Through 4 games, the Bengals have had quite a handful of players doing rather well, according to PFF.

Players on offense and defense who are in the Top 10 of their position in PFF ratings:
Joe Burrow - 4th of 35 qualified QBs (86.1 rating)
Joe Mixon - 3rd of 57 qualified RBs (81.4 rating)
DJ Reader - 6th of 119 qualified IDL (80.9 rating)
BJ Hill - 9th of 119 qualified IDL (79.7 rating)
Logan Wilson - 9th of 78 qualified LBs (76.8 rating)
Jessie Bates - 10th of 79 safeties (75.6 rating)

Honorable Mention:
Vonn Bell - 12th of 79 safeties (72.6 rating)

(10-01-2021, 03:27 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Through 4 games, the Bengals have had quite a handful of players doing rather well, according to PFF.

Players on offense and defense who are in the Top 10 of their position in PFF ratings:
Joe Burrow - 4th of 35 qualified QBs (86.1 rating)
Joe Mixon - 3rd of 57 qualified RBs (81.4 rating)
DJ Reader - 6th of 119 qualified IDL (80.9 rating)
BJ Hill - 9th of 119 qualified IDL (79.7 rating)
Logan Wilson - 9th of 78 qualified LBs (76.8 rating)
Jessie Bates - 10th of 79 safeties (75.6 rating)

Honorable Mention:
Vonn Bell - 12th of 79 safeties (72.6 rating)

Vonn Bell has actually turned out much better than I expected. They are using him really well as a blitzer and run support but even his coverage hasn't been as bad as expected.

Bell and Bates complement each other as safeties perfectly. And once Waynes shakes the rust off he and Awuzie will have the corner slots locked down.

I think Logan Wilson is going to be the star on defense. BJ Hill trade has to be one of the best the Bengals have ever made at least as long as I've been alive.

FWIW, here are the cumulative grades for the offense thru 4 weeks. Snap counts as well.

Burrow: 86.1. 229.
Mixon: 81.4. 175.
Chase: 77.1. 198.
Higgins: 73.5. 101.
Boyd: 77.6. 172.
Uzomah: 68.5. 172.
J. Williams: 70.3. 229.
Spain: 66.3. 229.
Hopkins: 44.6. 229.
XSF: 50.0. 124.
Reiff: 65.3. 227.
--------------------
Carman: 28.0. 105.
------------------------
Perine: 53.9. 44
Tate: 74.1. 60.
Thomas: 63.3. 52.
D. Sample: NR. 106. (I guess b/c no receptions).
----------------
Irwin: 69.3. 22
Prince: 88.9. 22
--------------
C. Evans: NR. 9.
Wilcox: NR. 7.
Morgan: NR. 5.
Hilton: NR. 2 (Victory formation at Pitt).

(10-01-2021, 04:07 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: I think Logan Wilson is going to be the star on defense. BJ Hill trade has to be one of the best the Bengals have ever made at least as long as I've been alive.

Wilson is already there if you ask me, and I couldn't agree more on the Hill/ Price trade. I remember being a lil concerned about trading away Price. As lackluster as he'd been, the line seemed a bit shallow to me.

FWIW, here is the defense.

I am not advocating PFF as the Bible, or saying that they get everything right. But usually, at a big picture level, they tend to get stuff right. Burrow has been excellent the last two weeks. All the receivers have been good. Williams & Spain have been our best OL. Hopkins has been poor. All that stuff tracks with my eye test. A bit too harsh on the rookie Carman? Yes.

Same with the D. Do I think Hendrickson should be higher? Yeah. But he, Reader, Wilson, Bates, and Bell being our highest rated starters certainly validates my eye test. So does Awuzie as the best corner. As does Tupou & Hill being highly rated amongst the rotation guys.

Of course, our level of competition has not been the highest yet, and that is about to change.

Defensive PFF grades + snap counts thru 4 games:

Hendrickson: 71.3. 222.
Reader: 80.9. 174.
Ogunjobi: 58.6. 201. (Seems a tad low)
Hubbard: 64.2 238.
L. Wilson: 76.8. 257.
Pratt: 66.5. 156.
Waynes: 55.2. 53.
Awuzie: 65.7. 189.
Hilton: 59.6. 242.
Bell: 72.6. 287
Bates: 75.6. 230.
-----------
Apple: 43.3. 281.
------------
Tupou: 76.5. 98
Hill: 79.7. 97.
C. Sample: 53.9. 92.
ADG: 65.0. 88
----------------------
Phillips: 59.0. 57.
B. Wilson: 61.9. 56
Ray: 70.7. 45
J. Evans: 55.9. 38
R. Allen: 85.4. 21.
--------------
S. Davis: 42.1. 13
J. Davis: 56.8. 8
M. Bailey: 69.8. 7
Hodge: 52.3. 6

Need to get Bates & Awuzie back. Kareem and Allen would be nice as well.

(10-01-2021, 04:10 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: FWIW, here are the cumulative grades for the offense thru 4 weeks. Snap counts as well.

Burrow: 86.1. 229.
Mixon: 81.4. 175.
Chase: 77.1. 198.
Higgins: 73.5. 101.
Boyd: 77.6. 172.
Uzomah: 68.5. 172.
J. Williams: 70.3. 229.
Spain: 66.3. 229.
Hopkins: 44.6. 229.
XSF: 50.0. 124.
Reiff: 65.3. 227.
--------------------
Carman: 28.0. 105.
------------------------
Perine: 53.9. 44
Tate: 74.1. 60.
Thomas: 63.3. 52.
D. Sample: NR. 106. (I guess b/c no receptions).
----------------
Irwin: 69.3. 22
Prince: 88.9. 22
--------------
C. Evans: NR. 9.
Wilcox: NR. 7.
Morgan: NR. 5.
Hilton: NR. 2 (Victory formation at Pitt).

Not sure why you're not able to get Sample's rating.
It's 52.2.
He's rated 50th out of 64 eligible TEs.

It's worth pointing out that Carman's 28.0 rating is because he's rated so poorly against the run. 29.7. Against the pass, he's 53.6.

Wait wasn't it just last week a lot of people were mad about PFF ratings and calling them BS?

(10-01-2021, 05:27 PM)George Cantstandya Wrote: Wait wasn't it just last week a lot of people were mad about PFF ratings and calling them BS?    

Some may, but I definitely don't consider them BS.
Do I think they are 100% accurate? No.
But I think they are generally close.
They watch players way closer than 95% of fans do.

(10-01-2021, 05:31 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Some may, but I definitely don't consider them BS.
Do I think they are 100% accurate? No.
But I think they are generally close.
They watch players way closer than 95% of fans do.

I was mostly kidding because of that thread last week.  That and some people like to use PFF when the ratings support their point of view but then reject them when they don't.   It's kind of an interesting thing to observe.

I tend to agree they have some value and can be interesting.  I'm glad to see we have some players being rated so highly via the PFF system. Every player in the OP list has done well from what I have seen in the games and that's great to see. Also thanks to the people here with the subscriptions to PFF for posting them.

(10-01-2021, 05:20 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Not sure why you're not able to get Sample's rating.
It's 52.2.
He's rated 50th out of 64 eligible TEs.

It's worth pointing out that Carman's 28.0 rating is because he's rated so poorly against the run. 29.7. Against the pass, he's 53.6.

1. How does someone grade lower overall than either of the individual grades

2. I don't think its just coincidence that our OL has went 2 games with a single sack compared to 9 in the first 2. Some of that of course can be attributed to Burrow but I've seen plays where Carman is just destroying his guy on a run play or handling a hand off in pass pro so I'm baffled by the 28.0 score.

(10-01-2021, 05:20 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Not sure why you're not able to get Sample's rating.
It's 52.2.
He's rated 50th out of 64 eligible TEs.

It's worth pointing out that Carman's 28.0 rating is because he's rated so poorly against the run. 29.7. Against the pass, he's 53.6.

I don't subscribe, so I only get the overall ratings. No run/pass splits. At that level, they don't have a rating for D. Sample. Which I agree is weird. 

(10-01-2021, 07:14 PM)WVUHomer Wrote: 1. How does someone grade lower overall than either of the individual grades

2. I don't think its just coincidence that our OL has went 2 games with a single sack compared to 9 in the first 2. Some of that of course can be attributed to Burrow but I've seen plays where Carman is just destroying his guy on a run play or handling a hand off in pass pro so I'm baffled by the 28.0 score.

Good point on the averages. Maybe poor special teams play? 

(10-01-2021, 07:14 PM)WVUHomer Wrote: 1. How does someone grade lower overall than either of the individual grades

2. I don't think its just coincidence that our OL has went 2 games with a single sack compared to 9 in the first 2. Some of that of course can be attributed to Burrow but I've seen plays where Carman is just destroying his guy on a run play or handling a hand off in pass pro so I'm baffled by the 28.0 score.

I don't focus on the oline when watching unless I go back and rewatch games then I may try and pay attention. I don't think Carman had as good of a game against the Jags then he did the Steelers. But I completely agree that he is a part of what this line has done the last 2 weeks. He's gonna have some growing pains but I think he's earned the right to keep learning on the job.

(10-01-2021, 05:20 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Not sure why you're not able to get Sample's rating.
It's 52.2.
He's rated 50th out of 64 eligible TEs.

It's worth pointing out that Carman's 28.0 rating is because he's rated so poorly against the run. 29.7. Against the pass, he's 53.6.

Yeah Sample just doesn't get targets and with the weapons we have I can't blame them. He does have good hands and I think could be a guy that makes the occasional play but I doubt he does much more than that. But he's a willing blocker who is used in that role alot. He's also our best skill position blocker that I've seen although I'm not sure about Wilcox.

(10-01-2021, 08:59 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: I don't focus on the oline when watching unless I go back and rewatch games then I may try and pay attention. I don't think Carman had as good of a game against the Jags then he did the Steelers. But I completely agree that he is a part of what this line has done the last 2 weeks. He's gonna have some growing pains but I think he's earned the right to keep learning on the job.

I won't say I focus exclusively on it but I do try to take plays where I do (former HS OG/NT) but every time I did, I saw the lineman or backer 5 yards away from the ball carrier which seems weird for a OG that has a poor run blocking grade but thats why I'm not an expert.

(10-01-2021, 05:27 PM)George Cantstandya Wrote: Wait wasn't it just last week a lot of people were mad about PFF ratings and calling them BS?    

I think for most players, they are decent. But their scores for OL are suspect.

Carman 28 vs XSF 50? Yeah PFF is a joke lol

(10-01-2021, 09:36 PM)Earendil Wrote: I think for most players, they are decent. But their scores for OL are suspect.

So we are going to trust some but not all.  Got it.