For the first time in a while, I spent the day yesterday in the Gameday thread.
I don't normally spend my time there because I usually watch the game with my father and brother, both of whom happened to be out of town this weekend, so I don't typically watch the game with a computer on my lap. I spend it talking to them and eating pizza.

I enjoyed my time in there for the most part. I like seeing hot takes, immediate reactions to plays and commentary on the good and the bad plays as they occur. It's fun.

When we lost, I was mildly upset, mostly about the way we lost (a ticky tacky OPI that had already not been called on the Chargers earlier in the game negates our game winning touchdown and then a field goal is missed from basically point blank range. That hurts), but I was MOSTLY very pleased with the game. Our defense played well. Joe made some great passes. Our receivers were getting open and showing some moves in the secondary and Mixon had a good game. Even our Oline was better than I expected in the second half (the first half was a disaster).

That's why I was surprised when, in the game chat, there were a few people who seemed to...actually be heartbroken that we lost yesterday.  And also seemed to be, generally, not pleased with Burrow's performance.

And not your typical "I hate it when the Bengals lose" mood, but "I can't believe I actually believed in this team all off season" existential depression kind of stuff.

I was a bit caught off guard by it all. I felt like I was watching a different game than them.

But after thinking about it, I realized that that may be because of what my expectations were going into this season.

You see, I came into this season thinking "I wouldn't mind seeing winning football, but what I really want to see is our young defense and coaching staff continue to develop and, more importantly, see what it's like to have a real QB for the first time in over a decade."

I do not expect a super bowl win or even a playoff run this season. I didn't even expect to have a winning record. From my perspective, we are at the beginning of a rebuild, as teams often are when they start a rookie QB.

So, for someone with my expectations, yesterday's game gave me everything I wanted and more. We saw Joe being a great leader on the field. We saw him show poise and composure. We saw some of his pocket presence that Dalton so sorely lacked (even though it did result in 2 unnecessary sacks). We saw some pin point passes that Dalton could have never dreamed of completing. And we saw a defense that actually knew how to contain an offense. All week we were hearing about how Austin Eckler was going to destroy us in the passing game (he had 1 reception for 3 yards).

I just wanted to share my perspective on this season and yesterday's game. I know we all were hoping Burrow was going to immediately be Joe from college, but that was never a realistic expectation. He showed improvement from one drive to the next and, with the exception of a few gaffes, he had a pretty continuous upward curve as the game went on, ending in a fantastic drive that should have won us the game.

What are your guys' thoughts? Were you happy about the developments that occurred yesterday like I was? Or are you already getting ready to draft Trevor Lawrence with the number 1 overall pick next year because we're so bad, nothing has changed and we're doomed?

(09-14-2020, 10:29 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: For the first time in a while, I spent the day yesterday in the Gameday thread.
I don't normally spend my time there because I usually watch the game with my father and brother, both of whom happened to be out of town this weekend, so I don't typically watch the game with a computer on my lap. I spend it talking to them and eating pizza.

I enjoyed my time in there for the most part. I like seeing hot takes, immediate reactions to plays and commentary on the good and the bad plays as they occur. It's fun.

When we lost, I was mildly upset, mostly about the way we lost (a ticky tacky OPI that had already not been called on the Chargers earlier in the game negates our game winning touchdown and then a field goal is missed from basically point blank range. That hurts), but I was MOSTLY very pleased with the game. Our defense played well. Joe made some great passes. Our receivers were getting open and showing some moves in the secondary and Mixon had a good game. Even our Oline was better than I expected in the second half (the first half was a disaster).

That's why I was surprised when, in the game chat, there were a few people who seemed to...actually be heartbroken that we lost yesterday.  And also seemed to be, generally, not pleased with Burrow's performance.

And not your typical "I hate it when the Bengals lose" mood, but "I can't believe I actually believed in this team all off season" existential depression kind of stuff.

I was a bit caught off guard by it all. I felt like I was watching a different game than them.

But after thinking about it, I realized that that may be because of what my expectations were going into this season.

You see, I came into this seasoning thinking "I wouldn't mind seeing winning football, but what I really want to see is our young defense and coaching staff continue to develop and, more importantly, see what it's like to have a real QB for the first time in over a decade."

I do not expect a super bowl win or even a playoff run this season. I didn't even expect to have a winning record. From my perspective, we are at the beginning of a rebuild, as teams often are when they start a rookie QB.

So, for someone with my expectations, yesterday's game gave me everything I wanted and more. We saw Joe being a great leader on the field. We saw him show poise and composure. We saw some of his pocket presence that Dalton so sorely missed (even though it did result in 2 unnecessary sacks). We saw some pin point passes that Dalton could have never dreamed of completing. And we saw a defense that actually knew how to contain an offense. All week we were hearing about how Austin Eckler was going to destroy us in the passing game (he had 1 reception for 3 yards).

I just wanted to share my perspective on this season and yesterday's game. I know we all were hoping Burrow was going to immediately be Joe from college, but that was never a realistic expectation. He showed improvement from one drive to the next and, with the exception of a few gaffes, he had a pretty continuous upward curve as the game went on, ending in a fantastic drive that should have won us the game.

What are your guys' thoughts? Were you happy about the developments that occurred yesterday like I was? Or are you already getting ready to draft Trevor Lawrence with the number 1 overall pick next year because we're so bad, nothing has changed and we're doomed?

I enjoy the GameDay thread but you must realize that there are more than a few Chicken Littles in there plus hyperbole is the norm. Once you understand that, you can have some fun by cracking jokes (despite how SOME feel about them), joining in, fighting the hyperbole/season is over after the 1st QTR of the 1st game Chicken Littles, and/or messing with those of us who are behind because we're watching on a stream.

You can have fun, but you gotta make it fun.

(09-14-2020, 10:29 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: What are your guys' thoughts? Were you happy about the developments that occurred yesterday like I was? Or are you already getting ready to draft Trevor Lawrence with the number 1 overall pick next year because we're so bad, nothing has changed and we're doomed?

Well, I'd wager about 16 fanbases are already thinking of how to use that 1st overall pick they "totally gonna end up with because they so awful this year" oddly, the Jaguars aren't one of those teams at the moment.  I've got to say, if we did actually get the 1st overall pick and Burrow learned on the job and we could trade it for a boatload of picks and then dangle Burrow and a buttload of picks in front of a slew of prospective coaching staffs I'd feel this franchise could finally take a leap into awesomeness.

But win loss doesn't matter this year, really.  Burrow showed some fire, made some mistakes to learn from, and put the team in a position to do something.  I'll call it a decent enough day, but lordy in some aspects he's put behind the eight ball here.

(09-14-2020, 10:33 AM)PhilHos Wrote: I enjoy the GameDay thread but you must realize that there are more than a few Chicken Littles in there plus hyperbole is the norm. Once you understand that, you can have some fun by cracking jokes (despite how SOME feel about them), joining in, fighting the hyperbole/season is over after the 1st QTR of the 1st game Chicken Littles, and/or messing with those of us who are behind because we're watching on a stream.

You can have fun, but you gotta make it fun.

Watching on a stream that is about 30+ seconds behind is always a hoot.  The Bengals are lining up for an easy FG to send it into OT and I see a bunch of BUNGLES!!!! and AAAAAAARRRRRGHHHHHH!!! posts.  Classic.

I think a lot of people came in with the expectation that Burrow was gonna tear it up. Even leading up to the game last week I spotted him something like 2TDs and 300 yards, which in retrospect was silly. I think the immediate realization that this Oline is still trash and that one player isn’t going to turn everything around instantly got some people really upset.

This fan base is dying to see some success and is extremely volatile.

I just want to see Burrow and the staff improve from drive to drive and week to week. I never had any expectations for a winning season this year. It would be great.
The kicker is troubling. The HC time management unacceptable. He needs to do his job, be a HC, and let OC call the plays. That being said, they do seem better at in game adjustments.

I agree with crazyjdawg (just not quoting such a long post).

I don't think it's the end of the world. I think what has me bummed the most is that I predict we'll lose the next two games, and an 0-3 start is just going to feel dreadful. I wanted this one to get some early breathing room.

But I never even thought we'd be better than average this year so i'm not that heartbroken.

I figure 6-8 wins this year is a nice step in the right direction in year one of this total rebuild. I think a lot of fans hadn't gotten comfortable with that notion. They thought changing QBs was all it was going to take. The d has improved, Burrow showed glimpses, AJ has some rust to shake off but looked good. There's still work to be done, but anyone coming into this season expecting a playoff run were kidding themselves or unrealistically just blaming the prior QB for everything.

Too many changes with the roster this past year, no off-season, shortened TC/pre-season period... It would be awesome for the team to have come out on fire game 1 and owned it, but it wasn't likely. What happened is exactly what I expected would happen. Flashes of what guys can do this season and going forward and some flaws still. There were a lot more flaws last year. I'm personally willing to give it a good 4-5 games to see where the progress is before I start calling for Taylor's head or saying they drafted poorly this year.

My main concerns going into this season were:

A. Zac Taylor
B. O blocking
C. Lou & his defense

After yesterday, I feel a lot better about the defense. The oline started off horrendously, but by that last drive were playing a bit better. Time will tell soon enough on them.

I never did like the Taylor hire simply because he had zero experience at any level of being an OC while laso being the HC at the same time. Hell Marvin was at least a bonified legit DC, and he gave that up to be the HC. Hope I am wrong on Taylor, so we'll see.

I'm in agreement with much of the OP's post.

I'm more concerned with development and positive signs for the future than I am with trying to finish .500 or above.

That said, I do have some expectations for the staff. I expect a minimum of 5 wins. A 2 win season, followed by a 4 or less win will get someone fired pretty much anywhere else. If it's not acceptable elsewhere then it shouldn't be acceptable here.

I also am looking for improved play calling, scheming and gameplan. I need to see evidence that Zac Taylor is capable of running the offense and is properly preparing his guys.

I'm sorry, but after yesterday I'd have to give Zac Taylor an F for that game. The use of timeouts is unforgiveable, and the playcalling left a lot to be desired.

I'm having a hard time believe right now that's he's going to hit my 5 win minimum or that he's going to prove himself a capable play caller. But the good news is he's got 15 more games to win me over.

I'm not asking for much. I just need to see a relatively small amount of improvement.

(09-14-2020, 10:29 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: For the first time in a while, I spent the day yesterday in the Gameday thread.
I don't normally spend my time there because I usually watch the game with my father and brother, both of whom happened to be out of town this weekend, so I don't typically watch the game with a computer on my lap. I spend it talking to them and eating pizza.

I enjoyed my time in there for the most part. I like seeing hot takes, immediate reactions to plays and commentary on the good and the bad plays as they occur. It's fun.

When we lost, I was mildly upset, mostly about the way we lost (a ticky tacky OPI that had already not been called on the Chargers earlier in the game negates our game winning touchdown and then a field goal is missed from basically point blank range. That hurts), but I was MOSTLY very pleased with the game. Our defense played well. Joe made some great passes. Our receivers were getting open and showing some moves in the secondary and Mixon had a good game. Even our Oline was better than I expected in the second half (the first half was a disaster).

That's why I was surprised when, in the game chat, there were a few people who seemed to...actually be heartbroken that we lost yesterday.  And also seemed to be, generally, not pleased with Burrow's performance.

And not your typical "I hate it when the Bengals lose" mood, but "I can't believe I actually believed in this team all off season" existential depression kind of stuff.

I was a bit caught off guard by it all. I felt like I was watching a different game than them.

But after thinking about it, I realized that that may be because of what my expectations were going into this season.

You see, I came into this season thinking "I wouldn't mind seeing winning football, but what I really want to see is our young defense and coaching staff continue to develop and, more importantly, see what it's like to have a real QB for the first time in over a decade."

I do not expect a super bowl win or even a playoff run this season. I didn't even expect to have a winning record. From my perspective, we are at the beginning of a rebuild, as teams often are when they start a rookie QB.

So, for someone with my expectations, yesterday's game gave me everything I wanted and more. We saw Joe being a great leader on the field. We saw him show poise and composure. We saw some of his pocket presence that Dalton so sorely lacked (even though it did result in 2 unnecessary sacks). We saw some pin point passes that Dalton could have never dreamed of completing. And we saw a defense that actually knew how to contain an offense. All week we were hearing about how Austin Eckler was going to destroy us in the passing game (he had 1 reception for 3 yards).

I just wanted to share my perspective on this season and yesterday's game. I know we all were hoping Burrow was going to immediately be Joe from college, but that was never a realistic expectation. He showed improvement from one drive to the next and, with the exception of a few gaffes, he had a pretty continuous upward curve as the game went on, ending in a fantastic drive that should have won us the game.

What are your guys' thoughts? Were you happy about the developments that occurred yesterday like I was? Or are you already getting ready to draft Trevor Lawrence with the number 1 overall pick next year because we're so bad, nothing has changed and we're doomed?

In their defense, a year ago our Bengals went into a hostile environment in Seattle and almost beat the Hawks. So, I think the concern is hoping we don't pull a 2019 and not win until November or so after we looked like a decent team in week #1. In the end, losing a close game is a bad thing, players have to play better at crunch time, coaches need to coach better at crunch time. We lost, so it showed some the same as 2019 so lack of progress.

(09-14-2020, 01:12 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: I'm in agreement with much of the OP's post.

I'm more concerned with development and positive signs for the future than I am with trying to finish .500 or above.

That said, I do have some expectations for the staff.  I expect a minimum of 5 wins.  A 2 win season, followed by a 4 or less win will get someone fired pretty much anywhere else.  If it's not acceptable elsewhere then it shouldn't be acceptable here.

I also am looking for improved play calling, scheming and gameplan.  I need to see evidence that Zac Taylor is capable of running the offense and is properly preparing his guys.

I'm sorry, but after yesterday I'd have to give Zac Taylor an F for that game.  The use of timeouts is unforgiveable, and the playcalling left a lot to be desired.

I'm having a hard time believe right now that's he's going to hit my 5 win minimum or that he's going to prove himself a capable play caller.  But the good news is he's got 15 more games to win me over.

I'm not asking for much.  I just need to see a relatively small amount of improvement.

It amazes me we give Taylor a free pass to win in 2020. The guy is now 2-15 and making ML look like a HOF coach which we know he is not.

(09-14-2020, 01:25 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: It amazes me we give Taylor a free pass to win in 2020. The guy is now 2-15 and making ML look like a HOF coach which we know he is not.

Marvin came in after winning a Super Bowl as the DC of one of the greatest defenses of all time. He gave up the DC playcalling duties to concentrate on being the HC.

Zac Taylor comes in as a 3rd string offensive coach after going to the Super Bowl and losing. He never was an OC, never played 'chess' with veteran defensive coordinators out there. Yet here he is as both the playcaller on O and the HC. And now this season Taylor is tasked in grooming a record breaking college QB. 

If there isn't clear signs of improvement by end of the season, Taylor has to be fired and they need to bring in an experienced OC with a record of success above all else, then find a HC.

Just beat the Steelers. That's all I want anymore. Is that too much to ask?

I’m basically viewing the September games as preseason. I expect mistakes and some sloppy play. What I am not prepared for or condone are coaches not making changes when they see something/someone hurting the team’s chances at success. I’ve had enough of status quo Marv, ZT was supposed to be a “New Dey”, up and coming offensive genius and he’s basically just a younger version of Marv.

(09-14-2020, 01:25 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: It amazes me we give Taylor a free pass to win in 2020. The guy is now 2-15 and making ML look like a HOF coach which we know he is not.

I don't think anyone should give Taylor a free pass. He's been given the best FA haul the team has ever signed and he was allowed to pick his own staff. The first time any HC has had that in the Mike Brown era. Marvin was still having to deal with Alexander after 17 years.

The team needs to at least 7 wins if it is to be improved over the 2018 team that Marvin somehow got wins out of.

If Taylor fails to at least achieve that, then I really don't see him ever returning the Bengals to the playoffs. Might as well send him packing at the end of this season.

 

(09-14-2020, 03:37 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: I’m basically viewing the September games as preseason. I expect mistakes and some sloppy play. What I am not prepared for or condone are coaches not making changes when they see something/someone hurting the team’s chances at success. I’ve had enough of status quo Marv, ZT was supposed to be a “New Dey”, up and coming offensive genius and he’s basically just a younger version of Marv.

He wishes he was Marv...

(09-14-2020, 10:29 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: I was a bit caught off guard by it all. I felt like I was watching a different game than them.

Gameday is a strange animal.  If yesterday's performance had happened in a game late last season, the thread would have been hysterical.  I mean, when the season's over and this team is getting reamed, everyone accepts it and the banter can be LMAO funny.  But, after a shit year of Covid, empty stands, 29 consecutive seasons of no playoff wins (and that in conjunction with four consecutive losing seasons), there's not much to be upbeat about.  So, people will tend to be morose and drama queens.  When we're winning some are insane in the opposite direction.  It's like one of those prescription drug commercials where the sufferers are strapped into a roller coaster or on a runaway elevator.  But, there's no place (outside of PBS) I'd rather be for a game.  

(09-14-2020, 10:43 AM)GreenCornBengal Wrote: I think a lot of people came in with the expectation that Burrow was gonna tear it up. Even leading up to the game last week I spotted him something like 2TDs and 300 yards, which in retrospect was silly. 

It was the Burrow hype. I fell for it too. Didn't think he would get 300yds, but I thought he would do better. But I'm really not disappointed in him as a rookie in his first game. He's going to get it.

(09-14-2020, 12:56 PM)Wyche Wrote: I figure 6-8 wins this year is a nice step in the right direction in year one of this total rebuild. I think a lot of fans hadn't gotten comfortable with that notion. They thought changing QBs was all it was going to take. The d has improved, Burrow showed glimpses, AJ has some rust to shake off but looked good. There's still work to be done, but anyone coming into this season expecting a playoff run were kidding themselves or unrealistically just blaming the prior QB for everything.

Good points. Again, I think it was the Burrow hype. AD led us to the playoffs his rookie year and, well, Burrow is better than Andy. I'm still hoping he puts it together quickly and eliminates the mistakes.

(09-14-2020, 01:25 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: It amazes me we give Taylor a free pass to win in 2020. The guy is now 2-15 and making ML look like a HOF coach which we know he is not.

I really like Zac. Yet, he has to put himself up there with what he expects from others. He has no problem taking responsibility, but will he relieve himself of the play calling duties if that doesn't improve soon? He really didn't make too many bad play calls yesterday, but he wasn't perfect. Is his play calling a distraction and why he burned through the timeouts yesterday?

(09-14-2020, 01:50 PM)Destro Wrote: Just beat the Steelers. That's all I want anymore. Is that too much to ask?

I would love to beat the steelers twice a year. However, if that's all we did and we let the rest of the league crap on us like a hooker on OBJ's chest? That would stink!

(09-14-2020, 07:13 PM)BengalChris Wrote: I don't think anyone should give Taylor a free pass. He's been given the best FA haul the team has ever signed and he was allowed to pick his own staff. The first time any HC has had that in the Mike Brown era. Marvin was still having to deal with Alexander after 17 years.

The team needs to at least 7 wins if it is to be improved over the 2018 team that Marvin somehow got wins out of.

If Taylor fails to at least achieve that, then I really don't see him ever returning the Bengals to the playoffs. Might as well send him packing at the end of this season.

 

Don't pull the trigger so fast. I don't think anyone is giving Zac a free pass. As someone else stated in another thread (sorry, can't remember who), He came to the team late last year because of SB. This year, he made some spectacular changes in FA and we have a rookie QB. Add that to no preseason games to work with, etc. I'll give him leniency, but I won't turn my head. 

(09-14-2020, 07:27 PM)Awful Llama Wrote: Gameday is a strange animal.  If yesterday's performance had happened in a game late last season, the thread would have been hysterical.  I mean, when the season's over and this team is getting reamed, everyone accepts it and the banter can be LMAO funny.  But, after a shit year of Covid, empty stands, 29 consecutive seasons of no playoff wins (and that in conjunction with four consecutive losing seasons), there's not much to be upbeat about.  So, people will tend to be morose and drama queens.  When we're winning some are insane in the opposite direction.  It's like one of those prescription drug commercials where the sufferers are strapped into a roller coaster or on a runaway elevator.  But, there's no place (outside of PBS) I'd rather be for a game.  

I need to by stock in whoever makes bipolar medication.