(11-29-2016, 02:11 AM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Yep. We should probably try yet another QB. Palmer wasn't the answer and neither is Dalton.

Or...maybe the problem is the HC who is 0-7 in the playoffs with 4 different QBs all playing horribly? Or maybe it's the owner who is rocking a 26 year streak with without a playoff win (with around 14 different QBs)?

Nah, that can't be it. Gotta be the QB. Again.


The irony is always strong when one of Marvin's biggest supporters knocks  the QB for playoff performance.

___________________________

@ everyone saying the o-line is an "excuse" or is somehow caused by Dalton:

1. How is he suddenly causing sacks when his sack numbers have been low through most of his career? Ok. Now Ogbuehi and Bodine being 2 of the lowest rated linemen in the league is somehow Andy's fault. You can't make this stuff up.

2. Andrew Luck's underwhelming seasons have always been blamed on poor pass blocking. Now Dalton is getting beat up and it's supposed to have no affect on him? 

The sad thing is, Dalton isn't even having a bad season. He's on pace for 4400 yards and he's limiting turnovers. All this with an awful run game and terrible pass blocking.

Carson did not have nearly the talent all around that this team has had in the past 3 years.  If Carson stayed and we did not draft Dalton, we would have went deep into the playoffs and probably won a SB by now.  No comparison in QB's...Also if Carson was not injured we would have had a great shot at the win and being SB champs.

(11-29-2016, 10:49 AM)Marlon23 Wrote: Carson did not have nearly the talent all around that this team has had in the past 3 years.  If Carson stayed and we did not draft Dalton, we would have went deep into the playoffs and probably won a SB by now.  No comparison in QB's...Also if Carson was not injured we would have had a great shot at the win and being SB champs.

Guess that's why Carson has taken Arizona so deep?

(11-28-2016, 03:18 PM)CageTheBengal Wrote: People who are doubting Andy at this point are completely clueless on the impact of having a good o-line is.

It's no surprise Derek Carr is having a great season he has been sacked the least this season.

or Dak Prescott.  It makes a huge difference.

(11-29-2016, 01:16 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Guess that's why Carson has taken Arizona so deep?

Arizona Cardinals = Arizona Cardinals, Cincinnati Bengals = Cincinnati Bengals.  

(11-29-2016, 03:40 AM)bengalsturntup926 Wrote: Anything good posted about dalton right now Burns me up.  He straight choked the last game. A game we could of still had a little life left if won.  Andy dalton choked. It wasn't about nobody but dalton. O line gave him protection on that last drive.  4 batted down passes on the final drive. 10 batted down passes in the game. 4 damn fumbles in the game. I think a int too if I'm not mistaken.

I get that his favorite security blanket was gone. And his favorite little dump off back he throws too.  I get that the o line has been pretty bad this year. Ced and bodine mostly. But listen, I know what Andy dalton is at this point. This is the 6the year, this is who he is. Does he ever have plays where your like wow!!  Ever?  No. I've watched coaches tape of him being a one read qb, then he doesn't look to throw. He locks on to his receiver. One big reason for the batted down balls. Accuracy is still shaky. One pass he hits a guy good, the next pass he can't hit the rb on a out route. Completely crap pass.  I've seen him not find the blitz. I've seen him have bad footwork. Andy dalton is part of the problem this year. Last year in hues offense he was good, I thought I was wrong.  Andy dalton looks scared in big moments, no leadership skills, or pocket awareness seeing guys coming for him. He can run some times that's his biggest asset.  But not a speedster. I was really pissed at dalton after the game. And I seen a lot that seen the same thing, on cincy jungle and my group on facebook.but since its tuesday,people want to sweep that under the rug,and pretend it was everyone elses fault.

What more do we need to surround dalton with.do we need mike williams out of clemson,do we need a o line that dont let no pressure come at all.come on this is the nfl,you will always get pressured some.

We can build the most perfect team around dalton,and have the best coaches,and from what ive witnessed and know,i do not trust him to get a wild card win,definitely not two in a row.sorry i dont see it.but im stuck with the guy as my qb,till some coach says otherwise.

- Batted passes and strip sacks are more signs of a bad line. Not that you're trying to hear that.

- Every QB has "a little dump off back". Gio doesn't even catch that many passes compared to some RBs. So why mock Dalton for this? 

- Dalton had several wow throws last year, the one that stood out most was the 50 yard rope he threw on the run against KC. He has 10 passes over 40 yards this year. Some just have selective memories.

- Dalton does not lock on to receivers. This is a myth created by Dalton bashers. I've seen him look off defender's this year, and Fouts has talked about Dalton scanning the field. Joe Goodberry is a Dalton basher himself. Posting selective clips proves nothing.

- You say Dalton looked good with Hue. Why do you think that is?

- You will always get pressured SOME in the NFL. Being the 2nd most sacked and pressured QB is not "some".

(11-29-2016, 10:49 AM)Marlon23 Wrote: Carson did not have nearly the talent all around that this team has had in the past 3 years.  If Carson stayed and we did not draft Dalton, we would have went deep into the playoffs and probably won a SB by now.  No comparison in QB's...Also if Carson was not injured we would have had a great shot at the win and being SB champs.

Carson had talent here. One of the best lines in team history. The best WR duo in team history. Rudi. CedBen. The 4th ranked defense in 2009 coached by Zimmer.

Now he has a very talented Cardinals team where he tanked in the.playoffs in epic fashion and now completely lost his mojo.

(11-29-2016, 10:49 AM)Marlon23 Wrote: Carson did not have nearly the talent all around that this team has had in the past 3 years. 

Early in Carson's career he had a much better O-line than Dalton

(11-29-2016, 02:31 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Early in Carson's career he had a much better O-line than Dalton

That is fine, but this defense prior to this year was the tops.  The talent of AJ Green Sanu and Marvin Jones, then have the dual threat at RB and Eifert our OLine except this year was not bad at all.  Without a Doubt in my mind Carson would have taken us to the SB or at-least deep into the playoff spectrum with this team surrounding him from the past 3 years.  There is something a miss with Andy Dalton.  The doubters at this stage have every right to question Andy's Play.  It has been over lustrum now.  

(11-29-2016, 02:11 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: - Batted passes and strip sacks are more signs of a bad line. Not that you're trying to hear that.

- Every QB has "a little dump off back". Gio doesn't even catch that many passes compared to some RBs. So why mock Dalton for this? 

- Dalton had several wow throws last year, the one that stood out most was the 50 yard rope he threw on the run against KC. He has 10 passes over 40 yards this year. Some just have selective memories.

- Dalton does not lock on to receivers. This is a myth created by Dalton bashers. I've seen him look off defender's this year, and Fouts has talked about Dalton scanning the field. Joe Goodberry is a Dalton basher himself. Posting selective clips proves nothing.

- You say Dalton looked good with Hue. Why do you think that is?

- You will always get pressured SOME in the NFL. Being the 2nd most sacked and pressured QB is not "some".


Carson had talent here. One of the best lines in team history. The best WR duo in team history. Rudi. CedBen. The 4th ranked defense in 2009 coached by Zimmer.

Now he has a very talented Cardinals team where he tanked in the.playoffs in epic fashion and now completely lost his mojo.

Andy Throws Wobbly Balls.  (:   Give me young Carson over Young Andy any day of the week.  I stated more on Freds post.  

(11-29-2016, 03:01 PM)Marlon23 Wrote: That is fine, but this defense prior to this year was the tops.  The talent of AJ Green Sanu and Marvin Jones, then have the dual threat at RB and Eifert our OLine except this year was not bad at all.  Without a Doubt in my mind Carson would have taken us to the SB or at-least deep into the playoff spectrum with this team surrounding him from the past 3 years.  There is something a miss with Andy Dalton.  The doubters at this stage have every right to question Andy's Play.  It has been over lustrum now.  

With all of that, we went 10-2 and he was in the league MVP discussion before the injury.  Last year was our year.....much like 2005....IMO, but the football gods shit on us once again.  The curse lives on.....

(11-29-2016, 03:10 PM)Wyche Wrote: With all of that, we went 10-2 and he was in the league MVP discussion before the injury.  Last year was our year.....much like 2005....IMO, but the football gods shit on us once again.  The curse lives on.....

Not trying to combative at all but if Carson was QB we would have won.  We also would have won if Carson never got hurt...  our chance yes, and I do believe overall there is something majorly wrong with this organization lol.  a curse if you will.

(11-29-2016, 03:01 PM)Marlon23 Wrote:  Without a Doubt in my mind Carson would have taken us to the SB or at-least deep into the playoff spectrum with this team surrounding him from the past 3 years.  

(11-29-2016, 03:15 PM)Marlon23 Wrote: Not trying to combative at all but if Carson was QB we would have won.  We also would have won if Carson never got hurt...  our chance yes, and I do believe overall there is something majorly wrong with this organization lol.  a curse if you will.

I'm not either....I just think we sell our current QB short.  Yes, he had shortcomings that took a while to overcome, but he did.  I really look at 2014 as the year he was forced to improvise, which led to improvement that we saw come to fruition last year.  Unfortunately, it looks like he has become shellshocked this season, and for good reason.  I believe he was putting it together last year, as was the rest of the team....but it wasn't meant to be.

AS for the curse, it's known as the Christmas Eve Massacre.....it's been downhill ever since, save for the bit of resurrection we've enjoyed the last few years.

we would need an elite defense to be a superbowl contending team with dalton at quarterback we don't have an elite defense plus the team as a whole chokes everytime in the playoffs anyway

(11-29-2016, 03:01 PM)Marlon23 Wrote: That is fine, but this defense prior to this year was the tops.  The talent of AJ Green Sanu and Marvin Jones, then have the dual threat at RB and Eifert our OLine except this year was not bad at all.  Without a Doubt in my mind Carson would have taken us to the SB or at-least deep into the playoff spectrum with this team surrounding him from the past 3 years.  There is something a miss with Andy Dalton.  The doubters at this stage have every right to question Andy's Play.  It has been over lustrum now.  

Right. He's done so much with that excellent Cardinals defense. Didn't he set some sort of record for turnovers in a playoff game? The Bengals ruined him.

(11-29-2016, 04:03 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Right. He's done so much with that excellent Cardinals defense. Didn't he set some sort of record for turnovers in a playoff game? The Bengals ruined him.

We would have won.  I would take Young Carson over Young Andy any day of the week.  Carson is 37 now if not older.  I think that after 6 years of Andy Dalton, with the talent that has been around we have not got it done we will not with him.  I was more than willing to give him 3 years after this year if we made the playoffs again but we did not. 

(11-29-2016, 04:03 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Right. He's done so much with that excellent Cardinals defense. Didn't he set some sort of record for turnovers in a playoff game? The Bengals ruined him.

Young Andy or Young Carson with the team we had last year? 

(11-29-2016, 04:02 PM)seahawkscheat Wrote: we would need an elite defense to be a superbowl contending team with dalton at quarterback we don't have an elite defense plus the team as a whole chokes everytime in the playoffs anyway

And here is another one.

Welcome SHC, where are all you guys coming from?

(11-29-2016, 04:14 PM)Marlon23 Wrote: Young Andy or Young Carson with the team we had last year? 

Young Carson was better than young Dalton, but young Carson never won anything either and he had a lot of talent around him.  We didn't have a pass catching threat at TE like Dalton has now, but Carson had a better O-line (mainly for the running game) and a much better #3 WR in Chris Henry.

Dalton had a better defense, but it didn't usually show up in the playoffs.

(11-29-2016, 04:25 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Young Carson was better than young Dalton, but young Carson never won anything either and he had a lot of talent around him.  We didn't have a pass catching threat at TE like Dalton has now, but Carson had a better O-line (mainly for the running game) and a much better #3 WR in Chris Henry.

Dalton had a better defense, but it didn't usually show up in the playoffs.

Gotta agree with the toast on this......Lord help us all.

(11-29-2016, 04:27 PM)Wyche Wrote: Gotta agree with the toast on this......Lord help us all.

This is my point.  If we did not trade Carson off and had the exact same team, We would have won Playoffs and perhaps even a SB.  I would take young Carson or even knowledgeable Carson in 2011 over Andy Dalton but some how some how Cincy let him walk. 


It is now 2016 going into 2017 and we are no longer able to give any excuses for Andy Dalton.