(07-12-2015, 09:53 AM)McC Wrote: Apparently, the fact that he's never played  a down in the NFL makes it acceptable to say he'll never be any good but not acceptable to say he will be good.

It's important that he never plays a regular season game because if he does, it could mean Dalton was benched.  If that were to happen, all the time and effort defending him on these boards would be down the tubes for some. 

I like Dalton as our QB.  However, we could definitely improve at the position.  I think most people realize this and that's what the big argument is all about. 
Maybe Dalton will improve this year.  Maybe not.  He won't be our QB forever.

(07-12-2015, 09:53 AM)McC Wrote: Apparently, the fact that he's never played  a down in the NFL makes it acceptable to say he'll never be any good 

Link to anyone saying that?

Stop with the silly strawmen.  I don't see hardly anyone hating on McCarron.  I have not seen a single person saying he hope he fails.  All I have seen is people saying that they need to see a 5th round pick throw a few passes in a game situation before they heap praise on him.

We need a good #2 QB.  I am guessing most people here want McCarron to develop into a good NFL QB.

I am a Vol fan. I hated McCarron in college, but even I am hoping he becomes a good NFL QB.

(07-12-2015, 12:47 AM)Bengalholic Wrote: Not a bad read at all, but it would be easier on the eyes if you separated the paragraphs.

Also, welcome aboard!

Good advice 

(07-12-2015, 10:03 AM)2MinutesHate Wrote:

It's important that he never plays a regular season game because if he does, it could mean Dalton was benched. 

Link to anyone saying they hope McCarron never plays a regular season game.

I like the fact that the OP specifically said he doesn't want to turn this into a Dalton thread.  I am sure he knew that the haters would be jumping in here with comments like this.  And it is just ridiculous.  If McCarron became our starting QB then most of the people who defend Dalton would defend him.

Remember when Palmer left and some people here supported what he did?  Do you see any of them hoping that Dalton fails?

Hope AJ, has what it takes , to lead this team. Imo I don't see it this year, so we all like him or love him, he's our qb. We need to support Dalton. If he's not up to playin like in his 2013 season and resorts back to 2014 later season. Then maybe they will move on. Hopefully . One of these two can get us over this hump.

(07-12-2015, 10:33 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Link to anyone saying that?

Stop with the silly strawmen.  I don't see hardly anyone hating on McCarron.  I have not seen a single person saying he hope he fails.  All I have seen is people saying that they need to see a 5th round pick throw a few passes in a game situation before they heap praise on him.

We need a good #2 QB.  I am guessing most people here want McCarron to develop into a good NFL QB.

I am a Vol fan.  I hated McCarron in college, but even I am hoping he becomes a good NFL QB.

Just curious how many nfl snaps for any qb , in the nfl. Has snaps prior to gettin playing time. Btw agreeing with you Fred.

I have to say, I don't think the primetime issue is an Andy Dalton issue. We've been bad in primetime/playoff games for ten whole years.

It seems the entire team tends to just fall flat in some of these games (coaching staff included). I think McCaron's time will come, whether it's with us or with another team, but Dalton will be the starter this year at least. He has earned that much.

Until AJ McC plays a game in the NFL, there is no way we can say one way or the other if he will be good or not.

I hope he turns out to be better than Tom Brady, there is that chance it happens albeit a very small chance.

ProPlayerFormerlyKnownAsMousecopI have to say, I don't think the primetime issue is an Andy Dalton issue. We've been bad in primetime/playoff games for ten whole years.

It seems the entire team tends to just fall flat in some of these games (coaching staff included). I think McCaron's time will come, whether it's with us or with another team, but Dalton will be the starter this year at least. He has earned that much.

Yes he has, but what he repeats his late 2014?, season play all year does AJ , get a chance

(07-12-2015, 10:52 AM)Se ky bengal Wrote: Yes he has, but what he repeats his late 2014?, season play all year does AJ , get a chance

Dalton didn't play that bad at the end of 2014 except for the playoff game.  And look at his receiving corps in that game.

McCarron would have to look very good in pre-season and Dalton would have to have a long string of terrible games before Mccarron would get a shot.  And by terrible I mean multiple consecutive games with a passer rating in the 60's or lower.

(07-12-2015, 11:00 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Dalton didn't play that bad at the end of 2014 except for the playoff game.  And look at his receiving corps in that game.

McCarron would have to look very good in pre-season and Dalton would have to have a long string of terrible games before Mccarron would get a shot.  And by terrible I mean multiple consecutive games with a passer rating in the 60's or lower.

Weeks 12, 14 & 17 (especially this week) are at/near the end of the season in my opinion.  He did have the great game against Denver though.

You'll just have to accept that some people on the board here believe we could or should improve at the QB position.    This is a thread about AJ McCarron and the possibility of him becoming a starting QB.  We are simply exploring that possibility here, given the fact that he plays for the Bengals.  No harm, no foul really.  There really is no right or wrong answer.

(07-12-2015, 12:28 AM)BayouBengal Wrote: First off let me say that I don’t want this to turn into a Dalton thread. I’m not claiming AJ should replace Dalton this season, in fact I think it would be a mistake to put AJ in too soon. I do however want to make this thread before the preseason starts so that I can say told you so afterwards.
AJ McCarron is a future star and soon the rest of Cincy Jungle will be on board the hype train too. I watched every game AJ played in college and I just want to state now for the record that he will be great someday. He was already an NFL caliber signal caller his senior year at Alabama. He was like the college version of Payton Manning. He was known to read defenses and call the right audible in crucial situations and was often praised for his ability to hit his 3rd and 4th checkdowns on pro style timing routes. Although he never won the Heisman he was able to run plays in college that the redskins still can’t teach RGIII to run.
The average Bengal fan does not appreciate the steal that the organization got when they drafted AJ McCarron in the 5th round. For starters he was projected to go in the 2nd round in a draft class that was abnormally loaded with talented quarterbacks. See his draft projections in this article, his highest draft attributes where his intangibles, decision-making and ability to carry an offense when needed. http://www.nfl.com/draft/2012/profiles/aj-mccarron?id=2543497
His draft stock was only hurt by a couple of interviews and a slew of bad press surrounding those interviews. Basically he was described as “cocky” by some of the teams he met, yet this is exactly the kind of swagger the Bengals have stated they needed. Regardless of his attitude off the field, on game day he is a team player that leads with confidence and plays to his team’s strengths not his own. But that doesn’t mean that he isn’t ultra-competitive and eager to take things into his own hands and sling the ball around. His game manager label combined with his 5th round draft status caused people to overlook him. The truth is that AJ was relied on heavily at times to win for Alabama but he did win with such consistency that people assumed he must have been a product of his surroundings and tend to withhold the credit that he was due.
http://www.al.com/alabamafootball/index.ssf/2014/05/reports_aj_mccarron_rubbed_tea.html
A Quote from analyst Charles Davis in the above article; “When people say he's surrounded by so much talent, he didn't have to do anything, I don't think that's totally the case," he said. "I plug in some game tape and you can't tell me Texas A&M this year he was surrounded by talent and they won the game and he was just along for the ride. I thought he made a lot of big time plays to get that done.”
Here’s the box score from that 2013 college shootout the article mentions. Alabama uncharacteristically relied on AJ’s arm to win against Johnny Manziel’s unpredictable football hijinks. Despite both QBs having big games AJ outperformed Johnny in every category that day. http://scores.espn.go.com/ncf/boxscore?gameId=332570245
People who didn’t watch college football don’t understand that Alabama relied on him to win games often. His tenure at Alabama coincided with the absolute height of SEC dominance in college football and there were a number of great teams that Alabama had to overcome. It can be argued that he was not a main factor in his first national championship as a starter but that could never be said of his second national championship. He made Notre Dame look like a high school team in the national championship and was still (literally) pushing his team to execute perfection despite their complete domination of ND. He outgunned a prolific Aaron Murray in another offensive shootout in the SEC championship the game before.
Basically he helped Alabama rise to the top of a tightly contested pack of national contenders that all just happened to play in the same division of the same conference. The SEC West became known as the “mini-NFL” at the time and this was a trial by fire that McCarron passed with flying colors.
Veteran players know that it takes more than raw talent to perform well at the QB position in the NFL. Another piece of evidence I will give in support of AJ’s football prowess is the comment by CB Pacman Jones. http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2015/07/the_difference_between_winning.html
Adam Jones saw McCarron’s intangibles first hand while running against him during camp and commented on his “it” factor. Pacman isn’t a former college teammate nor does he have any prior connection to AJ. There is no reason for Pacman to hype McCarron unless he believes it. So unlike many of the other comments made about AJ during OTAs this one is sure to have the least bias and it is coming from a seasoned veteran CB.
Though he might be like Andy in a lot of physical ways he is the polar opposite in terms of consistency and big game performances. This article gives a fair assessment of AJ’s primetime prowess.  http://espn.go.com/blog/sec/post/_/id/73817/take-two-big-game-aj-mccarron Though the authors disagreed on whether he was the best big-game quarterback of the era they both agreed he was consistently good. One writer argued, “But there’s not a better big-game quarterback in college football than McCarron, and he’s proved that time and time again. When the Crimson Tide have needed him most, he has almost always delivered, which is why coach Nick Saban has so much faith in McCarron. Saban has said repeatedly that McCarron doesn’t get the credit outside the program that he deserves. Then again, McCarron will gladly take rings over credit.”
So that pretty much sums up why I believe McCarron will start sometime in the near future. But I would be remiss if I didn’t point out his other characteristics that will make him a good franchise figure. If AJ ever assumed the role of Bengals franchise QB you could rest assured that he would know how to talk to the media and connect with fans. I will leave you with some examples of the press falling in love with McCarron (and not just his girlfriend who got plenty of press as well).
Starla’s story
http://espn.go.com/college-football/bowls12/story/_/id/8812751/aj-mccarron-special-bond-starla-chapman-college-football
AJ Starr’s Story
http://www.al.com/alabamafootball/index.ssf/2013/12/the_story_behind_aj_mccarron_h.html
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAHW44xVsVg

TLDR; AJ had a historic college career where he showed an NFL caliber ability to read defenses and make decisions. His tenure at Alabama exposed him to more media than the average college QB yet he always exhibited poise and proved himself to be a good teammate and leader. Though he is like Dalton in many ways he is the polar opposite in terms of his consistency and his propensity for stellar primetime performances.

 We can only hope you are correct and when it is all is looked back upon in 20 years, we can say we watched 2 Super Star QB's in AD and AJ. I would love us to have a Joe Montana and Steve Young scenario for 3 or 4 years.

(07-12-2015, 11:29 AM)2MinutesHate Wrote: Weeks 12, 14 & 17 (especially this week) are at/near the end of the season in my opinion.  He did have the great game against Denver though.

But if you go back and look at the original question I think you will agree that Dalton's performance at the end of the '14 season was not bad enough to get him benched.

He looked bad in the playoff games, but he had no receivers and threw zero interceptions.

And going back to game 12 (like you did) he only had two games with a passer rating under 80 despite playing the Steelers twice in addition to two top 8 pass defenses (Texans, Broncos).

That is not bad enough to get him benched.

(07-12-2015, 11:29 AM)2MinutesHate Wrote: You'll just have to accept that some people on the board here believe we could or should improve at the QB position.    This is a thread about AJ McCarron and the possibility of him becoming a starting QB.  We are simply exploring that possibility here, given the fact that he plays for the Bengals.  No harm, no foul really.  There really is no right or wrong answer.

I think everyone here wants to improve our QB play.  I don't think anyone would complain if McCarron outplayed Dalton.  Most of the people who are accused of being "blind Dalton homers" are actually just Bengal fans.  So they would also support McCarron if he was the starter.  And on the other hand most of the people who are accused of being "Dalton haters" are actually just haters who would be ripping down McCarron if he didn't win the Super Bowl his first season as our starting QB. 

(07-12-2015, 10:33 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Link to anyone saying that?

Stop with the silly strawmen.  I don't see hardly anyone hating on McCarron.  I have not seen a single person saying he hope he fails.  All I have seen is people saying that they need to see a 5th round pick throw a few passes in a game situation before they heap praise on him.

We need a good #2 QB.  I am guessing most people here want McCarron to develop into a good NFL QB.

I am a Vol fan.  I hated McCarron in college, but even I am hoping he becomes a good NFL QB.

Of course no one is hoping he fails, dummy.  Lots of people are saying he won't be any good.  Read the thread, dummy.  You are really dense sometimes.  That makes how smart you think you are very comical.

(07-12-2015, 12:21 PM)McC Wrote: Of course no one is hoping he fails, dummy.  Lots of people are saying he won't be any good.  Read the thread, dummy.  You are really dense sometimes.  That makes how smart you think you are very comical.

Well people who doubt he will be any good have the trend of average across the board Bama QBs flaming out in the NFL, the fact he's never thrown a pass outside of practice conditions in nearly 2 years.....

People who think he will beat out Dalton have.....he won big games at Alabama....

Which makes the most sense at this point his career? 

(07-12-2015, 12:21 PM)McC Wrote: Of course no one is hoping he fails, dummy.  Lots of people are saying he won't be any good.  Read the thread, dummy.  You are really dense sometimes.  That makes how smart you think you are very comical.

Instead of just name-calling perhaps you could post a link to these "lot's of people saying he won't be any good".

All I saw was one post by a member saying he is not optimistic.  I don't see how that fits the definition of "lots of people".

Pretty much everyone else is saying they need to see him do something good before the predict he will be any good.  That seems pretty reasonable to me.

We have no idea what McCarron will do in the NFL, even in the pre-season against less than starters. I hope he comes out strong and is a good backup. I can see where some may think he has "it", and maybe he does ?

But I've got to at least see him in a live NFL game before I'm going to anoint him the 2nd coming. I really hope he is, I'm not at all convinced Dalton has "it".

If AJ McC is the man and by some sort of circumstances takes over so be it.

But I doubt it, not this season anyways.

(07-12-2015, 02:04 AM)bfine32 Wrote: I think the difference between AJ and Andy is: If AJ had to give the team a final minute pep talk in the tunnel before a playoff game; it wouldn't be "Let's good have fun".

I have no idea why folks hate AJ so much but they have ever since his name was called on draft day.

Probably because they're annoyed with people who have been slobbing his knob ever since his name was called.

(07-12-2015, 05:58 PM)BigPapaKain Wrote: Probably because they're annoyed with people who have been slobbing his knob ever since his name was called.

Don't think that's it. Bengal fans have been optimistic about a number of draft choices and others brought in here to possibly be backup QB (LaFevre, Scott, Wilson, ect..). The "hate" for AJ was almost immediate. I wish we still had access to the draft day thread. I was amazed at the rush of "he'll never be anything" posts.

I don't know if it's SEC hate, Alabama hate, Andy love, girlfriend hate, tattoos, or folks just don't like the guy. I think the closest to it I've sen is when we picked up Burfict.

AJ McCarron is on a long list of successful college QBs who could possibly flop in the NFL.

On that list you have guys like Dalton, Alex Smith, Colt McCoy, Kase Keenum, Kellen Moore.... many of the winningest QBs in college, but often times these players cant muster up to much in the NFL.

Smith and Dalton are the success stories really, and neither have done too much in their careers.

Other guys like Kellen Moore never take a snap, and ride the bench, which may very well happen to McCarron.

McCaron needs a real shot to prove anything, and as many have said, Dalton will need to have a MAJOR meltdown with our organization for him to get that shot. The loyalty of our coaches wont let us get to that point IMO.

So pretty much AJ has two options for getting his shot to play.

1: Dalton has a good year, proves he is our franchise guy, and we trade Mac for a decent draft pick (love to keep him as a backup but if he wants to start somewhere he will need to be traded)

2: Dalton has a terribad year, proves he is not our franchise guy, and AJ goes in to be the next 'savior'



long story short, he wont get any opportunity for a while, barring a Dalton injury.