(03-15-2021, 12:18 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Again, how do you know that? He did not play a snap?????????????????

BTW... agreat CBI gets paid a lot more, there are different levels of pay for a CB1 after their rookie contract.

I was basing it off of his previous play in MIN. Maybe he plays better in CIN, or maybe he plays worse.

(03-15-2021, 12:18 PM)jj22 Wrote: Dre was cut after the Waynes signing Fred. The fake news while works if constantly repeated won't work with me.

You are correct.  I thought Dre was a free agent.

I forgot how big a fan of Dre you were while he was here.

(03-15-2021, 12:38 PM)fredtoast Wrote: So if we sign Thuney your are going to cry and whine about that also?

You really have all the bases covered here, don't you/

Doesn't sound like this will even be an issue. 

(03-15-2021, 12:40 PM)fredtoast Wrote: You are correct.  I thought Dre was a free agent.

I forgot how big a fan of Dre you were while he was here.

No you forgot the facts in your failed attempt to come for me.

"you are correct" was all that needed to be said, and all that I am taking out of this thread debate from you.

(03-15-2021, 11:42 AM)jj22 Wrote: Exactly. We could have re-signed Dennard who fit our system and slot corner wasn't on anyone's radar because he could have easily been had and was by ATL late in the FA period for nearly vet minimum.

Billings had a career year. NT wasn't on anyone's radar as even if you didn't think Billings had a career year, Tupou had a career year too (we didn't know about covid and the opt out then).

Kirk was cut. We weren't losing him, and he outplayed Waynes in a big year in Arizona.

No one mentioned Green who wasn't worth 18 million and many were against the tag. But glad you are now thinking he was, and need to count him in our FA signings.

You got to come better.

All you are doing is proving my point.

So Spain we signed to replace Redman upgrade... Reader is a all pro type noseguard upgrade.. Bell took over at safety upgrade and Bynes took over at LB upgrade... you can debate who they let go and who they signed that you felt would have been better not signing but to act like the Bengals did not attempt to improve the team last year in FA from their standard point is just factually wrong..   We can do that this year.. they might not sign Jackson or Lawson but they might sign a FA that they feel gives them more flexibility with the team.. that does not mean we should have resigned Jackson or Lawson...

(03-15-2021, 12:42 PM)jj22 Wrote: No you forgot the facts in your failed attempt to come for me.

"you are correct" was all that needed to be said, and all that I am taking out of this thread debate from you.

You are the one insisting that he did not need to be replaced.

You are not denying that are you?

(03-15-2021, 12:45 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: So Spain we signed to replace Redman upgrade... Reader is a all pro type noseguard upgrade.. Bell took over at safety upgrade and Bynes took over at LB upgrade... you can debate who they let go and who they signed that you felt would have been better not signing but to act like the Bengals did not attempt to improve the team last year in FA from their standard point is just factually wrong..   We can do that this year.. they might not sign Jackson or Lawson but they might sign a FA that they feel gives them more flexibility with the team.. that does not mean we should have resigned Jackson or Lawson...

Spain was mid season signing. Again, Billings and Tupou were coming off of career years at NT (not a need). Bell everyone def thought was a luxury signing until about an hour ago.. Bynes we all knew was a fall (way) back option after the top targets signed elsewhere...… 

No one is attempting the FA didn't try to improve the team last year, what was said and universally agreed upon until this thread was the signings outside of XSF and Bynes (who both came because of losing out on targets) weren't top needs and had adequate players at those positions (ie; luxury's). 

We can take this further by mentioning we cut a guard (Miller who was quickly scooped up) for roughly the same amount we paid XSF. So I'm being generous mentioning XSF.

Truth is, only Bynes was a needed FA. And that was after we were supposedly done with our annual 30+ free agent lb signing.

(03-15-2021, 12:49 PM)fredtoast Wrote: You are the one insisting that he did not need to be replaced.

You are not denying that are you?

If he was under contract. No. Not by an overpaid FA.

Again, signing a starting outside CB was on no ones radar last offseason. So it was a luxury signing. I'd give you guys the need to sign Alexander if you thought he was that much better than Dennard (it wasn't the belief at the time), but until this morning it was thought Phillips would/could replace Dre.

(03-15-2021, 11:26 AM)pally Wrote: Zeitler was never coming back to the Bengals except in the brains of over hopeful fans. The Pats franchised Thuney last year, of course they still want him if they can mutually make the numbers work.

And, while you think that last year's big signees were "luxury" The reality is that each of them were projected starters from the day they were signed. Starters aren't luxury signees.

Mike Brown is that you ?

(03-15-2021, 11:59 AM)jj22 Wrote: Ok so it was the "or something".

The thing about these "or somethings". We'd all take Denzel Ward and look where he landed. Or even the pro bowler Marshon Lattimore who this "or something" doesn't have as being much better than Dre.

I remember when you could just compare regular stats (tackles, sacks, INT, FF, TKFL) before people needed a reason to ignore the simple stats.

(03-15-2021, 12:02 PM)Au165 Wrote: Notice the line from Ward, the name is far-right but he is squarely in the center so about average to above average, same with lattimore. The lines are hard to see and if you hadn't seen this chart before you wouldn't notice it. Dre was bad, for instance, each time they played the Cardinals he was abused. In one game against locket, he gave up 9 receptions on 11 targets for 2 TD's and 70 yards.

The reason people ignore "simple stats" is because they don't tell you what is actually happening play-by-play during the game. The example I always use is that a pop pass on a jet sweep that goes for 90 yards and a TD counts as such to the QB who did absolutely nothing in that play to warrant any credit, so he should recieve none.

Four times he gave up a QB rating against of 116.7 or higher (including a 141.7 in the Seattle game you mentioned) and two other times he gave up a 92.+ (including the 2nd Seattle game). 

He gave up 2 tds with 3 ints and 3 pbu. He had 58 tackles (2nd highest of his career) with 9 stops and 11 missed tackles. 

Overall, he gave up a completion percentage of 65.9 and 637 yards (2nd highest of his career).

He also had 9 penalties accepted with 2 others that were declined.

Well, since Baltimore signed Zeitler it seems maybe Thuney was not that intrigued with them, right? I doubt they could afford both.

(03-15-2021, 11:50 AM)Synric Wrote: I seen the Cory Littleton decline coming... That Defensive Line of the Rams lead by Aaron Donald takes so much pressure off the linebackers.

The Bengals need to work on both lines. Football is won in the trenches.

“The bengals need to work on both lines. Football is won in the trenches”

This should be the theme of this off season so tired of hearing we need to add help else where.... We may, but until the inside is done I don’t wanna hear about the outside. Stack these lines... everything else will be a lot easier. Everything.

(03-15-2021, 01:06 PM)Sled21 Wrote: Well, since Baltimore signed Zeitler it seems maybe Thuney was not that intrigued with them, right? I doubt they could afford both.

With Zeitler being ~$7.3m, they would still have $20m in cap space. They could absolutely afford both if they wanted to.

(03-15-2021, 01:37 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: With Zeitler being ~$7.3m, they would still have $20m in cap space. They could absolutely afford both if they wanted to.

I dont think the Ravens have an edge defender under contract. After Zeilter I expect them to target someone like Carlos Dunlap.

(03-15-2021, 01:41 PM)Synric Wrote: I dont think the Ravens have an edge defender under contract. After Zeilter I expect them to target someone like Carlos Dunlap.

Oh man... Carlos Dunlap vs Bobby Hart with Joe Burrow's health on the line.

Reality can't be that cruel to is, right?

(03-15-2021, 12:52 PM)jj22 Wrote: Spain was mid season signing. Again, Billings and Tupou were coming off of career years at NT (not a need). Bell everyone def thought was a luxury signing until about an hour ago.. Bynes we all knew was a fall (way) back option after the top targets signed elsewhere...… 

No one is attempting the FA didn't try to improve the team last year, what was said and universally agreed upon until this thread was the signings outside of XSF and Bynes (who both came because of losing out on targets) weren't top needs and had adequate players at those positions (ie; luxury's). 

We can take this further by mentioning we cut a guard (Miller who was quickly scooped up) for roughly the same amount we paid XSF. So I'm being generous mentioning XSF.

Truth is, only Bynes was a needed FA. And that was after we were supposedly done with our annual 30+ free agent lb signing.

stand corrected it was XSF we signed... if you are going to compare Billings or Tupou to Reader that just ends any logical discussion with you on FA from last year

(03-15-2021, 01:55 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: stand corrected it was XSF we signed... if you are going to compare Billings or Tupou to Reader that just ends any logical discussion with you on FA from last year

Not sure why? The spectrum of great to good NT's isn't that long/wide. This isn't the 80's. NT's aren't even playing more than 50% of snaps now a days. 

All the more reason to have a logic discussion as there clearly is a need to remind people holding onto outdated positions that are no longer what they used to be when in this new age passing league. 


Just like a great 2 down run stuffing thumping LB, isn't that big of difference from an impact standpoint as a good 2 down run stuffing thumping lb. It's 2021.

(03-15-2021, 02:21 PM)jj22 Wrote: NT's aren't even playing more than 50% of snaps now a days. 

All the more reason to have a logic discussion as there clearly is a need to remind people holding onto outdated positions no longer what the used to be and this new age passing league. 

This just shows how clueless you really are.

Reader played  79% of the snaps in the games before he got injured last year.

Zeitler gone!?! On to Thuney! Make him an offer he can't refuse! We have the dough, I don't care what Hobslob says. Protecting the franchise should be job #1. Get 'er done F.O.!

(03-15-2021, 02:30 PM)fredtoast Wrote: This just shows how clueless you really are.

Reader played  79% of the snaps in the games before he got injured last year.

Reader had no choice with the injuries. But I said NT's (not naming Reader specifically) as in in general. Still swinging and missing Fred. Rough morning. 

In this passing league, a NT playing 79% of the D snaps isn't good.

Him playing that many snaps was likely a reason why he wasn't effective in his 5 games as his pay indicated he would be.