(09-30-2018, 11:03 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I get the thread was to praise Andy and I did so by saying he had a great game; but Matt had a better game, It's not opinion; it's fact.

It's OK, he can have a great game, while the opposing QB has a better one. 

Matty had about 100 more yards, a passer rating about 30 points higher, got the same pressure Andy did. Sure Andy had a great final drive, but that does not change the body of work.

Quick question that folks can answer honestly and perhaps figure it out:

Who had a better game Tyler Boyd or AJ Green? 

Tough question. Chicken or egg. Boyd had more catches and yards helping Green get game winning TD catch. Green also helps Boyd get single coverage. The reason it is tough is because if Green drops a tough sliding catch and then AD gets sacked or we don't get 4th down TD or 1st down out of bounds to stop clock, then all of the heroics of AD to Boyd is for naught.

As for AD and Ryan, I think they both played great, both made plays to help their teams score a lot of points. Neither did anything to lose the game.

(09-30-2018, 11:20 PM)XsandOs Wrote: Bfine, I always enjoy reading your posts and comments. I agree that both QBs played exceptionally well. But in this case, you are comparing them based on stats, but not necessarily considering the most important stat - on which, one of the two QBs had direct impact.  The win.

The analogy is the first Julio Cesar Chavez vs Meldrick Taylor fight.

Taylor boxed brilliantly for the entire fight, but Chavez was right in there landing his shots. With less than 15 seconds left in the fight, Chavez lands the deciding right cross that ended the fight.

If you look at box scores, Taylor looks far better and also won most of the rounds.

But Chavez knocked him out.

Falcons offense was given the go ahead to score a TD (not drain the clock) on their last drive, once they approached the red zone. He didn't deliver.

Dalton did. Thus he was the better QB on the field today, in my humble opinion.

With your given analogy the QB on the winning side always has the better game.  

Which QB was better in last year's Superbowl?

(09-30-2018, 11:26 PM)bfine32 Wrote: With your given analogy the QB on the winning side always has the better game.  

Which QB was better in last year's Superbowl?

No. My analogy speaks to outcome being a significant stat when the athlete in question is directly involved in that outcome. Chavez was in the fight throughout the night. It wasn't a lucky punch.

In football, not being a sudden death sport, that is a must.

Ultimately, how many yards or QB rating points would one give for a win, when the winning QB delivers at the most crucial part of the game and the losing QB does not? That is the question.

Related to the SB last year, I can't recall stats. But I would say Foles. He was instrumental in the win. He delivered throughout the game and in the crucial last drive.

I would also say the same about Eli and his two wins against Brady.

Now, I wouldn't say that Ben outplayed the Seahawks QB in their first SB win. Because their RB and defense won that game.

So, no. The winning QB has to play well and be directly involved in the crucial moments that settle the outcome.

(09-30-2018, 11:03 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I get the thread was to praise Andy and I did so by saying he had a great game; but Matt had a better game, It's not opinion; it's fact.

It's OK, he can have a great game, while the opposing QB has a better one. 

Matty had about 100 more yards, a passer rating about 30 points higher, got the same pressure Andy did. Sure Andy had a great final drive, but that does not change the body of work.

Quick question that folks can answer honestly and perhaps figure it out:

Who had a better game Tyler Boyd or AJ Green? 

Those are all fair points, but there are also key plays that don't really show up in their respective boxscores.

For example, Andy's scramble for a 1st down on the final drive or warding off Beasley on back to back plays.  Andy also completed a pass to AJ during the 2 minute drill in 1st half that they decided to take the DPI penalty on to stop the clock.

In Ryan's column, you can definitely look at his decision to throw it short of the goal line on that 2 point conversion.  If they make that, we're probably talking about an OT game.  His stats are also a bit padded by the Hail Mary that landed well short of the end zone.

(09-30-2018, 09:57 PM)reuben.ahmed Wrote: Andy ***** Dalton

Andy F***ing Dalton.....It’s the f***ing Catalina Wine Mixer!

(09-30-2018, 10:55 PM)The Real Deal Wrote: You’re the one comparing? The thread was just talking about Andy’s game. But you have no idea how to give Andy credit without getting a jab in. But the real fact of the matter is that the W that Andy got is all that matters. How’d Matt do on that front? I know it kills you but it will be impossible for you to rebut that.

Exactly, who had the better game statistically only matters in the world of Dalton hate.

If Dalton won the Super Bowl this season on a game winning drive it would be pure funny watching em post the other QB had a better game.

(10-01-2018, 12:19 AM)leonardfan40 Wrote: Andy F***ing Dalton.....It’s the f***ing Catalina Wine Mixer!

Andy Dalton was the best player on the field, imho. Don't believe I have ever said that before. Im more snd more impressed with him as the season progresses. The team never looked rattled. I couldn't ask for a better performance from him. He carried the team today. Don't believe I have said that before, either. AD delivered the knockout, Ryan didn't. Stats only tell part of the tale...

Seems like Dalton is starting to get the credit he deserves in the media. Shove your line up your arse

(09-30-2018, 06:02 PM)The Real Deal Wrote: How about some love for our QB.

29-41
337yds
70.7% comp
3TD
1Int (dropped/tipped pass, not his fault)
109.5 QBR
(Game winning drive capped by a TD pass)

WHO DEY?!

Amen.  And did he fold when there was that horrible tip INT by Kroft (it wasn't even high!) or when he lost Eifert?  Nope.  He just kept plugging away.

Kudos to the offensive line for keeping him pretty clean all day.  

I have said it many times, when Dalton is kept clean he picks teams apart.

Three out of four games with a QB rating over 100.  And Piggy didn't look to have such an easy time with the Ratbirds...

Dalton is a winner on a franchise not known for winning. Last seconds and throws game winning TD to great catch AJ Green. Dalton wins in last seconds a lot. It was something Joe Montana and John Elway could do. Dalton in the last seconds of games is one tough game winning quarterback. For fans of all the other QB stats, give me those QB's who pull out wins in the last seconds where most QBs choke. Since 2011, Dalton is great at 2 minute drills, as we saw again yesterday. ( remember Dalton to Green to beat Steelers in 2012. You give Dalton the ball and chance to win at the end, he often does. How about last second TD to Boyd against Ravens ).

It's clear Van Pelt has worked on his confidence and poise. I love it. He's absolutely playing good football.

(10-01-2018, 08:02 AM)Hoofhearted Wrote: It's clear Van Pelt has worked on his confidence and poise. I love it. He's absolutely playing good football.

He might be our best offseason hire tbh.

(10-01-2018, 04:06 AM)Seaneh Wrote: Seems like Dalton is starting to get the credit he deserves in the media. Shove your line up your arse

Started following epl in 2002, bengals were something like 2-14 that year. I can tell you the whole sad story sometime...

In 2015 he seemed to have a fire in his eyes. It isn't thst as much this year. His nervousness (and the team's) just seem to have vanished. Great to see may it long continue.

The funny thing is that on Atl boards they are saying Ryan was great and their defense is trash, and here we are saying Dalton was great and our D trash. I think both QBs played very well, but both defenses were absolute trash.

I mentioned this in another thread.

On the play where Dalton was intercepted, there was blatant defensive holding/PI that wasn't called, and Andy was visibly furious. I loved it.

(10-01-2018, 07:57 AM)kevin Wrote: ... How about last second TD to Boyd against Ravens.

There were still 44 seconds remaining.  In fact, the Ravens could have still won that game, had they converted a 4th down.

(09-30-2018, 11:03 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Quick question that folks can answer honestly and perhaps figure it out:

Who had a better game Tyler Boyd or AJ Green? 

Quick question for you.

Since thie is a Bengal messaage board can we discuss Boyds good game without talking about Julio being better?

And why stop at Ryan?  Why not list every QB who had a better game than Dalton every time someone says something good about Dalton?  I think yoiu are slipping a little Bfine.

(10-01-2018, 09:35 AM)michaelsean Wrote: The funny thing is that on Atl boards they are saying Ryan was great and their defense is trash, and here we are saying Dalton was great and our D trash. I think both QBs played very well, but both defenses were absolute trash.

But our d was slightly less trash! Holding them to a FG at the end of the 1st, and stopping the 2pt conversion was the difference.

(10-01-2018, 10:22 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: But our d was slightly less trash! Holding them to a FG at the end of the 1st, and stopping the 2pt conversion was the difference.

Yeah and holding them to a FG after the punt block was a bright spot.