(12-06-2021, 01:39 PM)Bengalfan4life27c Wrote: We may have the future GOAT though. I'm beginning to doubt it though i'm noticing a trend when we are trailing and we need Burrow to do more. we may have already seen his ceiling. 

I would be with you. But this Oline has failed him miserably...

(12-06-2021, 03:49 PM)samhain Wrote: Apple's shittiness is an overhyped narrative.  I'm not saying he's turning into Johnathan Joseph anthem soon, but he's done a decent job for what he is.  Awuzie's injury is probably the one I'm least worried about.  I think he's going to be okay, but we shall see.  The Ravens injuries at corner would be like us losing Hilton, Awuzie, Waynes and Apple.  

I don't view the o-line scenario as a panic-worthy thing just yet.  Every line in the division that isn't Cleveland is a dumpster fire.  Reiff and Hopkins were both game time decisions, so that's hardly any indication that they are done for any significant period of time.  TBH, they settled down a bit after the first half until the wheels came off in obvious passing situations in the 4th.  That officiating crew is notorious for throwing ticky-tack flags and both the Bengals and the Chargers got to experience that fact first hand yesterday.

This team, even with yesterday's injuries are doing pretty well health-wise for going into week 14.

The intended starters were Waynes, Awuzie, and Hilton.
Any other CB on the roster is technically depth, so if they're playing any meaningful snaps, it's because of injury.
You can't (or shouldn't) expect the depth is going to perform as the same or better level than the intended starters.

So if we're looking at which of the intended starters are out:
- Waynes
- Wilson
- XSF
- Maybe Awuzie
- Maybe Hopkins
- Maybe Reiff

(12-06-2021, 03:59 PM)ochocincos Wrote: The intended starters were Waynes, Awuzie, and Hilton.
Any other CB on the roster is technically depth, so if they're playing any meaningful snaps, it's because of injury.
You can't (or shouldn't) expect the depth is going to perform as the same or better level than the intended starters.

So if we're looking at which of the intended starters are out:
- Waynes
- Wilson
- XSF
- Maybe Awuzie
- Maybe Hopkins
- Maybe Reiff

That's basically Waynes, who's played what? 1 game and Wilson.  Adeniji for XSF is an upgrade thus far, so that's not really a big loss.  Sure, starter in name, but he's not playing another snap for this team healthy or otherwise.  

 The others are maybes who were game time decisions.  Not exactly time to panic.  

Wilson is the only one that I don't have a great feeling about playing.

Is Waynes officially done for the year? I totally forget he's on this team.

(12-06-2021, 01:12 PM)Tony Wrote: Zac was doing fine until he had to deal with bums like Hill and Prince... I wish they would stop with sucky OSU lineman...

Prince actually was graded by PFF yesterday as one of the top performers on the line yesterday.  I guess we should stop drafting guys from Georgia since Hill's a POS OL right?  Dudes a rookie.  There's a reason they didn't put Hill in earlier this year when Hopkins was struggling.  Hopkins may have sucked but what you're seeing from Hill is worse than Hopkins.  

(12-06-2021, 04:05 PM)samhain Wrote: That's basically Waynes, who's played what? 1 game and Wilson.  Adeniji for XSF is an upgrade thus far, so that's not really a big loss.  Sure, starter in name, but he's not playing another snap for this team healthy or otherwise.  

 The others are maybes who were game time decisions.  Not exactly time to panic.  

Wilson is the only one that I don't have a great feeling about playing.

Is Waynes officially done for the year?  I totally forget he's on this team.

No idea what's going on with Waynes, but his contract is one of the worst FA signings the Bengals have had, at least in the past two decades.
Right up there with Antonio Bryant.

If Hopkins and/or Reiff miss any game, I have no confidence in the OL for that game.

I dunno if I'd say Adeniji has been that much of an upgrade over XSF performance-wise. He's just meh. That's what XSF was too.
Better than downright bad though.

(12-06-2021, 04:09 PM)TJ528 Wrote: Prince actually was graded by PFF yesterday as one of the top performers on the line yesterday.  I guess we should stop drafting guys from Georgia since Hill's a POS OL right?  Dudes a rookie.  There's a reason they didn't put Hill in earlier this year when Hopkins was struggling.  Hopkins may have sucked but what you're seeing from Hill is worse than Hopkins.  

And Hill's a Rd 6 rookie to boot.
The later in the rounds you go, the less likely you end up succeeding on offense/defense, especially as a rookie.
The Bengals really were banking on Hopkins to be healthy all year after they traded away Price.
And FWIW, Hopkins has played every game but one, he just wasn't very good the first half of the season.

(12-06-2021, 04:14 PM)ochocincos Wrote: And Hill's a Rd 6 rookie to boot.
The later in the rounds you go, the less likely you end up succeeding on offense/defense, especially as a rookie.
The Bengals really were banking on Hopkins to be healthy all year after they traded away Price.
And FWIW, Hopkins has played every game but one, he just wasn't very good the first half of the season.

To be fair, Hopkins hasnt been good all season.  They've just been able to hide him better since the bye. 

They either need to draft a center in the 1st round, although (ie Price) that's never a guarantee, or they need to pony up and pay for a center in FA., again of which the Bengals don't like to spend big money on the interior OL. 

(12-06-2021, 04:14 PM)ochocincos Wrote: And Hill's a Rd 6 rookie to boot.
The later in the rounds you go, the less likely you end up succeeding on offense/defense, especially as a rookie.
The Bengals really were banking on Hopkins to be healthy all year after they traded away Price.
And FWIW, Hopkins has played every game but one, he just wasn't very good the first half of the season.

Price is as bad as Hill.. I've watched some Giants games and he is downright awful..

(12-06-2021, 03:39 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: Depth is part of the reason many of us said they didnt do enough in the offseason

Especially knowing anybody can go on covid protocol at anytime. 

(12-06-2021, 03:31 PM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: That’s the answer!

What happened up front yesterday was completely embarrassing. I know two key starters were injured but are the backups THAT bad?

Agree

The Raiders were also 7-5 last year.

Okay, not going to read the entire thread. Saw the title, and just had to point of the following.

Arians > Taylor
Bucs OL > Bengals OL all 5 of them yes.
Bucs 3 WRs and TEs > Bengals 3 WRs and TEs
Brady > Burrow
Bucs D > Bengals D


That team was literally littered with talent everywhere except the secondary.

I can appreciate the hopefulness and the want to run off 8 straight but this team just isn't there yet.

(12-07-2021, 01:35 AM)fredtoast Wrote: The Raiders were also 7-5 last year.

So maybe we fall in the middle?

(12-07-2021, 01:40 AM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Okay, not going to read the entire thread. Saw the title, and just had to point of the following.

Arians > Taylor
Bucs OL > Bengals OL all 5 of them yes.
Bucs 3 WRs and TEs > Bengals 3 WRs and TEs
Brady > Burrow
Bucs D > Bengals D


That team was literally littered with talent everywhere except the secondary.

I can appreciate the hopefulness and the want to run off 8 straight but this team just isn't there yet.

I guess the question is "If the Bucs were so much more talented and better coached then how did they have the exact same record as the Bengals?"

(12-07-2021, 02:17 AM)fredtoast Wrote: I guess the question is "If the Bucs were so much more talented and better coached then how did they have the exact same record as the Bengals?"

Injuries and Brady adjusting to Arians system were the most common statements about things. Once Brady and Arians got on the same page and they got healthy, they went off.

(12-07-2021, 02:18 AM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Injuries and Brady adjusting to Arians system were the most common statements about things. Once Brady and Arians got on the same page and they got healthy, they went off.

Yep, there is a noted learning curve to the Arians system for QBs. Brady got it after part of a season, Luck, Ben, and Palmer got it after 1 season, and Winston got fired. 

I had a feeling the Brady haters who were gleeful he was suddenly throwing a bunch of picks early in the system were going to be disappointed eventually. 

Brady went from memes if him being Winston in disguise to winning the SB in a few months. 

(12-07-2021, 01:40 AM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Okay, not going to read the entire thread. Saw the title, and just had to point of the following.

Arians > Taylor
Bucs OL > Bengals OL all 5 of them yes.
Bucs 3 WRs and TEs > Bengals 3 WRs and TEs
Brady > Burrow
Bucs D > Bengals D


That team was literally littered with talent everywhere except the secondary.

I can appreciate the hopefulness and the want to run off 8 straight but this team just isn't there yet.

1 Cant argue 1. 2 Id take Jonah and Spain closer than you suggest
3 with TE yes Id argue 3 Bengals receivers have more upside Gronk is past his prime Howard, Brate never really had a prime
4 Ill go with the younger more athletic Burrow
5 Our Dline is better secondary and LB's are slightly worse. 

(12-07-2021, 12:22 PM)Bengalfan4life27c Wrote: 1 Cant argue 1. 2 Id take Jonah and Spain closer than you suggest
3 with TE yes Id argue 3 Bengals receivers have more upside Gronk is past his prime Howard, Brate never really had a prime
4 Ill go with the younger more athletic Burrow
5 Our Dline is better secondary and LB's are slightly worse. 

I think Spain and Williams are closer than the other guys but still not as good as what they (Tampa) were rolling out last season.

For the WR's, TE's and even the QB part, I get that Brady and Gronk are old and you aren't getting many years, I was talking in comparison for one moment/one season type of setting. If you are asking about building a team long term, you have to add in the youth factor and contracts. I was just comparing Brady and Burrow across the remaining schedule of this year alone. In that small sample size, trying to win a title, you'd have to go with Brady and Gronk and Evans, and Godwin and even that knucklehead Brown as the 3.

(12-07-2021, 11:39 AM)Nately120 Wrote: Yep, there is a noted learning curve to the Arians system for QBs. Brady got it after part of a season, Luck, Ben, and Palmer got it after 1 season, and Winston got fired. 

I had a feeling the Brady haters who were gleeful he was suddenly throwing a bunch of picks early in the system were going to be disappointed eventually. 

Brady went from memes if him being Winston in disguise to winning the SB in a few months. 

I was so hopeful he had just lost a step, but deep down I knew it was the learning a new system. Once he dialed it in, they just starting mauling people. 

(12-07-2021, 04:15 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: I was so hopeful he had just lost a step, but deep down I knew it was the learning a new system. Once he dialed it in, they just starting mauling people. 

To each his own and I"ve said this a zillion times, but Tom Brady should be the favorite non-Bengals player of every Bengals fan.  The guy has never gotten in our way, prevented the Steelers from winning the SB even more than they already have, and infuriates Steelers fans in a way we hope and pray Burrow can.

I can't be alone when every year as soon as the Bengals were out of the playoffs or playoff picture I was thinking "Dear lord, please let Tom Brady and the Patriots stop the Steelers in the playoffs."