Is it lack of talent? Bad coaching? Combination? Injuries?

We know that Glenn might come back, but he's a pretty terrible run blocker and decent in pass protection.

The offensive line just stands there and looks confused until Dalton is sacked.

Bengals last three offensive plays:

Sack
Batted Pass
Sack

This 49ers D-Line is EATING. pic.twitter.com/k08rljd00b

— Anthony Treash (@PFF_Anthony) September 15, 2019

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There is zero push in the run game, ZERO. I’m not saying scheme and coaching does not have a role, but I think the hope for this offensive line is beyond repair due to lack of talent. The Miller/Hart combo on the right side is like having an ice pick shoved into the eyeball it’s so painful to watch.

Well, we have 3 new guys manning starting spots, so it's possible they will get better at playing together. Unfortunately, 2 of those 3 guys have already tapped out in game 2, so continuity will have to wait.

Talent wise, I think most of them are junk players. I don't see a lot of upside in any of them save Jordan, who's injury looked discouraging.

They need better players on the line, period. At least 2, maybe 3. They need 2 guards and badly need a RT. Not sure about center.

(09-15-2019, 11:06 PM)samhain Wrote: Well, we have 3 new guys manning starting spots, so it's possible they will get better at playing together. Unfortunately, 2 of those 3 guys have already tapped out in game 2, so continuity will have to wait.

Talent wise, I think most of them are junk players. I don't see a lot of upside in any of them save Jordan, who's injury looked discouraging.

They need better players on the line, period. At least 2, maybe 3. They need 2 guards and badly need a RT. Not sure about center.

We need RT so badly and yet they just paid Hart. His signing in the offseason boiled my blood and still does tonight. He is what he is, a horrible offensive lineman.

(09-15-2019, 10:59 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: The offensive line just stands there and looks confused until Dalton is sacked.

Bengals last three offensive plays:

Sack
Batted Pass
Sack

This 49ers D-Line is EATING. pic.twitter.com/k08rljd00b

— Anthony Treash (@PFF_Anthony) September 15, 2019

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On that particular play on the video, Dalton held the ball too long.  That was more a coverage sack than anything.

My two cents:  Injuries are the biggest single factor.  I think everyone came into the year thinking, at various times, that four guys who aren't starting would be.  That would be Boling, Price, Glenn, and after the draft Williams.  I know several posters- you among them- who have constantly been on management for not addressing the OL.  That's a bit of an exaggeration seeing how they could not foresee some of the events which have transpired.

(09-15-2019, 10:53 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Is it lack of talent? Bad coaching? Combination? Injuries?

We know that Glenn might come back, but he's a pretty terrible run blocker and decent in pass protection.

This OL will be better in pass protection than run blocking. If the Bengals want to run better, they need to replace Miller (maybe with Price?).
I hope the Bengals get (at least) one good starter for OL next year.

No. Our interior is "okay" woth Hopkins being the lone bright spot. Jordan has potential, but with the knee injury who knows.

At tackle we have two literal scrubs currently starting.

This O-Line is not fixable this year. It will take 2-3 years to fix. The talent is not there. Hopefully Jonah Williams is above average at LT and Hopkins improves. I know Hart has improved but he is not the answer at RT if the Bengals plan to rush the ball. Not sure Hopkins is the Center of future either.

(09-15-2019, 11:10 PM)ElkValleyBengal Wrote: On that particular play on the video, Dalton held the ball too long.  That was more a coverage sack than anything.

My two cents:  Injuries are the biggest single factor.  I think everyone came into the year thinking, at various times, that four guys who aren't starting would be.  That would be Boling, Price, Glenn, and after the draft Williams.  I know several posters- you among them- who have constantly been on management for not addressing the OL.  That's a bit of an exaggeration seeing how they could not foresee some of the events which have transpired.

Yet the right side of the line which has had no injuries is just as bad if not worse.

John Miller stinks said that the second we signed him. Never expected Hart to develop he has been in the league 5 years. Hopkins has been solid. Don’t have high expectations for LT which is realistic considering the injuries. Even if Glenn comes back his play has been on a steady decline and he’s injury prone. With Jordan’s injury we need a guy like Price to step up, he’s a 1st round pick and we desperately need young o-line talent.

(09-15-2019, 10:53 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Is it lack of talent? Bad coaching? Combination? Injuries?

We know that Glenn might come back, but he's a pretty terrible run blocker and decent in pass protection.

It's a combination of issues.

Being fair, based on the roster after the draft, they started their 3rd string LT and finished with their 4th string LG at LT.  They're starting what would've been their 3rd string LG after Boling retired and finished the game with their 2nd string C there.  Any OL is going to have a tough go of it considering the lack of quality OL depth around the league.

While the OL competition was healthy and can pay dividends down the road, it hurt chemistry.  I think Turner also focused more on pass pro to keep Andy from getting killed, but with no run game, teams can just tee off.  There was a good write up on Cincyjungle last week illustrating that a lot of the run issues against Seattle came down to guys being slow to release to the second level on combo blocks and allowing LB's to run free.  That should improve with time as guys get more used to each other and it becomes a point of coaching emphasis.  If it improves soon enough to save the season is another matter.

Talent is part of it.  Hopkins is the only one you can really say has played well.  Miller has been serviceable.  Hart isn't good, but you figure that they could have schemed to help him if they hadn't lost Jonah, Boling, and Glenn. 

lol no unless they get Trent Williams. Bobby Hart looks like actual pudding. He doesn’t do weightlifting.

(09-15-2019, 11:10 PM)ElkValleyBengal Wrote: On that particular play on the video, Dalton held the ball too long.  That was more a coverage sack than anything.

My two cents:  Injuries are the biggest single factor.  I think everyone came into the year thinking, at various times, that four guys who aren't starting would be.  That would be Boling, Price, Glenn, and after the draft Williams.  I know several posters- you among them- who have constantly been on management for not addressing the OL.  That's a bit of an exaggeration seeing how they could not foresee some of the events which have transpired.

Jordan also completely stopped blocking his man.

Maybe its time to (for a while) abandon the zone blocking and just have them do good old fashioned angled drive blocks. It's simple and not as reliant on a line having chemistry.

No, there is not enough talent and depth. I think we knew this going in especially when Jonah Williams went out. Even when he is back if they don't make some moves to acquire other linemen via trade or free agency it's going to be a long rebuilding phase for the O-line. It seems the Bengals have been trying build an O-line for years with what ended up being one bad draft pick after another. Hell, we don't even know if Williams will work out. Price seems to not be living up to his draft position so far. But hey, we can always get better via the draft says a Bengals team that has not been able to do so in the last several years.

(09-15-2019, 11:10 PM)ElkValleyBengal Wrote: On that particular play on the video, Dalton held the ball too long.  That was more a coverage sack than anything.

My two cents:  Injuries are the biggest single factor.  I think everyone came into the year thinking, at various times, that four guys who aren't starting would be.  That would be Boling, Price, Glenn, and after the draft Williams.  I know several posters- you among them- who have constantly been on management for not addressing the OL.  That's a bit of an exaggeration seeing how they could not foresee some of the events which have transpired.

They could foresee it, in a sense. OL is the weakest position in the league by far so they team should have not only kept the good ones they had (Whit, Zeitler) but drafted more of them. You literally cannot have enough good OL. Use the DL as an example (well, maybe not today). At worst, you have 'too many' and you can trade to desperate teams. 

The fact that good OL are so scarce was the main reason I disagreed with letting Whit and Zeitler go. We will pay Dre $9M per year and Hart $5M but would not pay Zeitler - by the way his contract now is not that bad as many guards are paid more. Complete front office lack of planning, strategy and awareness. 

(09-15-2019, 11:04 PM)thompson19osu Wrote: There is zero push in the run game, ZERO. I’m not saying scheme and coaching does not have a role, but I think the hope for this offensive line is beyond repair due to lack of talent. The Miller/Hart combo on the right side is like having an ice pick shoved into the eyeball it’s so painful to watch.

I agree. I don't look at any of them individually and think they are even average...except Hopkins who has surprisingly played well at C.

(09-15-2019, 11:14 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: This O-Line is not fixable this year.  It will take 2-3 years to fix.  The talent is not there.  Hopefully Jonah Williams is above average at LT and Hopkins improves.  I know Hart has improved but he is not the answer at RT if the Bengals plan to rush the ball. Not sure Hopkins is the Center of future either.

Do we know that Hart has improved?

(09-15-2019, 11:45 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Do we know that Hart has improved?

Yes, he has gone from super shitty to just shitty