(08-22-2022, 06:22 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Brandon Allen is 1-5 as a Bengal.
His only win was against the 4-12 Texans in 2020.
It was an offensive shootout 37-31.

The only wins those Texans had that year were against the 1-15 Jags (twice), the 5-11 Lions, and the 7-9 Patriots.

Yeah I was just looking that up. I remember Perine had a decent game I believe. Allen had a decent stat line that game. But the next against the Ravens he did not. He was 6 of 21 for 46yds and 2 picks. With a 0 passer rating. I don't really care for Allen but it's mainly because I think we could do better. I don't really mind him being our backup QB. I just wanted to see more of Plitt and instead get to see Allen who I think the team probably knows what they have in him by now.

(08-22-2022, 05:45 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Be careful saying you think Moss's blocking looks improved after that cut block he did to Thibodeaux.
Quite a few national media think Moss did a dirty play.

The cut block was perfectly legal and evidence of his blocking being proved. There were a couple people who said it was dirty and they have been made to look like idiots. 

(08-22-2022, 06:31 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: Yeah I was just looking that up. I remember Perine had a decent game I believe. Allen had a decent stat line that game. But the next against the Ravens he did not. He was 6 of 21 for 46yds and 2 picks. With a 0 passer rating. I don't really care for Allen but it's mainly because I think we could do better. I don't really mind him being our backup QB. I just wanted to see more of Plitt and instead get to see Allen who I think the team probably knows what they have in him by now.

Having a solid backup QB can end up making a huge difference in the postseason.
If the 49ers didn't have Kaepernick when Smith went down, they probably wouldn't have made it to the Super Bowl.
If the Eagles didn't have Foles when Wentz went down, they probably wouldn't have won their Super Bowl.
Brandon Allen ain't winning no postseason game.

Volsons pff grade was like a 30. He had a 16 for pass blocking.. We got a problem at left guard..

(08-22-2022, 06:52 PM)Tony Wrote: Volsons pff grade was like a 30. He had a 16 for pass blocking.. We got a problem at left guard..

Volson's PFF stats through two preseason games:

101 offensive snaps played
65 pass block
36 run block
1 penalty
1 sack allowed
3 pressures allowed
38.5 pass block grade
74.6 run block grade
60.6 overall grade

For perspective, two veteran OL who many have talked about that are still sitting out there to be picked up...

Quinton Spain in regular season last year:
72.3 overall, 58.9 pass block, 76.3 run block

Ereck Flowers in regular season last year:
72.0 overall, 78.1 pass block, 64.4 run block

(08-22-2022, 06:22 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Brandon Allen is 1-5 as a Bengal.
His only win was against the 4-12 Texans in 2020.
It was an offensive shootout 37-31.

The only wins those Texans had that year were against the 1-15 Jags (twice), the 5-11 Lions, and the 7-9 Patriots.

It was the reason I had hope for Allen but looking at all 3 of the QB's he clearly looks the worst to me right now...

He seems to panic like Dalton when plays break down but worse and he can't run or throw on the run like Browning can.

Plitt also looks much more comfortable in the pocket.

(08-22-2022, 06:56 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Volson's PFF stats through two preseason games:

101 offensive snaps played
65 pass block
36 run block
1 penalty
1 sack allowed
3 pressures allowed
38.5 pass block grade
74.6 run block grade
60.6 overall grade

For perspective, two veteran OL who many have talked about that are still sitting out there to be picked up...

Quinton Spain in regular season last year:
72.3 overall, 58.9 pass block, 76.3 run block

Ereck Flowers in regular season last year:
72.0 overall, 78.1 pass block, 64.4 run block

But Carman sucks man...

(08-22-2022, 06:56 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Volson's PFF stats through two preseason games:

101 offensive snaps played
65 pass block
36 run block
1 penalty
1 sack allowed
3 pressures allowed
38.5 pass block grade
74.6 run block grade
60.6 overall grade

For perspective, two veteran OL who many have talked about that are still sitting out there to be picked up...

Quinton Spain in regular season last year:
72.3 overall, 58.9 pass block, 76.3 run block

Ereck Flowers in regular season last year:
72.0 overall, 78.1 pass block, 64.4 run block

That PFF grade seems really far off compared to what everyone else has been saying. I'm sure he wasn't a 80+ player but 38 for passing seems absurdly low. I'd be interested to see how they got to that grade. 

Do they split it by half at all? I didn't really watch all of the second half but thought he played fairly well in the 1st outside of about 2 plays. I wonder if he got tired in the 2nd and it brought his grade down. Maybe a conditioning problem since he played the whole game and was going against people with fresh legs and very motivated. 

PFFs pass block score makes no sense. He had two plays that went less than well on pass blocking out of 40. A 36 is low.

(08-22-2022, 12:30 PM)BengalsBong Wrote:  I get it we do not want these special team's kickers to get hurt but you do not want to take the fight out of the dog. Chrisman had a real nice tackle on the sideline and beat two other special team's tacklers to the guy. This guy wants a punters job badly.

Don't care if we lose the punter trying to win a job as much as the best kicker in Bengals histor and who should be kicking for Bengals for the next 15 years. 

But if you saw Evan's attempt at the tackle you already know his heart was not in it. 

(08-22-2022, 06:56 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Volson's PFF stats through two preseason games:

101 offensive snaps played
65 pass block
36 run block
1 penalty
1 sack allowed
3 pressures allowed
38.5 pass block grade
74.6 run block grade
60.6 overall grade

For perspective, two veteran OL who many have talked about that are still sitting out there to be picked up...

Quinton Spain in regular season last year:
72.3 overall, 58.9 pass block, 76.3 run block

Ereck Flowers in regular season last year:
72.0 overall, 78.1 pass block, 64.4 run block

When Spain was Volson's age he had a 63 grade that season, which Volson could easily surpass by the seasons end if he already has a 60.6 in first few games. 

(08-22-2022, 08:14 PM)TheFan Wrote: That PFF grade seems really far off compared to what everyone else has been saying. I'm sure he wasn't a 80+ player but 38 for passing seems absurdly low. I'd be interested to see how they got to that grade. 

Do they split it by half at all? I didn't really watch all of the second half but thought he played fairly well in the 1st outside of about 2 plays. I wonder if he got tired in the 2nd and it brought his grade down. Maybe a conditioning problem since he played the whole game and was going against people with fresh legs and very motivated. 

I don't care what people say, but that is low big time. He played really good early, not so good when he had poor play 
around him similar to what Carman did in the first preseason game honestly. Conditioning could be a problem, he was 
out there all game pretty much. Good on the coaches preparing him for an entire game.

(08-22-2022, 08:34 PM)Joelist Wrote: PFFs pass block score makes no sense. He had two plays that went less than well on pass blocking out of 40. A 36 is low.

Yep.

(08-22-2022, 08:35 PM)Go Cards Wrote: Don't care if we lose the punter trying to win a job as much as the best kicker in Bengals histor and who should be kicking for Bengals for the next 15 years. 

But if you saw Evan's attempt at the tackle you already know his heart was not in it. 

Truth, Evan is irreplaceable. Don't want to see that again and I know everyone on the Bengals feel the same.

(08-22-2022, 08:43 PM)Go Cards Wrote: When Spain was Volson's age he had a 63 grade that season, which Volson could easily surpass by the seasons end if he already has a 60.6 in first few games. 

I think he will be good as a rookie unlike Carman. Volson seems to have everything going for him unlike Carman so far.

Everybody likes him, he is healthy going into the season, he is extremely versatile, smart and works his ass off to improve in 
anything he isn't perfect at. I think Carman is doing the same but he has been handed a much tougher hand to work with.

(08-22-2022, 08:43 PM)Go Cards Wrote: When Spain was Volson's age he had a 63 grade that season, which Volson could easily surpass by the seasons end if he already has a 60.6 in first few games. 

Fair, but do we really care about what Volson COULD be? Or do we need someone solid-or-better for 2022 and 2023?

(08-22-2022, 10:02 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Fair, but do we really care about what Volson COULD be? Or do we need someone solid-or-better for 2022 and 2023?

It's a long season... my $$$ would be that he's an average starter by the playoffs

(08-22-2022, 08:14 PM)TheFan Wrote: That PFF grade seems really far off compared to what everyone else has been saying. I'm sure he wasn't a 80+ player but 38 for passing seems absurdly low. I'd be interested to see how they got to that grade. 

Do they split it by half at all? I didn't really watch all of the second half but thought he played fairly well in the 1st outside of about 2 plays. I wonder if he got tired in the 2nd and it brought his grade down. Maybe a conditioning problem since he played the whole game and was going against people with fresh legs and very motivated. 

For comparison's sake, Joe Thuney had PFF's highest Pass Block grade by a G last year at 88.8.  He allowed a 2.13% pressure percentage.  

They originally credited Volson with 1 sack and 2 pressures allowed on 40 pass block snaps.  That's a 7.5% pressure percentage.  That's bad.  

I had him for a sack and a pressure allowed in the first half, so fatigue wasn't his only issue.

A big thing people are overlooking is that the team allowed 16 total pressures, so three of those out of those being on Volson is right in line with the rest of the OL.  He didn't stand out as bad because everyone else was just as bad.  However, we're not discussing any of those guys for a starting job.

(08-22-2022, 10:06 PM)QueenCity Wrote: It's a long season... my $$$ would be that he's an average starter by the playoffs

What determines average caliber starter?

Around the 15-20 range for LGs?
Around 30-40 range for OGs overall?
Specific PFF grade?
So many sacks allowed?

(08-22-2022, 08:34 PM)Joelist Wrote: PFFs pass block score makes no sense. He had two plays that went less than well on pass blocking out of 40. A 36 is low.

He was credited with a sack allowed and two more pressures allowed.  

Look at it this way, if a player allowed 17 sacks and another 34 pressures over the course of the regular season, what do you think his grade should be?  

(08-22-2022, 01:14 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I saw him go 29-37 (78.4%) for 371 yards, 2 tds, and 0 interceptions against the Texans.

I like the Gopher and stick story better. It's the one you expect to see only once in a lifetime. 

(08-22-2022, 08:35 PM)Go Cards Wrote: Don't care if we lose the punter trying to win a job as much as the best kicker in Bengals histor and who should be kicking for Bengals for the next 15 years. 

But if you saw Evan's attempt at the tackle you already know his heart was not in it. 

Right Evan just got in the way so the special team's guys could catch up. 

(08-22-2022, 10:16 PM)Whatever Wrote: He was credited with a sack allowed and two more pressures allowed.  

Look at it this way, if a player allowed 17 sacks and another 34 pressures over the course of the regular season, what do you think his grade should be?  

Volson has 101 snaps through the preseason so far.
A full season for a starter is ~1000 snaps.

So if he had a full season like he's performed in the preseason, we'd be looking at 10 sacks, 30 total pressures.

By no definition is that good.

Do I think Volson would be given that many reps if he was allowing that kind of pressure and sacks through the first 4-6 games? 
No, but he hasn't exactly been the epitome of good through this preseason.