The Jets may be the only team in the league with a deep TE room but then again they are virtually empty at WR so they need those guys. Almost no one goes past the #1 TE. It is just not a position teams build depth in. Zac has never seemed overly concerned about having a great receiver at TE. Hurst, though, may actually be a better receiver than Uzomah so we may be better off than we were last year in that respect though CJ is probably the better blocker

(06-24-2022, 03:12 PM)Bengalpool Wrote: If Moss made the 53 I wouldn't be shocked. Could be a breakout player for us if opportunity rises (injury).

Moss is our new Auden Tate.

(06-24-2022, 03:47 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Moss is our new Auden Tate.

Nah, Auden Tate was far more qualified for the hype because he actually showed some flashes before the hype started. The only reason people care about Moss is because of his name and he was on a team with Burrow 3 or 4 years ago. 

(06-24-2022, 08:40 AM)Sled21 Wrote: They have been grading position groups on "Moving the Chains" and yesterday they were doing Tight End groups. When they got to the AFCN North, they started with the Ravens, who got a 19. When they got to the Bengals, they got a 9. I wasn't to focused on TE's because we signed Hayden Hurst, and I expect him to have a good year. But then Pat Kirwin mentioned what if Hurst goes down. That leaves Sample and Wilcox to be out #1 and #2 Tight Ends. I realize we don't use the TE that much with our WR group, but if they are still going to being a player in, they maybe ought to look at another Tight End. BTW, neither expected Washington or Moss to even make the team anywhere but possibly the PS.

TEs (Uzomah+Sample+Wilcox) combined took 1,350 offensive snaps for the Bengals in 2021. 
Tee Higgins and Tyler Boyd combined took 1,517 offensive snaps for the Bengals in 2021.

Despite having 3 very good WRs, the other WRs and the TEs took SUBSTANTIAL snaps in 2021. The non-Chase/Higgins/Boyd WRs combined for 508 offensive snaps in 2021.

So if you're looking at TEs and WRs on the Bengals last year that aren't the big 3 WRs, they combined for 1,858 offensive snaps in 2021. The big 3 WRs combined for 2,456 and were about as healthy as you can reasonably expect to ever be (missed 4 games out of 51). That's 43% of the WR/TE snap totals weren't Chase, Higgins, or Boyd. That's significant.

The easiest upgrade the Bengals have available right now is improving WR and TE depth, because they will see some serious action, and it doesn't take a whole lot (comparatively) to upgrade 4th/5th WRs and 2nd TEs from what they currently have.

(06-24-2022, 04:38 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: TEs (Uzomah+Sample+Wilcox) combined took 1,350 offensive snaps for the Bengals in 2021. 
Tee Higgins and Tyler Boyd combined took 1,517 offensive snaps for the Bengals in 2021.

Despite having 3 very good WRs, the other WRs and the TEs took SUBSTANTIAL snaps in 2021. The non-Chase/Higgins/Boyd WRs combined for 508 offensive snaps in 2021.

So if you're looking at TEs and WRs on the Bengals last year that aren't the big 3 WRs, they combined for 1,858 offensive snaps in 2021. The big 3 WRs combined for 2,456 and were about as healthy as you can reasonably expect to ever be (missed 4 games out of 51). That's 43% of the WR/TE snap totals weren't Chase, Higgins, or Boyd. That's significant.

The easiest upgrade the Bengals have available right now is improving WR and TE depth, because they will see some serious action, and it doesn't take a whole lot (comparatively) to upgrade 4th/5th WRs and 2nd TEs from what they currently have.

Pretty sure what OP meant about not using TE much in this offense is related to targets in the passing game, not how many snaps TEs get.
TEs got fewer targets as a group than the RBs got.
540 total targets in the regular season.
WRs - 359 targets (67%)
RBs - 98 targets (18%)
TEs - 83 targets (15%)

I am with most, not really worried at all at TE. I actually like our first 3 TE's better than last season cause I like Hurst
better as a pass catcher and route runner than Uzo. We also have some UDFA's that I like. Sure, if Hurst goes down we
are thin but we can always pick someone up off the street who is decent.

This is one of the positions where we can get by. I think I am more concerned with our WR depth if one of the top 3 go
down as Burrow DOES like to throw to the WR's a lot in empty sets. OL depth is also a concern if one of our new guys go
down, namely Cappa. Carman doesn't like it on the right side clearly, need to keep him at LG.

If we can add a versatile Guard that can play on both sides of the Line I would feel more content.

I DO like Volson, but he is a rookie from a small school.

(06-24-2022, 04:51 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Pretty sure what OP meant about not using TE much in this offense is related to targets in the passing game, not how many snaps TEs get.
TEs got fewer targets as a group than the RBs got.
540 total targets in the regular season.
WRs - 359 targets (67%)
RBs - 98 targets (18%)
TEs - 83 targets (15%)

How much of that is a product of mediocre or bad players, though? There's plenty of opportunity if you see the field a lot, but if you don't get open, you generally won't get targets if there are guys who are getting open.

(06-24-2022, 05:35 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: How much of that is a product of mediocre or bad players, though? There's plenty of opportunity if you see the field a lot, but if you don't get open, you generally won't get targets if there are guys who are getting open.

Fair.

The bad players (IMO) when it comes to receiving are:
- Sample
- Thomas
- Wilcox
- Irwin
- Morgan
- Taylor (his value was really just as RS)
- Tate

I don't think the RBs are bad receivers.
Perine might be slower but he still saw 31 targets, which was 6th most on team.

If Bengals had better TE2, perhaps we'd see TEs jump ahead of RBs. But I don't think it'd be higher than 20%

(06-24-2022, 05:35 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: How much of that is a product of mediocre or bad players, though? There's plenty of opportunity if you see the field a lot, but if you don't get open, you generally won't get targets if there are guys who are getting open.

With a TE it is often not his talent level that determines how many targets he will get, but rather the talent level of the WRs in front of him.

A very good TE playing for the Bengals would not get as many targets as a lesser talented TE playing for a team like the Ravens because the TE is rarely the primary target.

More worried about almost every other position if the starter gets hurt more so than TE.

(06-24-2022, 04:06 PM)Au165 Wrote: Nah, Auden Tate was far more qualified for the hype because he actually showed some flashes before the hype started. The only reason people care about Moss is because of his name and he was on a team with Burrow 3 or 4 years ago. 

In fairness, Tater got a good deal of board hype when he was first drafted of the "ZOMG, he's so big nobody can stop him on jump bawlz", variety.

(06-24-2022, 07:26 PM)Whatever Wrote: In fairness, Tater got a good deal of board hype when he was first drafted of the "ZOMG, he's so big nobody can stop him on jump bawlz", variety.

Yeah, I hyped Auden a bit and he DID make some nice circus catches while he was here but he never scored TD's in the RZ
for some damn reason. Dude was 6'5" and could jump and catch the ball well. Don't know what happened with him, I think 
he had 1 TD with us and that is it. Where is Auden now? Do you know?

(06-24-2022, 04:38 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: TEs (Uzomah+Sample+Wilcox) combined took 1,350 offensive snaps for the Bengals in 2021. 
Tee Higgins and Tyler Boyd combined took 1,517 offensive snaps for the Bengals in 2021.

Despite having 3 very good WRs, the other WRs and the TEs took SUBSTANTIAL snaps in 2021. The non-Chase/Higgins/Boyd WRs combined for 508 offensive snaps in 2021.

So if you're looking at TEs and WRs on the Bengals last year that aren't the big 3 WRs, they combined for 1,858 offensive snaps in 2021. The big 3 WRs combined for 2,456 and were about as healthy as you can reasonably expect to ever be (missed 4 games out of 51). That's 43% of the WR/TE snap totals weren't Chase, Higgins, or Boyd. That's significant.

The easiest upgrade the Bengals have available right now is improving WR and TE depth, because they will see some serious action, and it doesn't take a whole lot (comparatively) to upgrade 4th/5th WRs and 2nd TEs from what they currently have.

We played 2 TEs because our line sucked. With Collins, we won't need to do that hopefully.

This is deffinetly not something to stress over lol.. Our WRs and RB are legit superstars...

(06-24-2022, 07:41 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: We played 2 TEs because our line sucked. With Collins, we won't need to do that hopefully.

I am so excited to watch La'el destroying Steelers opening day...

(06-24-2022, 07:32 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Yeah, I hyped Auden a bit and he DID make some nice circus catches while he was here but he never scored TD's in the RZ
for some damn reason. Dude was 6'5" and could jump and catch the ball well. Don't know what happened with him, I think 
he had 1 TD with us and that is it. Where is Auden now? Do you know?

Tate's in Atlanta now. The guy is what he is... A 7th rounder that managed to hang on in the league for awhile. That's nothing to sneeze at.

Most teams in the NFL have a TE/FB/H-back who plays about 25%-35% of the snaps and do nothing much except block. No one knows them because they don't accumulate many stats, but pretty much every team has one.

So Sample is probably going to get 300+ snaps no matter what. He may not have been worth a 2nd round pick, but he does block well.

(06-24-2022, 09:14 AM)impactplaya Wrote: Ask the Cleveland Browns how far having a deep TE room got them in the last
2 seasons ?
The truth is , it's impossible to be deep at every position in the NFL.
That's great ,the Ravens are well stocked at TE. But if Andrews goes down
They are in no better shape than Cincy in the TE room unless I'm forgetting a FA
They signed in the off season
Behind Andrews are a couple rookies drafted this year.
Ask Pat and Jim about the Ravens WR depth .

Excellent point.  We live in 11 personnel for the most part anyways.  Like we always say about guys like Perine and Evans...the coaches know them and feel comfortable with the depth at the position.  

I know a great weapon at TE can be huge for Red Zone and makes it very challenging for teams to defend you, but I look at the impact that Pitts had in Atlanta compared to the impact Chase had in Cincy and I will spend our cap dollars on elite WRs and go "cheap" at TEs like Hurst that want a chance to prove himself or draft picks.  

And while Sample always seems to be slighted around here, he is a solid blocker and receiver.  He just isn't a vertical threat.  Not every TE needs to be.  

Should Hurst get injured and Samples struggles, I actually feel like Wilcox has something to him and could be, at the very least, serviceable. 

My hope for Moss is he dedicated himself to improving special teams play and becomes a steady part of that group so he gets a roster spot and some chances on offense should one of the top two TEs struggle or have injuries.  I still think Moss is a very capable TE, but he is a little one-dimensional when it comes to not playing special teams.  Maybe he can, and just got injured right before being able to prove that.

My biggest depth concern is at the guard spot.  We have a fairly high draft pick on Carman, and an intriguing prospect in Volson.  Behind that, there isn't much.  Hill, I guess, will make the roster as a backup center and guard, but I see Adeniji and Smith as more tackle prospects.  

(06-25-2022, 10:08 AM)SHRacerX Wrote:  

And while Sample always seems to be slighted around here, he is a solid blocker and receiver.  He just isn't a vertical threat.  Not every TE needs to be.  

 

Lmfao what?

Solid blocker, yes.

You must’ve been concussed recently if you think Sample is a decent receiver

(06-24-2022, 09:14 AM)impactplaya Wrote: Ask the Cleveland Browns how far having a deep TE room got them in the last
2 seasons ?
The truth is , it's impossible to be deep at every position in the NFL.
That's great ,the Ravens are well stocked at TE. But if Andrews goes down
They are in no better shape than Cincy in the TE room unless I'm forgetting a FA
They signed in the off season
Behind Andrews are a couple rookies drafted this year.
Ask Pat and Jim about the Ravens WR depth .

(06-25-2022, 10:08 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Excellent point.  We live in 11 personnel for the most part anyways.  Like we always say about guys like Perine and Evans...the coaches know them and feel comfortable with the depth at the position.  

I know a great weapon at TE can be huge for Red Zone and makes it very challenging for teams to defend you, but I look at the impact that Pitts had in Atlanta compared to the impact Chase had in Cincy and I will spend our cap dollars on elite WRs and go "cheap" at TEs like Hurst that want a chance to prove himself or draft picks.  

And while Sample always seems to be slighted around here, he is a solid blocker and receiver.  He just isn't a vertical threat.  Not every TE needs to be.  

Should Hurst get injured and Samples struggles, I actually feel like Wilcox has something to him and could be, at the very least, serviceable. 

My hope for Moss is he dedicated himself to improving special teams play and becomes a steady part of that group so he gets a roster spot and some chances on offense should one of the top two TEs struggle or have injuries.  I still think Moss is a very capable TE, but he is a little one-dimensional when it comes to not playing special teams.  Maybe he can, and just got injured right before being able to prove that.

My biggest depth concern is at the guard spot.  We have a fairly high draft pick on Carman, and an intriguing prospect in Volson.  Behind that, there isn't much.  Hill, I guess, will make the roster as a backup center and guard, but I see Adeniji and Smith as more tackle prospects.  

Yep all teams have depth issues at a few spots. We’ve got problems if a WR goes down or just about anywhere on the OL and RB. The drop off is significant. But I can assure you so do the other teams. This is for certain Taylor/FO has brought this team’s roster full circle since Lewis. I’m not blaming Marvin solely.No doubt they’ve gotten behind Zac better but he had a huge impact on their direction.

But there’s cap space and if there’s a major injury they will address it.