(12-12-2019, 10:37 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Over the previous decade and a half the Bengals are in the top half of the league in wins; top ten in playoff appearances

Where do they rank in the last 4 years?

How about at 5 years? 

How about at 25 years? 30, 40, 50...

The number stated by the OP is significant since it represents the bulk of our head honcho's tenure. 50 years is significant because it covers the entirety of the franchise. 5 years, and less, is significant because it's recent.

15 years is arbitrary and picked entirely to support a narrative that is only meant to deflect warranted gripes. You could have at least gone with a nice round number like 20, which would have somewhat made your flawed point, but you're so desperate you throw out a cherry picked 15. 

Like no one can see you going out of your way to massage the numbers? It's embarrassing. I'm embarrassed for you. You look like a fool.

The fact is, no matter what numbers and years you pull, you can't argue that Mike's tenure has been a disaster. Whether or not you place a significant value on playoff wins, you can't argue that three decades without one isn't a tremendous failure. 

For you to get on here, day after day, to offer garbage takes like this one takes a lot of nerve. To try to defend this owner, and this front office is something else. And to still do it after this year, after all years? Shame on you!

We're 1-13. We've now gone 4 straight years without even a .500 season. We haven't advanced past the Wild Card round in 30 years. We've never won a Superbowl. If people want to vent then let them. If any fanbase has earned ir it's this one. And you'll bs 15 years, top half of the league (Yay!) isn't changing anyone's mind.

Only the following teams have won more than one Super Bowl:
Patriots (6)
Steelers (6)
Cowboys (5)
49ers (5 - thanks Joe)
Packers (4)
Giants (4)
Broncos (3)
Redskins (3)
Raiders (3)
Ravens (2)
Dolphins (2)
Colts (2)
----------------
12 teams total

8 more teams have won just one Super Bowl:
Rams
Saints
Eagles
Jets
Bears
Chiefs
Seahawks
Buccaneers

12 teams have never won a Super Bowl:
Bengals
Lions
Falcons
Panthers
Texans
Chargers
Titans/Oilers
Cardinals
Jaguars
Browns
Vikings
Bills

When it comes to professional sports, all people outside of a team's fan base will probably only remember the number of championships for that team. Not the number of winning seasons or playoff wins.

(12-12-2019, 10:37 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Over the previous decade and a half the Bengals are in the top half of the league in wins; top ten in playoff appearances; and tied for 11th in Super Bowl Championships.

Just curious, but why do you defend this front office?  

Seriously.  Is it just to be a troll or do you really enjoy 30 years of losing? (minus a few playoff appearances)

(12-13-2019, 08:12 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: Like no one can see you going out of your way to massage the numbers? It's embarrassing. I'm embarrassed for you. You look like a fool.

Lighten up Francis.


We are posting in a thread where the OP randomly picked 1995 to prove his point, and the only reason you didn't start with the personal insults on him is because he is on your side.

(12-13-2019, 08:42 PM)Kingslayer Wrote: Just curious, but why do you defend this front office?  

Seriously.  Is it just to be a troll or do you really enjoy 30 years of losing? (minus a few playoff appearances)

If you read all of my posts you will see that I rip the front office a lot.  But I just complain about their football decisions.


I have a problem with the people here who insist we have been the absolute worst team in the entire league forever.  And I have a problem with the people who are not satisfied with saying the front office makes bad decisions, but instead make it personal.  It is childish to refer to the Browns as "the inbreds".  It is absurd to question why the league does not step in and take over the franchise.  But that is the type of shit I keep reading around here.


I just don't respect grown men who feel they have to lie, spin, and exaggerate just to make themselves bigger victims.  I am not a big fan of endless bitching and moaning.

The Bengals are deeply flawed.  We are on our fourth straight losing season, but before that we only had 4 losing seasons in 14 years.  As much as it pains some people here hate to admit that is far from the worst stretch in the league.

(12-13-2019, 08:37 PM)ochocincos Wrote: When it comes to professional sports, all people outside of a team's fan base will probably only remember the number of championships for that team. Not the number of winning seasons or playoff wins.

I agree that most fans remember who wins (or makes it to) the Super Bowl more than anything.  But they also have  good feel for which teams are consistently good.  For example it has been about a decade since the Saints and Packers won their the Super Bowls. I have no idea how many playoff games they have won since then, but I know they have been pretty consistent winners.  On the other hand it has also ben close to a decade since the Giants won their last Super Bowl, but I know they have sucked since then.

(12-13-2019, 06:52 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: That 15 year period is propped up greatly by the 5 year run form 2011-2015. The other 10 years has produced a record of 64-91-2. 

As for the playoffs, 22 different teams have appeared in 7 or more playoff games during the last 15 years...with 21 of them having won at least 2 games.

Great post! So over arguably the best stretch in franchise history...22 different teams have appear in 7 or more playoff games. That puts things in perspective!

(12-13-2019, 07:01 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: Fans shouldn't talk about the fact that an organization that has been around for over 50 years can count it's TOTAL playoff wins on ONE hand? 

Yes - 5 total playoff wins in franchise history is just such a small number. And despite what people say, playoff wins are important. Kind of hard to win a Super Bowl if you don't win playoff games!

(12-13-2019, 07:19 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: That may well be true, but they can also count their teams total playoff wins on more than one hand. I'm not trying to be a smartass by saying that. It's just the truth of the situation. What does this fan base have to talk about? Two Super Bowls in the 80's that both ended in heartbreak? Five total playoffs wins in 50+ years? Setting multiple NFL records for playoff futility under Marvin? Not winning a playoff game in almost 3 decades?

I mean seriously brother, what can we brag about as a fan base? That we're 18th in wins over the last 15 years? It's not the fans fault that they don't have very many success stories to talk about.  

Indeed. Winning playoff games is common for fanbases other than the Bengals, Lions, and Browns. Most teams have won 5+ playoff games since we last won 1.

That's why those fanbases don't talk about playoff wins. Because it's no big deal for them.

For us? We've won atleast 1 playoff game in what 3 out of 51 seasons? (Assuming we don't win one this year.  )

And this year we're 1-12 so far. New Dey!

(12-12-2019, 10:47 PM)fredtoast Wrote: No other fan base in the league keeps track of playoff wins. 

No other fanbase arbitrarily picks a 15 year window to celebrate being in the top half of the league either.

Other fans don't celebrate being average, or slightly above. They don't hold up finishing 12th as some grand accomp!ishment. Other fans call for coaches and GM's heads for better performances. And they're short on patience and their faith wears quickly. It's a what have done for me lately, unforgiving business.

While you're pointing at top half of the league stats, as some proof of concept, other fans are holding much higher standards...
,
See Ron Rivera... 4 years removed from 15-1 and a trip to the Superbowl, 2 years removed from 11-5, made the playoffs 4 out of the previous 5 years.  GONE.

Mary Schottenheimer, Andy Reid, Tom Coughlin, Brian Billick, John Fox, Jim Harbough, Bruce Arians, etc. All well past your criteria of finishing top half of the league, and all told to hit the road.

Other fanbases dont value what you do. So if you're going to concern yoursslf with how they behave then I would suggest with starting with yourself. No one celebrates mediocrity, and they certainly don't use it to deflect blame.

(12-13-2019, 07:08 PM)fredtoast Wrote: All I am saying is that very few NFL fans can tell you how many playoff wins most teams have.  They are much more likely to know how often a team makes the playoffs or how many times they have been to the Super Bowl.  Bengal fans are the only ones who measure success by playoff wins.


 

This team has won ZERO playoff games solely under Mike Brown's ownership.

You don't even need fingers to count that shit ya genius.

(12-14-2019, 12:15 AM)BengalsRocker Wrote: This team has won ZERO playoff games solely under Mike Brown's ownership.

You don't even need fingers to count that shit ya genius.

Yes. 5 playoff wins in 51 years. 3 seasons with atleast 1 playoff victory.

(12-14-2019, 12:24 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Yes. 5 playoff wins in 51 years. 3 seasons with atleast 1 playoff victory.

Last playoff win was 1990.  Just crazy.  Paul Brown was still owner.

(12-14-2019, 12:29 AM)BengalsRocker Wrote: Last playoff win was 1990.  Just crazy.  Paul Brown was still owner.

Hey! Haven't you read on the board how it's ok that we don't have the same amount of scouts though as the Patriots...because you don't need scouts with TV! 

Hey! I've come up with a new stat:

Since June 2019, we're tied for 1st in Super Bowl wins with 0! Patriots have 0 too!

I just think it is absolutely hilarious that we have to debate , FAILURE.

This franchise has failed, the front office has failed, the coaches have failed the players have failed the FANS have failed what on earth is there to debate?

This , team , SUCKS.

Do something different to fix it.

(12-14-2019, 02:44 AM)Kingslayer Wrote: I just think it is absolutely hilarious that we have to debate , FAILURE.

This franchise has failed, the front office has failed, the coaches have failed the players have failed the FANS have failed what on earth is there to debate?

This , team , SUCKS.  

Do something different to fix it.

Yep.

The moment you realize you haven't seen the team you watch win in the playoffs for 30 damn years.

Then you have some yahoo telling you that your expectations are unrealistic and you don't have a grasp on reality.

Are we all living in the same dimension?

(12-14-2019, 02:44 AM)Kingslayer Wrote: I just think it is absolutely hilarious that we have to debate , FAILURE.

This franchise has failed, the front office has failed, the coaches have failed the players have failed the FANS have failed what on earth is there to debate?

This , team , SUCKS.  

Do something different to fix it.

There is absolutely no reason to debate failure. 

It basically comes down to the fact that the bitching and moaning are ruining some people's experience of this message board.  I think they like to have their hobby (if you will) about discussing the Bengals, but they'd like to do it on their own terms.   

It has nothing to do with the personal potshots at Mike Brown, but everything to do with the negative posts pointed at the Bengals.  The fans are upset and they have every right to be.  I'm sure there are rare exceptions, but I think the Mods keep this board pretty clean, therefor all the bitching and moaning are warranted because WE ARE 1-13!!!!!!  

There really isn't much positive to talk about.  If you want that, then let's open a  thread on great things about the 81 & 88 Super Bowl teams.
I think if there were positive things happening about this team, it'd be valid to call out the negative nancies, but if you want to read mostly positive posts, come back when the team is winning (which could be a few years down the road at this point).

(12-14-2019, 10:59 AM)2MinutesHate Wrote: There is absolutely no reason to debate failure. 

It basically comes down to the fact that the bitching and moaning are ruining some people's experience of this message board.  I think they like to have their hobby (if you will) about discussing the Bengals, but they'd like to do it on their own terms.   

It has nothing to do with the personal potshots at Mike Brown, but everything to do with the negative posts pointed at the Bengals.  The fans are upset and they have every right to be.  I'm sure there are rare exceptions, but I think the Mods keep this board pretty clean, therefor all the bitching and moaning are warranted because WE ARE 1-13!!!!!!  

There really isn't much positive to talk about.  If you want that, then let's open a  thread on great things about the 81 & 88 Super Bowl teams.
I think if there were positive things happening about this team, it'd be valid to call out the negative nancies, but if you want to read mostly positive posts, come back when the team is winning (which could be a few years down the road at this point).

Yes it is entirely about not wallowing in negativity.

Unfortunately it's a hard sell about positives in these parts.

So hard, that some posters feel it's necessary to dig deep and call those with skepticism absurd.

You can fuzzy math this stuff to death but the reality is Mike Brown's legacy is not one of success.

It might give us a glimmer of hope that he and his cohorts want to adapt to the modern NFL and not be stuck in their stubborn approach.

Instead we get the same ol' Mikey standing pat until he has to make some kind of change.

Drive this jalopy till the wheels fall off approach.  Not making fixes or adjustments to keep up with others in their division not to mention the whole league.

This team is like nothing else in my life.  Usually you stop using and buying bad products.  Yet my loyalty remains to the brand.

Of course I've stopped going to games and buying merchandise as the reality of how inept this organization is.

Nostalgia from childhood and time invested as a fan have what kept me hanging on.

So that being said there are SOB posters who believe if I harbor bitterness about the ownership that I'm playing "the victim" card.

To them I say you can ignore me and move along or more eloquently put...  PISS OFF !!

(12-14-2019, 12:29 AM)BengalsRocker Wrote: Last playoff win was 1990.  Just crazy.  Paul Brown was still owner.

I was born in 1991 so my entire life I have never seen a Bengals playoff win. It's been fun times waiting for it though haha. What a glorious day it will be... if it ever comes