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+--- Thread: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision (/thread-28341.html)
Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - maclanta - 09-12-2021
First… I’m happy we got out of that game with a win, it will help this team mature.
Now for some thoughts about the 4th down call…
1. Metrics might approve, but it didn’t pass a simple sniff test given how well we had played to that point
2. The actual play call was not great…
3. Mixon is not a power up the middle runner… Perine might have been the better call
So my gut instinct is… I hated it
I can only hope that this will be a learning moment for our coach and quarterback. The coach should know better!
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RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - michaelsean - 09-12-2021
It was stupid. Even if they score anyway in that drive it’s likely to take four or more minutes. Analytics 0-1.
RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - Au165 - 09-12-2021
(09-12-2021, 08:50 PM)maclanta Wrote: First… I’m happy we got out of that game with a win, it will help this team mature.
Now for some thoughts about the 4th down call…
1. Metrics might approve, but it didn’t pass a simple sniff test given how well we had played to that point
2. The actual play call was not great…
3. Mixon is not a power up the middle runner… Perine might have been the better call
So my gut instinct is… I hated it
I can only hope that this will be a learning moment for our coach and quarterback. The coach should know better!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I didn’t like the call because it’s almost an automatic 3 if you don’t get it. Now that same call at the 40 I’m okay with. That said, Mixon slipped (as did a few others today on the turf) and he had a shot if he doesn’t I think.
RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - Sled21 - 09-12-2021
(09-12-2021, 08:50 PM)maclanta Wrote: First… I’m happy we got out of that game with a win, it will help this team mature.
Now for some thoughts about the 4th down call…
1. Metrics might approve, but it didn’t pass a simple sniff test given how well we had played to that point
2. The actual play call was not great…
3. Mixon is not a power up the middle runner… Perine might have been the better call
So my gut instinct is… I hated it
I can only hope that this will be a learning moment for our coach and quarterback. The coach should know better!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I didn't like it simply because of where we were on the field. But, it should be a high percentage play for Mixon to get 1 yard. And, it shows you trust your defense.
RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - QueenCity - 09-12-2021
Sometimes I think Zac Taylor thinks he playing Madden.... that would of been a great play on the video game.
RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - bfine32 - 09-12-2021
I liked it because Zac put faith in his players. It didn't work out this time, but I think the confidence in his players will pay dividends moving forward..
RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - KillerGoose - 09-12-2021
I liked the call but I’m also in favor of being much more aggressive on 4th and 1’s. They aren’t always going to work out but they work out enough to where your expected points are generally going to be in the positive even with the failures.
RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - bengalfan74 - 09-12-2021
Bad, bad decision. Totally swung the game against us.
RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - George Cantstandya - 09-12-2021
With the lead I thought it was a bad call. Punt and make them earn the points from a longer field. There are times to keep your foot on the gas pedal when things are clicking, but in this case it was a bad call.
RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - BengalsRocker - 09-12-2021
It makes me wonder a few things.
Burrow with no injury. Do they QB sneak it there?
There are higher percentage type runs.
WTH are we going for it on the 30yd line? Dumb.
If this team was 0-whatever later in the season. I get it.
Not 1st game with a lead with that field position.
Perhaps if desperation down 2 possession scores.
RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - bengaloo - 09-12-2021
Yeah for me it was about field position. It was a bad call because it puts them in scoring position instantly if you dont get it, which can lead to a momentum shift, and it did. The only thing we can hope is that Zac learned from it and doesnt try it again like that. Especially when he has one of the best punters in the NFL at his disposal. Just a dumb call a pop warner coach wouldt make.
Zac had some very questionable play calling today. He did some good things, but got worse as the game went on. He was bailed out by the players.
RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - GreenCornBengal - 09-12-2021
I remember when bilechick did something similar on his own 23 I think. Analytics can be a little too dumb sometimes lol.
RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - Joelist - 09-12-2021
If he wanted to go fir it the play should either have been a QB sneak or use Perine and run right up the gut - pure power.
Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - maclanta - 09-12-2021
(09-12-2021, 08:53 PM)Sled21 Wrote: I didn't like it simply because of where we were on the field. But, it should be a high percentage play for Mixon to get 1 yard. And, it shows you trust your defense.
I like Mixon, but also probably wouldn’t have given him a huge contract… it is a really tough position to justify big money in the nfl right now. I’m not really sure that 1 yard up the middle on a goal line stand is his strength. He bounces outside a little more than he runs straight down hill.
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RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - Bengalitis - 09-12-2021
(09-12-2021, 09:05 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Bad, bad decision. Totally swung the game against us.
Nah.. we were ahead by 2 scores... our D and O just flat out stopped doing their job after that. I liked his risky call, something that Marvin lacked for 15 yrs. We are playing to win, which is the right attitude. I'm sure we'll lose a few games by trying to win but I rather lose that way than by trying to protect a victory. The D couldnt get off the field and Zac started calling ineffective safe plays only until we finally were able to move the chains in that risky 4th quarter pass to our TE to move and kick the field goal.
RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - BengalsRocker - 09-12-2021
(09-12-2021, 09:08 PM)bengaloo Wrote: Yeah for me it was about field position. It was a bad call because it puts them in scoring position instantly if you dont get it, which can lead to a momentum shift, and it did. The only thing we can hope is that Zac learned from it and doesnt try it again like that. Especially when he has one of the best punters in the NFL at his disposal. Just a dumb call a pop warner coach wouldt make.
Zac had some very questionable play calling today. He did some good things, but got worse as the game went on. He was bailed out by the players.
It didn't affect the game or even the next play.
When they lined up like they were going to go for it on one of the drives(usually in hope to get the D offsides)they used a timeout and then punted.
Typically a team lets the clock run down and gets a delay of game which keeps them from burning a time-out and gives the punter more room from the penalty.
Of course Huber made a great punt anyway and the coverage team pinned it near the 5 yd line.
I'm just pointing out a basic coaching call missed but was negated by a player's good play regardless.
RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - bengalfan74 - 09-12-2021
(09-12-2021, 09:13 PM)Bengalitis Wrote: Nah.. we were ahead by 2 scores... our D and O just flat out stopped doing their job after that. I liked his risky call, something that Marvin lacked for 15 yrs. We are playing to win, which is the right attitude. I'm sure we'll lose a few games by trying to win but I rather lose that way than by trying to protect a victory. The D couldnt get off the field and Zac started calling ineffective safe plays only until we finally were able to move the chains in that risky 4th quarter pass to our TE to move and kick the field goal.
It reeks of desperation, why were we desperate there ?
RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - KillerGoose - 09-12-2021
(09-12-2021, 09:09 PM)GreenCornBengal Wrote: I remember when bilechick did something similar on his own 23 I think. Analytics can be a little too dumb sometimes lol.
Yeah, he was at his 28. The analytics aren’t ‘dumb’. Quite the opposite, these equations are usually created by very intelligent mathematical minds. They are guidelines that will generally give you a positive outcome in the long run. The numbers say to be very aggressive on fourth and 1 or less because you will convert them often enough to have a positive expected points outcome. All that means is that you will convert enough of those that end up leading to points for your team more than you fail them and it leads to points for the opposing team. In short, do this and you’ll score more points than they do. We saw that today in overtime. The last I checked, the numbers say to go for any 4th and 1 beyond your own 9 yard line. I wouldn’t personally do that, but I am very much in favor of being much more aggressive.
RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - Benton - 09-12-2021
Bengals fans 2016: "We can't win cause Marvin's got no ****s. He plays too safe! We won't win until we get a coach with the ****s to go for it on fourth down."
Bengals fans 2021: "OMG! Zac trusted his players TOO much. Should've played it safe. NEVER go for it on fourth when you've got the lead. What a joke!!!?2!!1!!"
Personally, dude trusted his players and went for the throat. We've needed that for a loooooong time.
We won the first game. We won a game against a decent team. We played ****s out. I love it. Good job Joe, Chase, ZT.
RE: Criticism… not hate on 4th down decision - BengalsRocker - 09-12-2021
(09-12-2021, 09:09 PM)GreenCornBengal Wrote: I remember when bilechick did something similar on his own 23 I think.Analytics can be a little too dumb sometimes lol.EGO
Pure on his part.