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+--- Thread: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? (/thread-24894.html)
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Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - Geno_Can_Dunk - 09-18-2020
The trade deadline this year is Oct 27, which is 2 days after we play the Browns again week 7. I predict we'll have won 1 or 2 games at that point.
Everybody knows we could've amassed draft capital last year, and it was to the ire of many on this board that we refused. While I wouldn't have minded trading players, I do understand the rationale against it - you don't build a winning culture by losing games.
But it's also my sense that the front office might have made some moves, but was talked about of it by the coaches. I'm not so sure they'll be as deferential to a coaching staff that, at that point, would've guided us to two lost seasons.
So my topic for discussion is, do you think we'll be more likely to trade somebody this year than last, and if so, who?
Please no dumb answers like trading Bobby Hart. No other team would trade for him.
Regardless of whether it's the right move, I still don't think AJ is going anywhere. He's still more valuable to us than whatever we could get for him at this point.
But that's not true of John Ross. We gain about 2.8M in cap space by trading him, which rolls over to next year. We aren't re-signing him anyway, that's obvious. We wouldn't get much, but some contender out there might give up a day 3 pick for the fastest guy in the league to back off some DBs.
And sometimes I just think Carlos Dunlap is miscast in our emerging 3-4. A play off contender like the Saints or Bills who need a pass rusher and run a 4-3 might pony up for him. Chops about 13 million off our 2021 payroll. Of course, it would depend on what's offered. I do NOT believe in trading a guy just for the sake of trading him, when it compromises our ability to win even in the short term. "Winning culture" is a real thing, it just has to be balanced against potential gains of a trade.
I think a Geno trade is unlikely though. 7.8M cap hit. Also, we got almost nothing behind him to get through the season with. With Dunlap you can put Kareem and Lawson in there, thus absorbing the loss, but with Geno gone every game will be like last night.
I wouldn't bring this up so early in the season, by the way, if we hadn't gotten pushed around last night by a not-great team. Let's face it, that wasn't really a 5 point loss. I think we stack a few wins after the bye week because we have some softer opponents, but our problems aren't entirely correctable in-season. If it was just that we need time to gel I'd have more optimism, but I really do think we just don't have great players (and bad coaching). Gonna be a long season again. 4-12, maybe 5-11, which puts us in the 3-8 range in the draft.
(Pretty sure I know how Wes Mantooth will answer this!)
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - Nicomo Cosca - 09-18-2020
I would trade pretty much anyone other than Burrow and Jonah right about now. But that’s coming off a demoralizing loss. Ask again in a few weeks when we have a better picture of where this team is.
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - leonardfan40 - 09-18-2020
They probably won’t trade for or away anyone. I know we aren’t going to the playoffs but I’d still be looking to trade for some o line help ASAP so we don’t destroy Burrow either physically or emotionally/mentally his first season.
As for trading away people. Anyone with value on the defense not signed through next year should be on the table. On offense I’d trade AJ but outside of him I’d like to keep everyone who’s worth a damn to give our rookie QB the best chance to develop this year.
That said they will stand pat
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - J24 - 09-18-2020
It depends what you would get for them. Would you trade Dunlap for a 5th RD pick or Geno for a 5th Rd pick?
I would look at guys like Jackson and Lawson as the only two valuable trade pieces we have that can fetch a 3rd or 4th. If you trade those two guys is it worth it.
There are 7 spots this year for the playoffs so 8-8 or 7-9 might get you in so why trade anyone halfway before the season starts.
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - bfine32 - 09-18-2020
I could see us trading AJ to a contender.
AJ was Andy's WR, much like Chad was Carson's.
Let's make Ja'Marr Chase Joe's
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - Synric - 09-18-2020
Let's see trade wise the best players would be Dunlap, Geno, AJ, Bates, and WJ3.
AJ would be the best considering the WR depth and the Bengals having to eat half the 18 mil salary. 4th round pick for AJ? I would probably take that...
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - Nicomo Cosca - 09-18-2020
(09-18-2020, 05:30 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I could see us trading AJ to a contender.
AJ was Andy's WR, much like Chad was Carson's.
Let's make Ja'Marr Chase Joe's
It would be really hard to not take Chase if we can. Even with how badly we need OL.
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - Nicomo Cosca - 09-18-2020
(09-18-2020, 05:30 PM)Synric Wrote: Let's see trade wise the best players would be Dunlap, Geno, AJ, Bates, and WJ3.
AJ would be the best considering the WR depth and the Bengals having to eat half the 18 mil salary. 4th round pick for AJ? I would probably take that...
If AJ doesn’t start looking exponentially better, we’d be lucky to get that.
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - Tony - 09-18-2020
(09-18-2020, 04:47 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: I would trade pretty much anyone other than Burrow and Jonah right about now. But that’s coming off a demoralizing loss. Ask again in a few weeks when we have a better picture of where this team is.
I am starting to like what Sample is doing. I wouldn't trade him unless it was a crazy good offer..
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - Nicomo Cosca - 09-18-2020
(09-18-2020, 05:40 PM)Tony Wrote: I am starting to like what Sample is doing. I wouldn't trade him unless it was a crazy good offer..
He’s looked decent, but he’s not even close to off limits, imo. Nobody is trading for him anyway though.
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - t3r3e3 - 09-18-2020
(09-18-2020, 05:30 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I could see us trading AJ to a contender.
AJ was Andy's WR, much like Chad was Carson's.
Let's make Ja'Marr Chase Joe's
I’d rather make Penei Sewell Joe’s other tackle.
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - Geno_Can_Dunk - 09-18-2020
(09-18-2020, 05:26 PM)J24 Wrote: It depends what you would get for them. Would you trade Dunlap for a 5th RD pick or Geno for a 5th Rd pick?
I would look at guys like Jackson and Lawson as the only two valuable trade pieces we have that can fetch a 3rd or 4th. If you trade those two guys is it worth it.
There are 7 spots this year for the playoffs so 8-8 or 7-9 might get you in so why trade anyone halfway before the season starts.
I definitely would not trade Dunlap or Geno for a 5. Would have to be much higher than that. In fact I think we might even get a 5 for Ross... that I would do in a heartbeat.
Good point about the expanded playoffs. Maybe they should push the trade deadline back because of that.
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - ochocincos - 09-18-2020
Depends what your definition of a lost season is.
Is a lost season not making the playoffs? Or is it getting to 6 wins, which would be a big improvement from last year?
I would say the former is not likely, but the latter may still be achievable.
We'll definitely know more by the trade deadline.
I am all for trading (at least) Green and/or Ross by trade deadline if things continue to look bleak.
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - pally - 09-18-2020
(09-18-2020, 04:36 PM)Geno_Can_Dunk Wrote: The trade deadline this year is Oct 27, which is 2 days after we play the Browns again week 7. I predict we'll have won 1 or 2 games at that point.
The trade deadline is Nov 3 (election day) which comes after the Titans game
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 - 09-18-2020
(09-18-2020, 05:35 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: It would be really hard to not take Chase if we can. Even with how badly we need OL.
Unless we break the bank and sign Pro-Bowl level OL players, then no. Take the kid from Oregon & move Jonah to RT/RG.
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 - 09-18-2020
I will say this, some of our FA/option/extension decisions are getting easier.
No way I am paying WJ3, Bates, Lawson, or Ross at this point. Long way to go, however.
Bynes & Price not looking great either.
There are some guys we could cut/waive & save a ton. Dunlap has a $13.5 mil cap hit next year but his dead cap # is $2.25 mil. Hart's cap hit is $6.9 mil but has a dead cap # of $1 mil.
Now, I am not saying we cut Dunlap, but Hart could save us $6 million.
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - Tony - 09-18-2020
(09-18-2020, 05:35 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: It would be really hard to not take Chase if we can. Even with how badly we need OL.
I wander how Joe would feel? Take an OL or his favorite target in college Chase? I will say this, Chase is an elite talent WR.. He has it all.. Maybe we could get a tackle and guard in FA...
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - Geno_Can_Dunk - 09-18-2020
(09-18-2020, 06:29 PM)pally Wrote: The trade deadline is Nov 3 (election day) which comes after the Titans game
Oh yes, now I see you're right. I guess I was looking at some incorrect information somewhere.
Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - JSR18 - 09-18-2020
Unfortunately, with the stand they took last year. This years "improved" roster, is vitually untouchable.
The Bengals are not in the business of making other teams better...
Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
RE: Will we refuse to trade veterans in a lost season again? - bengalfan74 - 09-18-2020
(09-18-2020, 05:30 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I could see us trading AJ to a contender.
AJ was Andy's WR, much like Chad was Carson's.
Let's make Ja'Marr Chase Joe's
Agree, I'd offer up AJ we hafta look down the road.