believe we're going to do very well early on.

But I feel the time for excuses is over, put up or shut up time.

I hope he does flip the switch this season and makes this team look like it belongs in the NFL. But I just can't help it. I have doubts.

Well, you pretty much summed up my thoughts except the part about Burrow taking 3 or 4 games to start clicking. I think it may 
take the first half against the Vikings and then he will calm down along with the rest of the Offense. In the mean time I think the 
trenches on both sides of the ball should really help Taylor and Co. This is where my confidence lies, no coach can win many games
with terrible play on both sides in the trenches, not even Billy B.

9 games + needs to be won this season and I think it will happen. I completely understand the doubts though.

How can you not with 6 wins in two frickin' years?

(09-08-2021, 01:20 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Well, you pretty much summed up my thoughts except the part about Burrow taking 3 or 4 games to start clicking. I think it may 
take the first half against the Vikings and then he will calm down along with the rest of the Offense. In the mean time I think the 
trenches on both sides of the ball should really help Taylor and Co. This is where my confidence lies, no coach can win many games
with terrible play on both sides in the trenches, not even Billy B.

9 games + needs to be won this season and I think it will happen. I completely understand the doubts though.

How can you not with 6 wins in two frickin' years?

smart coaches call plays to disguise their weaknesses not flaunt them

(09-08-2021, 01:46 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: smart coaches call plays to disguise their weaknesses not flaunt them

I agree, but try calling a game with terrible play in the trenches on both sides...

Hampers everything you do. No more excuses for Zac, he needs to start taking advantage of other team's weaknesses and as 
you say, disguising his own. This is the year or we have to go looking for a new HC. Just the way it goes.

(09-08-2021, 01:46 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: smart coaches call plays to disguise their weaknesses not flaunt them

Smart coaches also lose when they don't have enough talented players.

(09-08-2021, 02:51 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Smart coaches also lose when they don't have enough talented players.

its true....   But they have a much better chance than we have seen in the last 2 years

Unless he wins a playoff game this year, I've got no confidence in him and have no reason to have confidence in him.

But if he can get that 30 year monkey off the team's back, I'll eat my words and give him all the respect he deserves.