(01-16-2021, 02:50 PM)PDub80 Wrote: Well, lot's of things are within the realm of possibility if we're just making things up with our imagination.

You're speculating on all of the above. The eye test shows that the Bengals wrs do not get separation deep. That's a fact. AJ Green got ZERO to no separation throughout the year on ANY route.

Higgins can, but isn't a burner. Boyd is a possession guy and not running away from anyone. Tate is a possession guy. Ross is a bum. AJ Green is done.

There is no threat deep.

I guess. But the ‘eye test’ certainly doesn’t tell the whole story and is most definitely open to interpretation.

Hey- WR’s win games. I wouldn’t be mad at all if they took Chase (do not go anywhere near smith unless it’s day two or later). I just don’t think it’s a need. But your speculation errr eye test is better than mine.

(01-16-2021, 03:45 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: Not 100%, I think the nightmare scenario for us is:

1.  Lawrence
2.  Chase/Devonta
3.  Chase/Devonta
4.  Sewell

While we may see some trade options, the teams know that the Bengals aren't taking a QB, which may make the pick less valuable.  

actually if that happens it really does not matter that we are not drafting QB, the three teams behind us might, so we could have many suitors to jump ahead to get "their" qb at 5. And still great players at #5 that we need.. Parsons LB and Surtain CB would be just fine picks at 5

(01-04-2021, 01:42 PM)TecmoBengals Wrote: Conversation has turned to a WR because the position is likely to be the best talent available at the fifth spot. Plus, people like the Burrow and Chase narrative because of the obvious connection.

If Sewell isn't available and the idea is to not take a WR, do they go with one of the defensive players at 5?

Then trade up to two get Sewell or trade back for added picks

(01-16-2021, 03:45 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: Not 100%, I think the nightmare scenario for us is:

1.  Lawrence
2.  Chase/Devonta
3.  Chase/Devonta
4.  Sewell

TEs can have injury problems, "hybrid" guys like Fant have a bad track record, TE isn't a "premium positon" ...blah blah blah. Teams who have guys like Kelce, Kittle, or Gronk don't GAF about any of that. Pitts has enough upside potential to warrant the pick. He can be a game changer at the next level. 

(01-04-2021, 01:31 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I see a lot of people talking about drafting a WR with our first round pick.  That does not make any sense to me.  We already have two very good WRs in Higgins and Boyd.  A new guy might provide some improvement but not near as muc as a new guy at a position where we suck.

We desperately need help on the O-line and D-line.  We have to address those positions before we can even consider getting another receiver.

What did fred do? Lol

(01-04-2021, 01:57 PM)ochocincos Wrote: It would give fans PTSD of John Ross and Billy Price, both of whom were taken probably about 10-20 picks earlier than they were projected.

It would give me ptsd if they reached for a tackle like they did with Fisher or Ogubeghi again...

(01-16-2021, 03:45 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: Not 100%, I think the nightmare scenario for us is:

1.  Lawrence
2.  Chase/Devonta
3.  Chase/Devonta
4.  Sewell

While we may see some trade options, the teams know that the Bengals aren't taking a QB, which may make the pick less valuable.  

I think...

1. Lawrence
2. Sewell
3. DeVonta
4 Chase

...is a more likely order if we're saying those are the first 4 players picked. Jets really need more protection if they are going to roll again with Darnold. Dolphins/Tua probably like the idea of reconnecting with DeVonta. I think it's less likely that the Falcons go WR, but they might. Julio/Chase/Ridley/Gage would be just about an unstoppable 4 WR set.

Either way, I would hate it if it worked out with both Sewell AND Chase are off the board at #5. Really could have done without thinking about it, actually. Lol... I guess trade down is the answer... 

Panthers at 8, Broncos at 9, and Cowboys at 10 all could possibly want to trade up for Fields. I could live with Pitts or Slater at 8-10 and an upgrade pick, but it wouldn't be quite the same as getting Sewell or Chase.

As far as NFL trade value goes, if the Bengals traded down from 5 to 10 with the Cowboys, they could expect to also grab a 2nd, but send their 5th rounder to the Cowboys in return. Works out as a small value win for the Bengals.  So it would be 5th and 133rd for 10th and 42nd. Depending on the number of comp picks in the 3rd and 4th round, the Bengals might need to send their 4th instead of their 5th. It's not a huge return.  (The 1st overall pick is valued at 3000, the 5th is all the way down to 1700, and the 10th at 1300.)

(01-17-2021, 12:29 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I think...

1. Lawrence
2. Sewell
3. DeVonta
4 Chase

...is a more likely order if we're saying those are the first 4 players picked. Jets really need more protection if they are going to roll again with Darnold. Dolphins/Tua probably like the idea of reconnecting with DeVonta. I think it's less likely that the Falcons go WR, but they might. Julio/Chase/Ridley/Gage would be just about an unstoppable 4 WR set.

Either way, I would hate it if it worked out with both Sewell AND Chase are off the board at #5. Really could have done without thinking about it, actually. Lol... I guess trade down is the answer... 

Panthers at 8, Broncos at 9, and Cowboys at 10 all could possibly want to trade up for Fields. I could live with Pitts or Slater at 8-10 and an upgrade pick, but it wouldn't be quite the same as getting Sewell or Chase.

As far as NFL trade value goes, if the Bengals traded down from 5 to 10 with the Cowboys, they could expect to also grab a 2nd, but send their 5th rounder to the Cowboys in return. Works out as a small value win for the Bengals.  So it would be 5th and 133rd for 10th and 42nd. Depending on the number of comp picks in the 3rd and 4th round, the Bengals might need to send their 4th instead of their 5th. It's not a huge return.  (The 1st overall pick is valued at 3000, the 5th is all the way down to 1700, and the 10th at 1300.)

Pitts it is then...

No more building backwards, build from the lines out. If Sewell is gone trade back and get the next best O-lineman, so probably Vera-Tucker. I'll believe we get good shrooms in FA when I see it.

Since the loser is still our HC, we'll probably be choosing in the top ten next year, so we can take an elite WR then.

(01-17-2021, 03:12 AM)Older Than You Too Wrote: No more building backwards, build from the lines out. If Sewell is gone trade back and get the next best O-lineman, so probably Vera-Tucker. I'll believe we get good shrooms in FA when I see it.

Since the loser is still our HC, we'll probably be choosing in the top ten next year, so we can take an elite WR then.

You thinking a ten year plan? Superbowl 2031

I don't know how this thread was rated at 1 star. This is a great discussion, I gave it 5 stars.

We're in a really tough spot. BPA could likely be WR. We already have 2 good-great ones. We aren't likely to be able to resign all 3 wide receivers if we add Chase. I would also add that our offensive line play had a greater limiting factor in hitting deep plays down the field than our wide receivers.

Our biggest need is oline and dline. The best way to improve the team may very well be trading back to around spot 10 and picking up an extra 2nd round pick. Around pick 10 the BPA will be an offensive lineman, edge player, or defensive player. In the second round, we would have amazing draft position to have the 5th pick, and another pick around pick 10 or so. I would argue that this kind of draft position would ensure that all three top picks are at positions of need, and will likely see second contracts if they live up to their draft position.

That said, it's hard to argue with taking the best player available. We would be stacked at WR if we drafted Chase. However, we would need to draft really well the rest of the way or need to spend a lot in FA to improve the weaknesses on the rest of the team. Chase or Smith (don't see Smith falling) is a luxory pick IMO. I wouldn't argue with the pick--it would be exciting. But keep in mind there is no way we can resign Burrow, Tee and Chase. At that point either Tee or Chase ends up being a wasted pick 4 years down the road a la Zeitler.

Sewell doesn't have a chance in falling IMO, but if he's there you draft him. We could stay put and draft the top edge player as well. If he pans out it would be a solid pick IMO.

(01-17-2021, 04:01 AM)BengalsFanRealist2855 Wrote: You thinking a ten year plan? Superbowl 2031

A ten year plan would be keeping Taylor and his flunkies, then drafting a bunch of offensive weapons and CBs that can't keep Burrow upright. You build from the lines out, regardless. That is how NFL teams are built, since time immemorial. The lines make everyone behind them better, on both sides.

People that want this or that weapon, without a foundation, don't seem to realize how talent can be wasted. You won't have to wait until 2031, if you focus on the lines. 

We're in, arguably, the toughest division in the AFC. And Mahomes, I guarantee, is the next Brady-esque dynasty. So we have to compete not only within our own division but with the Walrus and the Carpenter. That is an uphill battle for the next decade, regardless of our picks, FA and standing. The only way to mitigate that precipice is with solid lines and what some may call luck. 
 

(01-16-2021, 02:50 PM)PDub80 Wrote: Well, lot's of things are within the realm of possibility if we're just making things up with our imagination.

You're speculating on all of the above. The eye test shows that the Bengals wrs do not get separation deep. That's a fact. AJ Green got ZERO to no separation throughout the year on ANY route.

Higgins can, but isn't a burner. Boyd is a possession guy and not running away from anyone. Tate is a possession guy. Ross is a bum. AJ Green is done.

There is no threat deep.

If we are looking for proven deep threats we should look.FA, there are a few on market that are true proven deep threats .

(01-17-2021, 03:12 AM)Older Than You Too Wrote: No more building backwards, build from the lines out. If Sewell is gone trade back and get the next best O-lineman, so probably Vera-Tucker. I'll believe we get good shrooms in FA when I see it.

Since the loser is still our HC, we'll probably be choosing in the top ten next year, so we can take an elite WR then.

The longer I think about it, the more I buy into the idea of the Bengals trading back if Sewell is gone at #5.  Just yesterday, one of the draft simulator had WFT offering the Bengals #'s 19,51,84 and their 2022 2nd round pick for #5.

Sure, the draft simulator might be a bit far fetched, but if the Bengals could pick up 2 more selections in the 1st 100 picks for moving back to the middle of the 1st round, it would make perfect sense.  There are too many holes to think that one draft class at their current position and free agency could effectively fill them all.

For as many times as the Bengals have struck out with their 1st round picks in recent years, they have absolutely nailed it in the 2nd round.  Of current homegrown talent on the roster;  Bates, Boyd, Mixon, Higgins..  all 2nd round picks.

(01-17-2021, 03:12 AM)Older Than You Too Wrote: No more building backwards, build from the lines out. If Sewell is gone trade back and get the next best O-lineman, so probably Vera-Tucker. I'll believe we get good shrooms in FA when I see it.

Since the loser is still our HC, we'll probably be choosing in the top ten next year, so we can take an elite WR then.

Not a big fan of Vera-Tucker when I watched him play. Walker Little seems like the guy if we draft down. His comparable is Andrew Whitworth. Since we have had a below average line for so long I think we feel we need to get HOF guys in here. A slightly above average line would do wonders for our team.

You can't just pick offensive lineman and think everything is solved. Coaching and developing is crucial. Look what Green Bay trotted out there yesterday on their offensive line.

Elgton Jenkins 2nd rounder
Billy Turner 3rd rounder
Rick Wagner 5th rounder
Corey Linsley 5th rounder
Lucas Patrick (he subbed) undrafted FA

(01-17-2021, 10:53 AM)Goalpost Wrote: You can't just pick offensive lineman and think everything is solved.  Coaching and developing is crucial.  Look what Green Bay trotted out there yesterday on their offensive line.

Elgton Jenkins 2nd rounder
Billy Turner 3rd rounder
Rick Wagner 5th rounder
Corey Linsley 5th rounder
Lucas Patrick (he subbed) undrafted FA

I did see that. It helped that Aaron Donald was injured but that line performed well. Just look at Josh Allen and Baker Mayfield's play from 1 year to the next when they got a better line. It turned an average qb like Baker into an above average QB.
GB line did pretty well but Aaron Rodgers is excellent at moving just a little bit here and there to stay out of trouble. He also has a quick release and very effective in throwing on the run. All of these are traits that our QB Joe Burrow has. I agree with you though. Rather than mortgaging the farm to get the best lineman lest make sure of the Off Line coach knows what he is doing.

(01-17-2021, 01:01 AM)Tony Wrote: Pitts it is then...

Yup.  No nightmare there.  No matter what happens the Bengals will get an incredibly talented guy at #5.

I will say that this is one of those rare instances where I feel it would be nice for the draft to be prior to the start of FA, as having Sewell available at 5 could make a big impact.  I would hate for us to go use a ton of cap space on a veteran tackle, only to land the best prospect in years who will need to see the field in order to develop.  I guess that would mean Jonah becomes the first tackle off the bench, and he needs playing time to develop as well.

(01-17-2021, 12:17 PM)jfkbengals Wrote: Yup.  No nightmare there.  No matter what happens the Bengals will get an incredibly talented guy at #5.

I will say that this is one of those rare instances where I feel it would be nice for the draft to be prior to the start of FA, as having Sewell available at 5 could make a big impact.  I would hate for us to go use a ton of cap space on a veteran tackle, only to land the best prospect in years who will need to see the field in order to develop.  I guess that would mean Jonah becomes the first tackle off the bench, and he needs playing time to develop as well.

I think Pitts would be an amazing pick.

In a league where TEs are underutilized, Pitts enters the league already a top 10 TE. And he can line up in different spots on the field. He’s a special player a lot of people here would get upset with.

(01-16-2021, 03:45 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: Not 100%, I think the nightmare scenario for us is:

1.  Lawrence
2.  Chase/Devonta
3.  Chase/Devonta
4.  Sewell

While we may see some trade options, the teams know that the Bengals aren't taking a QB, which may make the pick less valuable.  

That would be the worst case scenario.

The good news is that this would be GM malpractice on the parts of the Jets' and the Falcons' parts.

If you have a top 5 pick and need a QB, you take a QB. It's that simple. I hope they agree.