I dont get it. Lou has been great for us the last 2 seasons but it doesnt make sense to me.

He is older, pushing 60.
A defensive coach when the league is going hard to the offense.
He has had one good and one really good season as a DC, others were bad.
He is a lifer DB coach.
There are other DC's with better defenses available.
There are black candidates.
He isn't the most charismatic coach.

Defensive head coaches have not fared well recently:
Staley
Bowles
Belichick
Tomlin
Harbaugh
McDermott cant get over the hump.

And most of all Kyler is a little *****.


Hope he stays with us, I actually do get it if he is offered, but still...

(02-04-2023, 10:10 PM)casear2727 Wrote: I dont get it.  Lou has been great for us the last 2 seasons but it doesnt make sense to me.

He is older, pushing 60.
A defensive coach when the league is going hard to the offense.
He has had one good and one really good season as a DC, others were bad.
He is a lifer DB coach.
There are other DC's with better defenses available.
There are black candidates.
He isn't the most charismatic coach.

Defensive head coaches have not fared well recently:
Staley
Bowles
Belichick
Tomlin
Harbaugh
McDermott cant get over the hump.

And most of all Kyler is a little *****.


Hope he stays with us, I actually do get it if he is offered, but still...

Well he hasn't been hired yet. It's a Zoom interview too.

We're all pointing out what a miserable shit Kyler is, so maybe that's why and offensive minded HC worth his salt doesn't want to go there and have to deal with him. I can see why AZ would have to get a first time DC to be their HC and then he will stick a position coach who will do anything for a promotion to be the OC who has to deal with Kyler.

NOOOO please stay

I joke, but who do we get to replace him? I assume we'd be a pretty hot spot and be able to attract a good DC now unlike 2019, but seeing as Lou was ZT's like 7th choice do we let him pick our next DC?

(02-04-2023, 09:20 PM)WVUHomer Wrote: If Lou gets it, is he considered a minority candidate? Extra 3rds to account for losing him would be nice...

Is this a serious question?

(02-04-2023, 11:44 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Is this a serious question?

FWIW yes and only because SF got the comp picks for McDaniels last year. I for some reason was thinking he was part of the minority (Idiotically, I know remember he was Italian decent) listing by NFL coaching program. Time to move along lol...

(02-04-2023, 10:17 PM)Nately120 Wrote: We're all pointing out what a miserable shit Kyler is, so maybe that's why and offensive minded HC worth his salt doesn't want to go there and have to deal with him.  I can see why AZ would have to get a first time DC to be their HC and then he will stick a position coach who will do anything for a promotion to be the OC who has to deal with Kyler.

What if the first question in the interview was.... Coach Lou.... what would be your first move as Head Coach to improve our football team?  Lou responds, get our GM to trade our star QB and go right into rebuild mode and do it the right way.  And all the interviewers' ears perked up?

Kafka, on the other hand, has Daniel Jones designs ready to work with Kyler.

I bet that is the 2 options facing the Cardinal's organization.

Good for him. I hope he gets it.

I wonder what the succession plan is for us, though. I haven't heard much about that. I assume it would be an internal promotion (Hobby? Livingston? Someone else?) but I don't know that for sure. With Bates also leaving, that would create even more of a hole.

I've always seen Bates as the de facto Captain of this defense- like an extension of Lou on the field- even if he never got recognized as such. I wonder how it would all work. Might want to change our defensive philosophy altogether (yikes!). I mean, for a team with a notoriously under-resourced scouting staff, you gotta figure our coordinators are even more important than normal. Hill, Apple... these are Lou's guys. Signing Hendrickson, Reader, Bell, Awuzie and Ogunjobi last year, drafting Wilson... all presumably hand-picked by Lou.

Couple that with losing one of your "on-field coordinators" and... man... you're losing leadership and structure from all sides. Tricky situation.

Murray is not only a head case who is the first QB in the league to have study clauses put in his contract, he's not evven healthy. It'd be a bad move for Lou that wouldn't end well. He'd be better off waiting

(02-05-2023, 01:28 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Murray is not only a head case who is the first QB in the league to have study clauses put in his contract, he's not evven healthy. It'd be a bad move for Lou that wouldn't end well. He'd be better off waiting

Dude is 56 years old. How much longer would you suggest he wait? 

(02-05-2023, 01:28 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Murray is not only a head case who is the first QB in the league to have study clauses put in his contract, he's not evven healthy. It'd be a bad move for Lou that wouldn't end well. He'd be better off waiting

Agree that it's a bad situation.  Agree that it will likely end poorly if he takes the position.  Kyler is limited by his own stubbornness.  Kingsbury was brought in to make him another Mahomes and failed miserably.  Kingsbury was also a young guy was more likely to relate to Kyler a-la the modern qb whisperer blueprint (McVay).  Again, fail.  

Lou is on the wrong side of 50.  He also went through some purging with the established culture when he arrived here.  That seems like a shit choice for the Cardinals and their qb.

Even with all that in mind, this might be Lou's best shot.  There are only 32 NFL HC jobs on the planet.  Sometimes, even if you know it's likely to be a disaster, you have to shoot your shot.  

(02-04-2023, 11:42 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I joke, but who do we get to replace him?  I assume we'd be a pretty hot spot and be able to attract a good DC now unlike 2019, but seeing as Lou was ZT's like 7th choice do we let him pick our next DC?

You know what's funny... if the Cards sign Lou, chances are he lets Joseph go and brings in his own staff (including possibly his guys from Cincy like Livingston or Burks or whomever). Then Zac would be free to sign Joseph- who he'd reportedly ranked higher than Lou in 2019- as our next DC.

Everything would come full circle. 

As I said before, he should stay away from that cesspool.

(02-05-2023, 02:13 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Dude is 56 years old. How much longer would you suggest he wait? 

56 is still relatively young. I'm 63, and if someone offered me a promotion to a higher position, that I was pretty sure was not going to work out, I'd turn it down. BECAUSE he's 56, he needs to be extra cautious about where he would go, becauae he's probably only going to get 1 chance. If he DCs here another year and the defense stays as it is, he will have more and better options. Murray is a head case that will not be ready to go for the majority of next season. That said, they aren't going to be able to bring in anyone good to start the season, because they know halfway or three quarters of the way through the season the rug will be yanked from under them when Murray comes back. It's a horrible situation for a new HC to go in to, and Arizona is not Mike Brown, the coach wont get three years...

(02-05-2023, 11:20 AM)Destro Wrote: As I said before, he should stay away from that cesspool.

That's the same thing people said about the Bengals.  

Maybe Lou could go the ZT route on that franchise.  Like the Bengals hiring a QB coach to be their HC, Lou is seen as a "desperation hire" who is going to a franchise the national media loves to crap on, he's starting with a QB who is clearly not "the guy" but that team is primed to get a top 5 or better pick in 2024.  He can go there, give the culture an enema, get a high draft pick his first and maybe second year through the natural tanking of having a ho-hum and injured QB, and then rebuild with a top tier QB and new culture like we did.

We've moved on from pain in the ass players, and we've gone from worst to damn near first and all the while we pointed out that media was wrong in saying it couldn't be done.  Alas, here we are doing the same thing by saying the Cardinals are a cesspool of a franchise that can never be fixed.

If Lou goes there and they give him time to rebuild that place and move on from the prior regime's losing culture, losing players, and rebuild things like we did...well, why not?  I get that we want Lou to stay here, but there is no need to let that turn us into the same dumbasses who swore up and down that the Bengals were hopeless. 

(02-05-2023, 11:40 AM)Sled21 Wrote: 56 is still relatively young. I'm 63, and if someone offered me a promotion to a higher position, that I was pretty sure was not going to work out, I'd turn it down. BECAUSE he's 56, he needs to be extra cautious about where he would go, becauae he's probably only going to get 1 chance. If he DCs here another year and the defense stays as it is, he will have more and better options. Murray is a head case that will not be ready to go for the majority of next season. That said, they aren't going to be able to bring in anyone good to start the season, because they know halfway or three quarters of the way through the season the rug will be yanked from under them when Murray comes back. It's a horrible situation for a new HC to go in to, and Arizona is not Mike Brown, the coach wont get three years...

If he took the job today he'd be the 10th oldest coach in the NFL. I'd assert it's probably time to get started. If he has any asperations of being an NFL HC he'd be a fool to turn down a job where offered. They just replaced their GM. Other than Buddy Ryan's tenure as head coach and GM in 1994 and 1995, Ossenfort is the first Cardinals' GM to be hired from outside the organization since Joe Sullivan came from Washington and manned the role from 1973-79.

Teams change and Lou could be a huge part of that change. Imagine what folks were saying about the Cincy job before Zac came here.  

(02-05-2023, 12:19 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Teams change and Lou could be a huge part of that change. Imagine what folks were saying about the Cincy job before Zac came here.

Hell, if you and I are on the same page we can't be wrong.

(02-05-2023, 12:19 PM)bfine32 Wrote: If he took the job today he'd be the 10th oldest coach in the NFL. I'd assert it's probably time to get started. If he has any asperations of being an NFL HC he'd be a fool to turn down a job where offered. They just replaced their GM. Other than Buddy Ryan's tenure as head coach and GM in 1994 and 1995, Ossenfort is the first Cardinals' GM to be hired from outside the organization since Joe Sullivan came from Washington and manned the role from 1973-79.

Teams change and Lou could be a huge part of that change. Imagine what folks were saying about the Cincy job before Zac came here.  

Bobby Lee to George Pickett.... "George, you're not getting any younger, it's now or never. I just need you to go over there and take that line of cannon"

(02-05-2023, 12:13 PM)Nately120 Wrote: That's the same thing people said about the Bengals.  

Maybe Lou could go the ZT route on that franchise.  Like the Bengals hiring a QB coach to be their HC, Lou is seen as a "desperation hire" who is going to a franchise the national media loves to crap on, he's starting with a QB who is clearly not "the guy" but that team is primed to get a top 5 or better pick in 2024.  He can go there, give the culture an enema, get a high draft pick his first and maybe second year through the natural tanking of having a ho-hum and injured QB, and then rebuild with a top tier QB and new culture like we did.

We've moved on from pain in the ass players, and we've gone from worst to damn near first and all the while we pointed out that media was wrong in saying it couldn't be done.  Alas, here we are doing the same thing by saying the Cardinals are a cesspool of a franchise that can never be fixed.

If Lou goes there and they give him time to rebuild that place and move on from the prior regime's losing culture, losing players, and rebuild things like we did...well, why not?  I get that we want Lou to stay here, but there is no need to let that turn us into the same dumbasses who swore up and down that the Bengals were hopeless. 

People indeed said that about the Bengals, but the Bengals were in a far different position than the Cardinals when Zac showed up.  

The good players on the team that were making serious money could be released without a lot of cap damage if a coach wanted to purge the roster.  

The quarterback wasn't making a lot of money (for an entrenched starter), and could very easily be deposed and sent packing, giving whatever new coach what most new coaches want: a new quarterback.

Arizona's situation with Kyler is basically the worst case scenario with modern qb contracts.  He's not bad enough to dump outright, but he's not a guy that you want to hitch your fate to, either.  Unfortunately, that's already been done for whatever coach decides to take the job, and there's nothing he can do about it.  

A shitty team with a blank slate roster, tons of cap, veterans getting bank just begging to get released, and decent draft position is more attractive than a shitty team already paying sizable, guaranteed money to a questionable qb all day long.

The moral of the story is that if you're going to give a huge guaranteed deal to a quarterback, you'd better be damn sure he's the guy.