Who would be down for throwing a few seasons intentionally for number 1 picks to completely rebuild? Assuming that the old codger MB kicks the bucket to NOT screw it up? I just don't see us ever getting over the proverbial hump unless we can jettison a huge chunk of the roster and coaching staff, ownership and well, the entire organization. 
I have to admit that I'm finally almost to the point of giving up my fan card to start taking applications from other teams to root for . I'm really at a loss to explain why I'm still a Bengals fan. I don't have family in Cincinnati and only 1 sister still in Dayton. HEY! Maybe if I actually finally do quit on the Bengals they'll finally get over the hump! That's it..I'm the reason they can't win big games..it's MY fault!  Blame me! I didn't go fishing Sunday .. If it was only that easy.. 
Regardless of what happens I'll always be a Reds fan for reasons I'll never be able to explain. Actually they go way back with my family .. My grandfather was almost a Cincinnati Red.. The Bengals? Just me unfortunately. 

You're trapped, brother...

Meh. You don't need to suck for luck if you know how to trade up.  Chiefs and Rams vs. Colts. I don't think that I'd want to train any of my employees to roll over and fail upward.

I'd gut the staff and get some high quality replacements. Then let them evaluate the roster and go from there. You might find that a staff change is all you need. I actually like some of our subordinate coaches, but their future would have to be left up to the new HC.

Unfortunately other teams aren't beating a path to anyones door to become their fans. I've actually considered Carolina except for Cam and their gawd awful uniforms.. not to mention the evil curse Mike Brown owns over me to keep me as a Bengals fan. I actually used to like Kansas City, but now they're just showing off.  

And yeah . I'm aware that whenever we go into suck mode I always go into conspiracy theory mode. It's my default position. 

If this season continues to nose dive, I'm with Wyche. Gut the entire staff, hire the next brilliant young offensive mind (Matt Lafleur - OC of the Rams is my choice) and let him pick his entire staff. Keep Dalton, Green, Mixon, Geno, Dunlap and some our core in tact, and it should be an easy transition. Can you imagine LaFleur having Dalton, Green, Boyd, Mixon and Gio at his disposal? I feel Marv has always held our offense back.

Btw, I also think having Tobin around would help stabilize a transition to a new coaching staff. People underestimate his role.

(10-25-2018, 02:28 AM)Shake n Blake Wrote: If this season continues to nose dive, I'm with Wyche. Gut the entire staff, hire the next brilliant young offensive mind (Matt Lafleur - OC of the Rams is my choice) and let him pick his entire staff. Keep Dalton, Green, Mixon, Geno, Dunlap and some our core in tact, and it should be an easy transition. Can you imagine LaFleur having Dalton, Green, Boyd, Mixon and Gio at his disposal? I feel Marv has always held our offense back.

LaFleur would be great but if not him it has to be an offensive minded coach !

And Marvin has always been stuck in 1980 ball mode

If only we had Dave shula and Dick LeBeau back.....

(10-24-2018, 01:34 AM)grampahol Wrote: Who would be down for throwing a few seasons intentionally for number 1 picks to completely rebuild? Assuming that the old codger MB kicks the bucket to NOT screw it up? I just don't see us ever getting over the proverbial hump unless we can jettison a huge chunk of the roster and coaching staff, ownership and well, the entire organization. 
I have to admit that I'm finally almost to the point of giving up my fan card to start taking applications from other teams to root for . I'm really at a loss to explain why I'm still a Bengals fan. I don't have family in Cincinnati and only 1 sister still in Dayton. HEY! Maybe if I actually finally do quit on the Bengals they'll finally get over the hump! That's it..I'm the reason they can't win big games..it's MY fault!  Blame me! I didn't go fishing Sunday .. If it was only that easy.. 
Regardless of what happens I'll always be a Reds fan for reasons I'll never be able to explain. Actually they go way back with my family .. My grandfather was almost a Cincinnati Red.. The Bengals? Just me unfortunately. 

I am a retired Vietnam veteran and when I got home in 1968, I immediately signed up to support the new BENGALS.I been with them for 50 years and I have seen it all,believe that.I cannot put my mind on what is the real problem with this team,however I do know for a fact that the leader of any organization does matter.I worked for a major financial company for 30 years and the person running the show sets the standard as to how things are done,and we had some super winners and some duds.The duds did not last very long as our bottom line was always about success and that is measured in dollars,folks.Like any company as long as there is big dollars coming in,nothing changes.I like the people at the Bengals,however the results are not good and I am not happy.We have been led to believe by the local news media that this was going to be a super bowl team,and once again we are fed a line of bull. To me,until there is wholesale changes made in cincy by our beloved bengals,we are going to be watching a 500 club each and every year.To get more out of your players,you have to have top talent and you must be more demanding of them.I do not see that here and I believe these players have heard the same voice way too long and it falls on deaf ears,and the talent is not that good,plus the wrong players are here as they release the good ones,like brian hill and tra carson,,a terrible O-line and this defense is average at best,number 92 from ohio state should be starting.should have never let the guy go to the Vikings.Zim jumped on him and he is starting.go figure.they will struggle to whip the bucs.

(10-25-2018, 02:28 AM)Shake n Blake Wrote: If this season continues to nose dive, I'm with Wyche. Gut the entire staff, hire the next brilliant young offensive mind (Matt Lafleur - OC of the Rams is my choice) and let him pick his entire staff. Keep Dalton, Green, Mixon, Geno, Dunlap and some our core in tact, and it should be an easy transition. Can you imagine LaFleur having Dalton, Green, Boyd, Mixon and Gio at his disposal? I feel Marv has always held our offense back.

That OL that they have built in LA also helps make Lafleur look like a genius.  The ability to move some people, with the men up front, can lead to some masterful execution of plays.

(10-24-2018, 06:20 AM)Wyche Wrote: I'd gut the staff and get some high quality replacements. Then let them evaluate the roster and go from there. You might find that a staff change is all you need. I actually like some of our subordinate coaches, but their future would have to be left up to the new HC.

You'd get rid of Lazor??? His offense has had one bad game....

(10-25-2018, 11:40 AM)Sled21 Wrote: You'd get rid of Lazor??? His offense has had one bad game....

I guess it depends on how much blame you assign for the 2017.  We ditched Zampese after 2 games and our offense still ended up 32nd in the league.  Ida know...the Ravens fire their OC mid-season and win the SB, we fire our OC after 2 games and expect and accept our offense being dead last in the NFL. 

Not saying I'd fire the guy, but some of 2017 could scuff up his resume, is all.

High end coaches would not likely work with how Mike Brown does. Moot point until he is gone

(10-25-2018, 12:11 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I guess it depends on how much blame you assign for the 2017.  We ditched Zampese after 2 games and our offense still ended up 32nd in the league.  Ida know...the Ravens fire their OC mid-season and win the SB, we fire our OC after 2 games and expect and accept our offense being dead last in the NFL. 

Not saying I'd fire the guy, but some of 2017 could scuff up his resume, is all.

Lazor isnt on as thin of ice that Austin should be, but his job shouldn't be guaranteed.


Currently the offense is 25th in yards/game. Even the Browns have more yards/game at 22nd,  the Browns! Passing O is 21st, Rushing O is 28th.

In points/game, they have fallen back to 11th after being near the top.

The last 3 games:
They weren't good against the Dolphins at home. If the defense didn't come away with those 2 TDs, who knows how that game turned out.

Then home at Pitt, they couldn't even reach 300 yards against a Pitt D that is having a down year, though they did scrape up 3 tds. And then the failure of Andy not managing the clock a bit better to shave off some time before the Mixon TD in between plays, but that falls on Marvin as well.

The Chiefs was a 90s era style of an embarrassment on NBC primetime. That almost counts as two bad games lol.

I wonder how people would take it if Mike Brown offers Marvin Pete Brown's job..Vice President of Player Personnel.

(10-25-2018, 11:40 AM)Sled21 Wrote: You'd get rid of Lazor??? His offense has had one bad game....

Like I said, that would be up to the new head man.....I said I liked some of the subordinate coaches in my post.

I don't dislike Marv.....but enough is enough, know what I mean?  If they hired a new HC, and that guy decided to keep Lazor and a few others (unless it's Austin and Haslett), I'd be fine with that.

(10-24-2018, 01:34 AM)grampahol Wrote: Who would be down for throwing a few seasons intentionally for number 1 picks to completely rebuild? Assuming that the old codger MB kicks the bucket to NOT screw it up? I just don't see us ever getting over the proverbial hump unless we can jettison a huge chunk of the roster and coaching staff, ownership and well, the entire organization. 
I have to admit that I'm finally almost to the point of giving up my fan card to start taking applications from other teams to root for . I'm really at a loss to explain why I'm still a Bengals fan. I don't have family in Cincinnati and only 1 sister still in Dayton. HEY! Maybe if I actually finally do quit on the Bengals they'll finally get over the hump! That's it..I'm the reason they can't win big games..it's MY fault!  Blame me! I didn't go fishing Sunday .. If it was only that easy.. 
Regardless of what happens I'll always be a Reds fan for reasons I'll never be able to explain. Actually they go way back with my family .. My grandfather was almost a Cincinnati Red.. The Bengals? Just me unfortunately. 

Throwing seasons for a high pick is more of a baseball thing and it hasn’t went to plan for the Reds. Salaries and competition is so much closer in football that the throwing seasons don’t make sense.

(10-25-2018, 03:05 PM)Synric Wrote: I wonder how people would take it if Mike Brown offers Marvin Pete Brown's job..Vice President of Player Personnel.

I happen to think Marvin is a good strategic thinker, he knows how to build a good team and execute a seasonal game plan (stupid slogans aside), 2009 and 2015 being good examples.
However, he has said in recent interviews that he loves coaching and wouldn't be interested in getting kicked upstairs.
I really had hoped they gave Zimmer a shot and made marv gm/vp. Water under the bridge.
Pretty clear to anyone that Marv has done all he can here. I wss really surprised and disappointed that he was given 2 more years. Looked like a good off season for a minute, didn't it? But, no. I appreciate his efforts, especially getting us into a competent football team. His time is long past though....

(10-25-2018, 03:00 PM)Millhouse Wrote: Lazor isnt on as thin of ice that Austin should be, but his job shouldn't be guaranteed.


Currently the offense is 25th in yards/game. Even the Browns have more yards/game at 22nd,  the Browns! Passing O is 21st, Rushing O is 28th.

In points/game, they have fallen back to 11th after being near the top.

The last 3 games:
They weren't good against the Dolphins at home. If the defense didn't come away with those 2 TDs, who knows how that game turned out.

Then home at Pitt, they couldn't even reach 300 yards against a Pitt D that is having a down year, though they did scrape up 3 tds. And then the failure of Andy not managing the clock a bit better to shave off some time before the Mixon TD in between plays, but that falls on Marvin as well.

The Chiefs was a 90s era style of an embarrassment on NBC primetime. That almost counts as two bad games lol.

Yds. per game is meaningless. This offense is at, or close to the top when it comes to red zone scoring. And if ST's consistently gets you good field position, you don't have to go as many yds. to score. Granted, the Miami and KC games were ugly, but overall our offense has kept us in games, and the defense is what cost us. As to 2017 scuffing up Lazor's offense, even though he was promoted game 3, I don't think you can hold that against him, as he had no OTA's of Training Camp to implement his system, he had to do things on the fly, and at the end of the sseason they were clicking. No way I would even consider firing Lazor. At the end of this year, if the D does not improve, I would fire Austin and go outside the organization for a DC....