(04-28-2023, 12:59 AM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: Joseph Ossai . . . you just fell down another rung.

Ossai is a good player. Are you holding the late hit on Mahomes over him as some sort of knock against his play?

(04-28-2023, 01:17 AM)kevin Wrote: This.  Yes, CBS Sports has him listed as the 20 best player in the draft and the Bengals got him well past pick 20.   

I said in our Draft Section, don't be so sure about TE.  Bengals may take Best Available Athlete on the board that falls to them late in Round One 

Also, consider this.  After Bengals reign Burrow, Chase, Higgins, there may not be cap space to resign Hendrickson down the road.  Think of the Draft as also planning for years past 2023.  

A top 20 player fell to Bengals who happens to be a true sized DE, not a tweener at LB.  A top rated DE.  Bengals took him and it could be a real steal considering how late Bengals drafted.  After Super Bowl and then AFC Championship seasons, I'm not going to question Bengals who have been making all the right moves last few years. 

GO BENGALS

Nfl.com had him graded as the 11th prospect overall.  Great value.

(04-28-2023, 01:17 AM)BoomerFan Wrote: Never forget that the Giants won a Superbowl with a rotation of 6 DEs. Build the lines and every player who puts in the work can contribute.

I wonder if a good comparison to Myles Murphy would be Carlos Dunlap? I am just basing that on size though. 

Dunlap was a decent bit bigger if I'm not mistaken. I think he's closer in size to 2 of the players on that giants line you mentioned. Osi and Strahan. 

I may not be thrilled with the pick but it wasn't a reach. Murphy was a consensus first round pick and some had him Top 20.

I just don't feel he fit our biggest need on defense - INTERIOR pass rush. As to upside, I kinda think he's another Robert Geathers. He'll have one season where he seems to finally become a serious pass rush threat then settle into being mostly a run defender. He just does not give off that "final piece to win the Lombardi" vibe that a first round pick for THIS team should.

(04-28-2023, 01:21 AM)CarolinaBengalFanGuy Wrote: Sweet Lou is a defensive chameleon. Anything can work....

And yet… we chose Murphy.

(04-28-2023, 01:28 AM)Joelist Wrote: I may not be thrilled with the pick but it wasn't a reach. Murphy was a consensus first round pick and some had him Top 20.

I just don't feel he fit our biggest need on defense - INTERIOR pass rush. As to upside, I kinda think he's another Robert Geathers. He'll have one season where he seems to finally become a serious pass rush threat then settle into being mostly a run defender. He just does not give off that "final piece to win the Lombardi" vibe that a first round pick for THIS team should.

You don’t reach for need. 3T will be available tomorrow

(04-28-2023, 01:25 AM)BengalsLUFC Wrote: Don’t know much about him but we needed another pass rusher, was hoping it would be interior but that went out the window early doors.

If Charbonnet is there at 60 tomorrow he has to be the pick then you look for a TE and corner and I think we are set.

Still the Jonah situation to resolve too we could be getting another pick tomorrow.

Not sure why Charbonnet HAS to be the pick?  Quality TEs and CBs are likely to be available at 60.

(04-28-2023, 01:28 AM)Joelist Wrote: I may not be thrilled with the pick but it wasn't a reach. Murphy was a consensus first round pick and some had him Top 20.

I just don't feel he fit our biggest need on defense - INTERIOR pass rush. As to upside, I kinda think he's another Robert Geathers. He'll have one season where he seems to finally become a serious pass rush threat then settle into being mostly a run defender. He just does not give off that "final piece to win the Lombardi" vibe that a first round pick for THIS team should.

I'm with you on the interior pass rush need, but I'd say his upside is definitely better than geathers. 

(04-28-2023, 01:28 AM)MasonDT70 Wrote: Dunlap was a decent bit bigger if I'm not mistaken. I think he's closer in size to 2 of the players on that giants line you mentioned. Osi and Strahan. 

Yeah I just threw an edit on that post. I realize now that Murphy is closer to Sam Hubbard in size. 

Here's a mock where he went 13th overall:

https://nfldraft.theringer.com/mock-draft

Quote:The Packers value size and athleticism on the defensive front, and Murphy fits the bill in both areas. The former Tigers star has a twitchy first step as a pass rusher and plays the run with discipline and effort. He’ll be a nice addition to the team’s pass-rush group in 2023 and beyond.


SHADES OF 
MONTEZ SWEAT
BIG, SOUPED-UP PASS RUSHER with excellent length, explosive traits, and a three-down skill set.

• 
  Pro-Ready Frame
• 
  Pass-Rush Talent
• 
  Elite Athleticism
  

SCOUTING REPORT BY DANNY KELLY
Murphy is a tall, long-levered athlete with ideal bulk and a versatile skill set. A former five-star prospect out of Powder Springs, Georgia, he ranked as the top strongside defensive end in the country and the no. 7 player overall. He was a three-year contributor for the Tigers and finished strong in 2022, tallying 6.5 sacks and 11.0 tackles for loss in 13 games. That capped a career in which he notched 17.5 sacks and 36.5 TFLs in 38 games. 
Murphy rushes with an explosive first step, timing the snap well to shoot off the line and immediately threaten the edge. He has the footspeed to threaten the edge and can get low and flatten toward the quarterback. His quick get off helps him convert speed to power, and he has a devastating long-arm stab move where he fires his hand into an opponent’s chest and drives them back into the pocket. Sometimes he seems to almost lift opponents off their feet. He employs a handful of countermoves, including a solid push-pull move and a graceful spin. Against the run, Murphy uses his long arms and quick positioning to stack defenders, force runs back inside, and shed blocks to make the tackle. He’s extremely strong (reportedly bench-presses 405 pounds, power-cleans 335, and deadlifts 505, per Bruce Feldman’s Freaks List) and he always puts in maximum effort on every snap, churning his feet or working his hands until the play is over. 
While Murphy boasts a top-tier get-off, he too often loses steam once contacted by an offensive lineman. He needs to develop more countermoves off his first-step foundation. He tends to overrun the pocket and loses sight of the ball when defending the mesh point.
WHY HE COULD RISE
Murphy has a prototypical blend of size, length, and athleticism; he’s a three-down player with the skill set to start right away.
WHY HE COULD FALL
He needs to expand his rush repertoire and more consistently finish his rushes.

(04-28-2023, 01:29 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: And yet… we chose Murphy.

I love when someone else says something stupid and then I respond being silly because of the original post, then someone comes along and think I was holding the stupid thought the entire time lol.

(04-28-2023, 12:59 AM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: Joseph Ossai . . . you just fell down another rung.

Not really. Ossai is more akin to Hendrickson while Murphy is more like Hubbard. Cam Sample is the guy who will lose the most snaps, though he is probably a better run defender than all of them save Hubbard. 

Hubbard, Murphy, Sample, & Ossai will also spend some time inside as well. 

Snap counts last year: 
Hubbard: 801
Hendrickson: 629
C. Sample: 412  
Ossai: 334 
Gunter: 37  

Hill & Tufele played some end last year when Sam & Trey were hurt. 

(04-28-2023, 01:33 AM)BoomerFan Wrote: Yeah I just threw an edit on that post. I realize now that Murphy is closer to Sam Hubbard in size. 

Here's a mock where he went 13th overall:

https://nfldraft.theringer.com/mock-draft

He could be Hubbard's replacement, but I think he played mostly on the right side, so he might more so spell Hendrickson when he needs to rest. 

(04-28-2023, 01:17 AM)BoomerFan Wrote: Never forget that the Giants won a Superbowl with a rotation of 6 DEs. Build the lines and every player who puts in the work can contribute.

I wonder if a good comparison to Myles Murphy would be Carlos Dunlap? I am just basing that on size though. 

Edit: Actually he is even closer in size to Sam Hubbard.

I comp him to Montez Sweat with a little more short area agility. Like Sweat Murphy can really threaten the pocket fast with his first step but he isnt the most bendy edge. Murphy's length can overcome the lack of bend but like Sweat he has to start using the things at the end of his arms better to get hands off him.

(04-28-2023, 01:32 AM)casear2727 Wrote: Not sure why Charbonnet HAS to be the pick?  Quality TEs and CBs are likely to be available at 60.

Because I just want a RB who doesn’t fall over at the slightest touch or somehow fall over when he sees an open field.

Look I love Mix but I think ZC would be an upgrade and I’m willing to wait for a R3 TE I want somebody in the backfield who will make defences think about playing cover 2 by slashing through their line.

Anyway this thread is about Murphy and if we have a guy who can help Trey out on the other side I’m all for it.

(04-28-2023, 01:35 AM)CarolinaBengalFanGuy Wrote: I love when someone else says something stupid and then I respond being silly because of the original post, then someone comes along and think I was holding the stupid thought the entire time lol.

My bad, just putting it out there.

(04-28-2023, 01:28 AM)Joelist Wrote: I may not be thrilled with the pick but it wasn't a reach. Murphy was a consensus first round pick and some had him Top 20.

I just don't feel he fit our biggest need on defense - INTERIOR pass rush. As to upside, I kinda think he's another Robert Geathers. He'll have one season where he seems to finally become a serious pass rush threat then settle into being mostly a run defender. He just does not give off that "final piece to win the Lombardi" vibe that a first round pick for THIS team should.

Carter & Kancey were gone. The next best interior pass rush guy was Bresee, and there are injury flags. And Murphy is capable of lining up inside on passing downs. He was the #3 true DE in the draft (Wilson, Van Ness). Anderson, Smith, & McDonald are OLBs that don't fit us as well. 

Kiper had him going 20th. McShay 29th. Lots of sites had him as a top 20 guy. 

(04-28-2023, 01:27 AM)phil413 Wrote: Nfl.com had him graded as the 11th prospect overall.  Great value.

So CBS Sports had him at 20.  NFL.com had him at 11.   Bengals get him near end on Round One.   Let me add that in High School he was in the High School All American Bowl.  He was a 5 star recruit out of high school, one of the top recruits in USA out of High School and one of the Top Picks out of College.  A DE only 21 years old at 6-5 and around 275 pounds.  The SIZE and one of the Top High School and College Players in USA.   

Looks to me like Bengals got a steal picking so late in the draft.   Amazing he was still on the board.  Bengals took Best Available Athlete.  

Elite athleticism + strong intangibles = solid foundation on which to build

In a few years we are going to be saying "Trey Who?" Possibly even sooner.

Prototypical size, strong, holds run lanes, can bring immediate heat with his first step, can stunt, doesn't get lost on screens, doesn't lose contain...

He seems like a good pick.  Just needs some refinement.  He went to a good spot to learn the nuances of the position so that he can earn himself some money.