Joe Burrow, with adequate protection, is elite. I can’t think of another quarterback I would want leading the Bengals’ offense. Joe Burrow, with inadequate protection, is average at best. I still want him leading the Bengals’ offense BUT...

...the offensive line is not protecting him and this is where I’m referencing the “mismatch.” If an offensive line is really bad — and this one is — a pocket quarterback is going to get mauled. Someone like Kyler Murray or Lamar Jackson might have a chance behind these five waddling tubs of false starting goo but Joe Burrow is a sitting duck.

No, I don’t want a new quarterback. Don’t go there because I’m not.

All I’m saying is the scheme is bad up front and it just doesn’t match what Joe Burrow does.

Frank Pollack isn’t the answer and we’ve seen this in 2018, 2021, and so far in 2022. My suggestion is to let Alex Cappa and Ted Karras run the offensive line and design the protection; they protected Tom Brady and Mac Jones who are very much like Joe in the pocket.

(09-20-2022, 07:36 PM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: Joe Burrow, with adequate protection, is elite.  I can’t think of another quarterback I would want leading the Bengals’ offense.  Joe Burrow, with inadequate protection, is average at best.  I still want him leading the Bengals’ offense BUT...

My suggestion is to let Alex Cappa and Ted Karras run the offensive line and design the protection; they protected Tom Brady and Mac Jones who are very much like Joe in the pocket.

Joe was the #1 QB when not pressured and the 5th best QB last year when facing pressure. He obviously hasn't been the same so far this year but to say he's "average at best" and comparing him to Mac Jones completely kills any credibility in the argument. 

Joe has just been bad this year. Regardless of pressure. He's been average to below average when pressured or not pressured through 2 games.

The problem is Joe has lost confidence in his protection ( imagine that) . Joe has always not been great in decisiveness. He’s a smart QB but he needs to trust the play. These coaches have faced the Tampa 2 or Deep Cover 2 since jr high days as QB’s. Joe has not. But the OL is a problem in that they didn’t have the luxury to not give them more experience together in preseason. I would assume that falls on Zac’s naivety that the 3 new guys were vets and there not be issues.

Now the other problem is slow starts are a pattern with Joe. At some point you have to say he’s just a slow starter.

We know players especially QBs can improve as they play more and more games but we also know players can regress also. It has only been two games so hopefully Joe is just off to a slow start but if this continues for the next few games then I will start to worry about if he is regressing especially with the weapons he has in this offense

Idc if they go 0-17.. I'll have Burrows back until he retires..

(09-20-2022, 07:36 PM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: Joe Burrow, with adequate protection, is elite. I can’t think of another quarterback I would want leading the Bengals’ offense. Joe Burrow, with inadequate protection, is average at best. I still want him leading the Bengals’ offense BUT...

He was literally one of the best QB’s in the league last season with an even worse OL than we have now.

Certainly expected the O-line to be improved the season and betting Joe did as well

(09-20-2022, 07:36 PM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: Frank Pollack isn’t the answer and we’ve seen this in 2018, 2021, and so far in 2022. My suggestion is to let Alex Cappa and Ted Karras run the offensive line and design the protection; they protected Tom Brady and Mac Jones who are very much like Joe in the pocket.

(09-20-2022, 07:36 PM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: Joe Burrow, with adequate protection, is elite.  I can’t think of another quarterback I would want leading the Bengals’ offense.  Joe Burrow, with inadequate protection, is average at best.  I still want him leading the Bengals’ offense BUT...

...the offensive line is not protecting him and this is where I’m referencing the “mismatch.”  If an offensive line is really bad — and this one is — a pocket quarterback is going to get mauled.  Someone like Kyler Murray or Lamar Jackson might have a chance behind these five waddling tubs of false starting goo but Joe Burrow is a sitting duck.

No, I don’t want a new quarterback.  Don’t go there because I’m not.

All I’m saying is the scheme is bad up front and it just doesn’t match what Joe Burrow does.  

Frank Pollack isn’t the answer and we’ve seen this in 2018, 2021, and so far in 2022.  My suggestion is to let Alex Cappa and Ted Karras run the offensive line and design the protection; they protected Tom Brady and Mac Jones who are very much like Joe in the pocket.

Eh I don't know about that. Burrow is faster than Brady and while he's probably a little slower than Mac Jones, he's absolutely a smarter runner and sees things Mac Jones cannot see, he does that as well as anyone. And he's more escapable than both of them.

(09-20-2022, 07:36 PM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: Joe Burrow, with adequate protection, is elite.  I can’t think of another quarterback I would want leading the Bengals’ offense.  Joe Burrow, with inadequate protection, is average at best.  I still want him leading the Bengals’ offense BUT...

...the offensive line is not protecting him and this is where I’m referencing the “mismatch.”  If an offensive line is really bad — and this one is — a pocket quarterback is going to get mauled.  Someone like Kyler Murray or Lamar Jackson might have a chance behind these five waddling tubs of false starting goo but Joe Burrow is a sitting duck.

No, I don’t want a new quarterback.  Don’t go there because I’m not.

All I’m saying is the scheme is bad up front and it just doesn’t match what Joe Burrow does.  

Frank Pollack isn’t the answer and we’ve seen this in 2018, 2021, and so far in 2022.  My suggestion is to let Alex Cappa and Ted Karras run the offensive line and design the protection; they protected Tom Brady and Mac Jones who are very much like Joe in the pocket.

Has someone hacked your account or is this just the beginning of the 'long con troll' reveal?

Is this a real thread?

(09-20-2022, 11:36 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Has someone hacked your account or is this just the beginning of the 'long con troll' reveal?

Is this a real thread?

Unfortunately, this is just an FIK quality thread.

(09-20-2022, 07:56 PM)TheFan Wrote: Joe was the #1 QB when not pressured and the 5th best QB last year when facing pressure. He obviously hasn't been the same so far this year but to say he's "average at best" and comparing him to Mac Jones completely kills any credibility in the argument. 

Joe has just been bad this year. Regardless of pressure. He's been average to below average when pressured or not pressured through 2 games.

Yeah, he has plenty of time to throw ......a pick six. Hoping he's just regaining strength and getting back to game speed. 

(09-20-2022, 11:43 PM)KillerGoose Wrote: Unfortunately, this is just an FIK quality thread.

Thing is, i don't remember his threads being this terrible until recently (relatively speaking--could be a couple years...).

(09-20-2022, 07:36 PM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: Joe Burrow, with adequate protection, is elite.  I can’t think of another quarterback I would want leading the Bengals’ offense.  Joe Burrow, with inadequate protection, is average at best.  I still want him leading the Bengals’ offense BUT...

...the offensive line is not protecting him and this is where I’m referencing the “mismatch.”  If an offensive line is really bad — and this one is — a pocket quarterback is going to get mauled.  Someone like Kyler Murray or Lamar Jackson might have a chance behind these five waddling tubs of false starting goo but Joe Burrow is a sitting duck.

No, I don’t want a new quarterback.  Don’t go there because I’m not.

All I’m saying is the scheme is bad up front and it just doesn’t match what Joe Burrow does.  

Frank Pollack isn’t the answer and we’ve seen this in 2018, 2021, and so far in 2022.  My suggestion is to let Alex Cappa and Ted Karras run the offensive line and design the protection; they protected Tom Brady and Mac Jones who are very much like Joe in the pocket.

Did you watch at all last season? Joe was constantly under pressure and had an amazing year. One of his strengths is pocket presence and his ability to extend plays. 

The issue with this team right now is two fold. The OL has been anything but perfect, but a lot of it is on Joe Burrow himself. He looks terrible in the pocket...even when its a good one. He is skiddish, drops his eyes, doesnt set his feet, etc. 

Part of that is due to the OL issues right now and from the past. Part of that is on him. 

Everyone needs to chill and give it a few more games before we start calling for OL player "coaches". Jeesh. 

(09-21-2022, 11:36 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Did you watch at all last season? Joe was constantly under pressure and had an amazing year. One of his strengths is pocket presence and his ability to extend plays. 

The issue with this team right now is two fold. The OL has been anything but perfect, but a lot of it is on Joe Burrow himself. He looks terrible in the pocket...even when its a good one. He is skiddish, drops his eyes, doesnt set his feet, etc. 

Part of that is due to the OL issues right now and from the past. Part of that is on him. 

Everyone needs to chill and give it a few more games before we start calling for OL player "coaches". Jeesh. 

It's actually a three fold problem. The two you mentioned and the play calling which has to improve. Need more roll outs to both buy time and create better/shorter passing angles. Nothing wrong on 1st/2nd down to take the easy 5-6 yards. There will be plenty of opportunities to go downfield but being off schedule so much kills that.

(09-21-2022, 12:03 AM)Wyche Wrote: Hoping he's just regaining strength and getting back to game speed. 

That's my thinking (and hoping) as well. I think the appendectomy really took its toll on Joe and it's taking him longer than we expected to fully recover and get back into game shape. And, hey, maybe that's on us for expecting him to be vintage Joe at the start of the season, but at this point, it's what I truly hope is the main issue for his play (OL issues aside) because the alternative worries me.

(09-20-2022, 08:15 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: The problem is Joe has lost confidence in his protection ( imagine that) . Joe has always not been great in decisiveness. He’s a smart QB but he needs to trust the play. These coaches have faced the Tampa 2 or Deep Cover 2 since jr high days as QB’s. Joe has not. But the OL is a problem in that they didn’t have the luxury to not give them more experience together in preseason. I would assume that falls on Zac’s naivety that the 3 new guys were vets and there not be issues.

Now the other problem is slow starts are a pattern with Joe. At some point you have to say he’s just a slow starter.

Slow starts are generally a result of a lack of preparation.  I don't think it's Joe Burrow that is not preparing.  The question is:  Is this coaching staff coming up with the appropriate game plans week in and week out?  Don't know.  Going back to last year the evidence suggest they are not.  They are making corrections and adjusting but you can't count on it every week to bail you out.

(09-21-2022, 02:10 PM)Daddy-O Wrote: Slow starts are generally a result of a lack of preparation.  I don't think it's Joe Burrow that is not preparing.  The question is:  Is this coaching staff coming up with the appropriate game plans week in and week out?  Don't know.  Going back to last year the evidence suggest they are not.  They are making corrections and adjusting but you can't count on it every week to bail you out.

It’s Joe. Several experts Goodberry, Baldy, and others all mentioned it. It just takes him awhile to settle down.

(09-21-2022, 03:43 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: It’s Joe. Several experts Goodberry, Baldy, and others all mentioned it. It just takes him awhile to settle down.

Then he needs to do something to figure out a new routine that works for him. I've never heard of a QB basically forgetting how to play for the first couple series every game. 

(09-20-2022, 10:01 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: He was literally one of the best QB’s in the league last season with an even worse OL than we have now.

Were they worse than this so far? So far Jonah has regressed, Cordell is whatever, Ted is a definite upgrade (same with Cappa), and I see why Dallas let collins go.