(10-01-2020, 07:39 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: well maybe he needs to stop playing conservative now.. take and make some bigger plays down the field.. in some ways he looks like a young Dalton with a better ability to run

Problem with taking shots down field is teams figure out early in the game they can play 2 high shells and still take away the Bengals running game that effectively limits big plays.

(10-01-2020, 07:58 PM)Synric Wrote: Problem with taking shots down field is teams figure out early in the game they can play 2 high shells and still take away the Bengals running game that effectively limits big plays.

take some chances.. that is the one area where he needs improvement.. take a bit more risk for reward with a struggling offense and actually connect on throws when players are open... 

(10-01-2020, 08:43 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: take some chances.. that is the one area where he needs improvement.. take a bit more risk for reward with a struggling offense and actually connect on throws when players are open... 

He has taken some chances. Just hasn’t connected yet (other than the Uzo TD).

(10-01-2020, 07:55 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: Chicken or the egg argument realm now. If he had more time to pass, due to better blocking, would he be able to make those further down the field throws?

I understand our lack of protection had hurt but  he has struggled  with time making those throws , I like to see more downfield plays called and better sync on sideline throws. 

(10-01-2020, 11:42 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: I understand our lack of protection had hurt but  he has struggled  with time making those throws , I like to see more downfield plays called and better sync on sideline throws. 

The deeper stuff will come with time. The bigger concern with a rookie QB is squeezing throws into the much tighter windows at the NFL level, and Burrow has done that in spades far.

Well let's make this happen if we can.

https://www.nfl.com/voting/rookies/

bump.

Hopefully everyone is voting.

(10-01-2020, 02:49 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: If the Bengals don't win a game or two, can't picture Burrow being given the award.
Murray won 5 games with Arizona, if the Bengals have 1 win on the year I think a lot of the voters will look at the yardage numbers as garbage time yards and padding stats, cause I really doubt they are sitting down to watch every snap of a Bengals game.

Umm so far he hasn't had any garbage time stats.  The games have all been close and every drive has mattered.  

He's show just how good he is under pressure band when the game is on the line.

That matters a lot and the media has noticed the discussed this.  It's not as if he's flying under the radar because he's on the bengals.  People are noticing him.

(10-02-2020, 01:43 PM)motoarch Wrote: Umm so far he hasn't had any garbage time stats.  The games have all been close and every drive has mattered.  

He's show just how good he is under pressure band when the game is on the line.

That matters a lot and the media has noticed the discussed this.  It's not as if he's flying under the radar because he's on the bengals.  People are noticing him.

I am aware that so far he doesn't have any...

My statement was that if the Bengals are 0-16 or 1-15 that a lot of the voters are going to stop watching this team (as will a lot of fans) and they will simply start thinking some of the stats are garbage time stats, rather they are or aren't.

Wrong or right, in the NFL, they tend to not give awards to guys on failing teams/franchises... look at Ken Anderson and Ken Riley and Willie Anderson for plenty of proof that being on losing teams will exclude you from deserved individual awards.

Can we make it to the bye week before we start taking about Roy and how many all pros he's gonna have. Dude needs to complete a 5+ yard pass first.

Sent from my BV9600 using Tapatalk

(10-03-2020, 12:07 AM)Murdock2420 Wrote: I am aware that so far he doesn't have any...

My statement was that if the Bengals are 0-16 or 1-15 that a lot of the voters are going to stop watching this team (as will a lot of fans) and they will simply start thinking some of the stats are garbage time stats, rather they are or aren't.

Wrong or right, in the NFL, they tend to not give awards to guys on failing teams/franchises... look at Ken Anderson and Ken Riley and Willie Anderson for plenty of proof that being on losing teams will exclude you from deserved individual awards.

In the last ten years there have been 5 roy winners from lossing teams.

That's a 50/50 split.  So really nothings off the table.

(10-03-2020, 02:07 PM)motoarch Wrote: In the last ten years there have been 5 roy winners from lossing teams.

That's a 50/50 split.  So really nothings off the table.

Losing teams that are 5 and 11 or 7 and 9 are much different then this team which really has the potential to end the season with 1 or 2 wins. 

1 or 2 wins is a huge difference versus a 5 win team or 7 win team.


Last 10:
Murray 5-10-1
Barkley 5-10
Kamara 11-5
Prescott 13-3
Gurley 7-9
Beckham Jr 6-10
Lacy 8-7-1
Griffin III 10-6
Newton 6-10
Bradford 7-9

No one on a two win team has won this award in the last 20 years.

Closest I saw a 4 win Arizona team with Boldin in 2003.

So 4 wins is the mark you have to look at for wins, do you see 4 wins for this team?

(10-03-2020, 02:56 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Losing teams that are 5 and 11 or 7 and 9 are much different then this team which really has the potential to end the season with 1 or 2 wins. 

1 or 2 wins is a huge difference versus a 5 win team or 7 win team.


Last 10:
Murray 5-10-1
Barkley 5-10
Kamara 11-5
Prescott 13-3
Gurley 7-9
Beckham Jr 6-10
Lacy 8-7-1
Griffin III 10-6
Newton 6-10
Bradford 7-9

No one on a two win team has won this award in the last 20 years.

Closest I saw a 4 win Arizona team with Boldin in 2003.

So 4 wins is the mark you have to look at for wins, do you see 4 wins for this team?

Win lose record doesnt matter in the Rookie of the Year awards its individual play and if Burrow keeps setting records he will win. 

This week its 16 receptions and 40 targets to set the most by a rookie through 4 games.

(10-03-2020, 03:10 PM)Synric Wrote: Win lose record doesnt matter in the Rookie of the Year awards its individual play and if Burrow keeps setting records he will win. 

This week its 16 receptions and 40 targets to set the most by a rookie through 4 games.

Win/loss record always matters with the NFL, if not Riley, and Anderson among others would get legit HoF consideration.

But in the ORoY award discussion, Peyton Manning set all kinds of records for rookie passers as a rookie in 1998 and didn't win the award, only won...3 games.

Wins matter in the eyes of the NFL voters. I don't care what records he sets, if this team wins 2 games, he won't get the award.

(10-03-2020, 03:16 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Win/loss record always matters with the NFL, if not Riley, and Anderson among others would get legit HoF consideration.

But in the ORoY award discussion, Peyton Manning set all kinds of records for rookie passers as a rookie in 1998 and didn't win the award, only won...3 games.

Wins matter in the eyes of the NFL voters. I don't care what records he sets, if this team wins 2 games, he won't get the award.

Agree to disagree. Win lose record is a team achievement. OROY award is an individual play achievement. 

(10-03-2020, 03:21 PM)Synric Wrote: Agree to disagree. Win lose record is a team achievement. OROY award is an individual play achievement. 

Well consider this, 3 weeks into the season and he has been passed over 3 times already even with the "records he is setting."

Playing for a losing team, hurts.

(10-03-2020, 03:16 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Win/loss record always matters with the NFL, if not Riley, and Anderson among others would get legit HoF consideration.

But in the ORoY award discussion, Peyton Manning set all kinds of records for rookie passers as a rookie in 1998 and didn't win the award, only won...3 games.

Wins matter in the eyes of the NFL voters. I don't care what records he sets, if this team wins 2 games, he won't get the award.

Peyton also threw more INT’s (28!) than he did TD’s as a rookie. He also only completed 56% of his passes.

(10-03-2020, 03:41 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Peyton also threw more INT’s (28!) than he did TD’s as a rookie. He also only completed 56% of his passes.

Cool.

He was also a more hyped up rookie then Burrow, and set all the records everyone expected, but didn't win.

I get it, everyone around here believes he is the football messiah, but he can't change a franchise alone... 3 weeks in and same as it ever was...

If you look at the ORoY winners of the past, they are either from winning teams or they came in and improved their team's win/loss record. 

Burrow isn't going to fix this team alone and unless this team and front office make drastic changes, they are going to waste his career like they wasted Palmer's.

Meanwhile, if the team is 0-14 or 1-13 the voters are going to look at a rookie making an impact on a winning team and hand him the award.

(10-03-2020, 03:46 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Cool.

He was also a more hyped up rookie then Burrow, and set all the records everyone expected, but didn't win.

I get it, everyone around here believes he is the football messiah, but he can't change a franchise alone... 3 weeks in and same as it ever was...

If you look at the ORoY winners of the past, they are either from winning teams or they came in and improved their team's win/loss record. 

Burrow isn't going to fix this team alone and unless this team and front office make drastic changes, they are going to waste his career like they wasted Palmer's.

Meanwhile, if the team is 0-14 or 1-13 the voters are going to look at a rookie making an impact on a winning team and hand him the award.

Baker Mayfield and the Browns had a better record than the Giants the year Barkley won it. Andy Dalton had a better record as a rookie than Cam and went to the playoffs... Stats matter.

Also... Peyton Manning was on the radar in college for longer than Burrow was, but he wasn't more hyped. There was even legitimate doubt that he'd be taken over Ryan Leaf by the time the draft rolled around. Everybody and their Mama knew Burrow was going number 1... From like November on.

(10-03-2020, 03:46 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Cool.

He was also a more hyped up rookie then Burrow, and set all the records everyone expected, but didn't win.

I get it, everyone around here believes he is the football messiah, but he can't change a franchise alone... 3 weeks in and same as it ever was...

If you look at the ORoY winners of the past, they are either from winning teams or they came in and improved their team's win/loss record. 

Burrow isn't going to fix this team alone and unless this team and front office make drastic changes, they are going to waste his career like they wasted Palmer's.

Meanwhile, if the team is 0-14 or 1-13 the voters are going to look at a rookie making an impact on a winning team and hand him the award.

The award is not for “changing a franchise” or whatever it’s for being the best rookie. If he keeps putting up the type of of numbers he has the last couple weeks he’s absolutely going to be one of the front runners.