(01-10-2018, 02:23 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Actually the reason I don't like that stat has nothing to do with where it ranks Dalton.  The problem I have is that no one knows what it really measures.  It is just a made up stat.

I know exactly how to calculate Passer Rating, and Dalton has finished in the top half of the league 4 times in seven years.

If you want to look at something other than just pure passing stats then here is how Dalton ranks among the 35 QB who have at least 1000 passing attempts since '11.

2nd in rushing tds

3rd in "fourth quarter comebacks"..https://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/pgl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=career&year_min=2011&year_max=2017&season_start=1&season_end=-1&pos=0&game_type=R&career_game_num_min=1&career_game_num_max=400&game_num_min=0&game_num_max=99&week_num_min=0&week_num_max=99&comeback=Y&is_active=Y&c5val=1.0&order_by=pass_td

4th in "game winning drives"..https://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/pgl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=career&year_min=2011&year_max=2017&season_start=1&season_end=-1&pos=0&game_type=R&career_game_num_min=1&career_game_num_max=400&game_num_min=0&game_num_max=99&week_num_min=0&week_num_max=99&gwd=Y&is_active=Y&c5val=1.0&order_by=pass_td

5th in lowest fumble rate (fumbles per [pass attempt + rush attempt])


So I am not exactly sure what QBR measures since Dalton ranks high in passing, rushing tds, clutch fourth quarter performances, and ball security.

QBR is an ESPN metric that rewards QBs that suck in the first half and then miraculously (drama queen) pull out a win over a turd that should never even been close to them.  

Dalton, when given even good protection and average rushing attack, was in the talk of MVP.  Granted, it hasn't happened often, but you saw what he can do the last two games with a rushing attack and some protection.  And no one can give me that the Rats had nothing to play for this year.  And that was with AJ Green turning in to Darnay "hot buttered corn on the cob pre-game meal" Scott in the last game.  

(01-10-2018, 01:51 PM)ElderStatesman Wrote: He’s finsihed in the bottom half in QBR 6 times in 7 seasons

Lol.  That’s below avg.   I know I know.  We don’t like that stat cause it shows Andy’s deficiencies (despite it being very accurate)

QBR accurate? Since when? LOL

(01-10-2018, 02:42 PM)PhilHos Wrote: QBR accurate? Since when? LOL

It’s funny how the best, Elite qbs year in and year out are at the top of the qbr rankings. Dalton’s best season he was top 5. Every other season he’s been below avg.

The poor and mediocre qbs all fall perfectly in line with Qbr as well.

I know. This is hard for you to comprehend. I guess passer rating is infallible in your mind

Nick Foles has the 2nd highest active passer rating season of all time. Lol. Must be accurate.

(01-10-2018, 02:50 PM)ElderStatesman Wrote: The poor and mediocre qbs all fall perfectly in line with Qbr as well.

No they don't.

Dak Prescott is ranked 4th in QBR this year (86.6 passer rating, 3324 pass yards, 357 rush yds, 28 total td) while Russell Wilson (95.4 passer rating, 3983 passing yards, 586 rush yards, 37 total tds) is 10th.

QBR is a joke.

(01-10-2018, 02:13 PM)bengalhoel Wrote: Yeah, we had some good players but that team was bad. I mean scrub your eyes with Lava soap bad. 

Bad coaching, bad structure, but plenty of good young talent.

(01-10-2018, 02:52 PM)fredtoast Wrote: No they don't.

Yes they do

Isn't ESPN pretty much the only people that use QBR?

(01-10-2018, 02:55 PM)ElderStatesman Wrote: Yes they do

Then explain why Dak Prescott is ranked so much higher than Wilson this year.

(01-10-2018, 02:56 PM)Wyche Wrote: Isn't ESPN pretty much the only people that use QBR?

Yes.  They made it up and they are the only ones who knows what it even means.

(01-10-2018, 03:06 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Yes.  They made it up and they are the only ones who knows what it even means.

Thanks.....I knew they made it up, but was uncertain if anyone else ever bothered with it.  BTW, good to see you back. :andy:

(01-10-2018, 02:20 AM)Bengal Dude Wrote: It'd be a great hire if it happens. The guy has been a positive influence everywhere he goes. After the NFL, he went back to his high school alma mater and turned that program around. 

I hope Kitna is hired, heck in a few years he might be HC material, dude is smart and obviously offensive minded.

Joe Flacco: 

352 of 549 (64.1%) for 3141 yards (5.72 YPA) with 18 TDs to 13 INTs (80.4 passer rating) 

- Averaged a laughably bad 8.9 yards per completion - this means he was a dump-off machine this year
- Had 11th ranked run game (19th in YPC)
- Sacked only 27 times on 549 attempts (a sack per every 20.3 attempts)
- Gets a QBR of 46.0

Andy Dalton: 

297 of 496 (59.9%) for 3320 yards (6.69 YPA) with 25 TDs to 12 INTs (86.6 passer rating)

- averaged 11.2 yards per completion (very normal)
- Had 31st ranked run game (29th in YPC)
- Sacked 39 times on 496 attempts (a sack per every 12.7 attempts)
- Gets a QBR of 42.0

---------------------------------------

I thought QBR was supposed to take everything into account? So how does the QB with better stats - in a far worse situation - get a worse grade? QBR fans please explain.

(01-10-2018, 03:31 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Joe Flacco: 

352 of 549 (64.1%) for 3141 yards (5.72 YPA) with 18 TDs to 13 INTs (80.4 passer rating) 

- Averaged a laughably bad 8.9 yards per completion - this means he was a dump-off machine this year
- Had 11th ranked run game (19th in YPC)
- Sacked only 27 times on 549 attempts (a sack per every 20.3 attempts)
- Gets a QBR of 46.0

Andy Dalton: 

297 of 496 (59.9%) for 3320 yards (6.69 YPA) with 25 TDs to 12 INTs (86.6 passer rating)

- averaged 11.2 yards per completion (very normal)
- Had 31st ranked run game (29th in YPC)
- Sacked 39 times on 496 attempts (a sack per every 12.7 attempts)
- Gets a QBR of 42.0

---------------------------------------

I thought QBR was supposed to take everything into account? So how does the QB with better stats - in a far worse situation - get a worse grade? QBR fans please explain.

Because it also includes the importance of the specific game, the timing of the completion and first down, the pressure a qb was under in the situation, basically everything that the casual fan can’t compile.

(01-09-2018, 06:30 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Kitna is the type of "scrappy underdog" that everyone here should love.  He went from an undrafted free agent to rank 35th all time in NFL history in completions

He won a national championship in college (Central Washington NAIA) in '95

He won a NFL Europe Championship, and was MVP of the championship game.

Just two year later he led the Seahawks to the NFC East Division Championship.

Loved his focus:  he embraced the year he had while Carson sat, but told all the coaches that Carson was going to do SO many things he was just not capable of.   He was a tough competitor but a humble guy who was genuinely excited when Palmer came into his own.

And... welcome back Fred.  

(01-10-2018, 03:31 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Joe Flacco: 

352 of 549 (64.1%) for 3141 yards (5.72 YPA) with 18 TDs to 13 INTs (80.4 passer rating) 

- Averaged a laughably bad 8.9 yards per completion - this means he was a dump-off machine this year
- Had 11th ranked run game (19th in YPC)
- Sacked only 27 times on 549 attempts (a sack per every 20.3 attempts)
- Gets a QBR of 46.0

Andy Dalton: 

297 of 496 (59.9%) for 3320 yards (6.69 YPA) with 25 TDs to 12 INTs (86.6 passer rating)

- averaged 11.2 yards per completion (very normal)
- Had 31st ranked run game (29th in YPC)
- Sacked 39 times on 496 attempts (a sack per every 12.7 attempts)
- Gets a QBR of 42.0

---------------------------------------

I thought QBR was supposed to take everything into account? So how does the QB with better stats - in a far worse situation - get a worse grade? QBR fans please explain.

(01-10-2018, 03:38 PM)ElderStatesman Wrote: Because it also includes the importance of the specific game, the timing of the completion and first down, the pressure a qb was under in the situation, basically everything that the casual fan can’t compile.

So it punishes good players on bad teams?  Archie Manning would have been horrible by this metric.  Sounds legit.

(01-10-2018, 03:41 PM)WychesWarrior Wrote: So it punishes good players on bad teams?  Archie Manning would have been horrible by this metric.  Sounds legit.

No. It punishes garbage time stat padding and soft cover completions

(01-10-2018, 03:38 PM)ElderStatesman Wrote: Because it also includes the importance of the specific game, the timing of the completion and first down, the pressure a qb was under in the situation, basically everything that the casual fan can’t compile.

But it doesn't account for a QB putting up much better stats in a much worse situation? 

(01-10-2018, 03:43 PM)ElderStatesman Wrote: No. It punishes garbage time stat padding and soft cover completions

Name all the games where Dalton padded his stats in garbage time this year.

Mind you we're not talking about a 3-13 team here. The Bengals went 7-9 with several close losses.

Good guy, but good coach?!?!?! TBD for now but I do remember when Akili was around Kitna was interested in the clipboard and getting things done, so maybe he could be a good coach. Hoping for the best.