(02-25-2022, 11:47 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Sportrac says $49 million but I am seeing all sorts of numbers floated around.  I know we can create more space by cutting players under contract, but what is our starting spot.

If you have a different number please give the source.

(02-25-2022, 11:47 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Sportrac says $49 million but I am seeing all sorts of numbers floated around.  I know we can create more space by cutting players under contract, but what is our starting spot.

If you have a different number please give the source.

(02-25-2022, 12:30 PM)ochocincos Wrote: The reason this cap number has dropped SIGNIFICANTLY from the numbers that most people have been sharing is because of all the recent depth contracts that have been signed.
The active roster now sits at 46 players, which is about 10 greater than it was a week or so ago.

(02-25-2022, 01:59 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Which is interesting because it means that quite a few of those 46 players currently under contract will actually be removed from the cap hits when all is said and done.

Only the top 51 count, and they have all of FA and also 8 draft picks. Even if you over-conservatively estimate they only sign 5 FAs (both outside and inside) and only keep their top 5 draft picks, that's still 56 which means that's 5 players who will be kicking someone else off who will no longer count towards the cap the lowest of which right now is making $705k.

(02-25-2022, 05:56 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Correct.
Most of the players toward the bottom are going to potentially be replaced by draft picks or other FAs, so their cap is negated in a way.
That's why even though the cap only says $49 mill, a decent chunk will get replaced, which essentially means Bengals have more cap to work with.

Players that very likely won't make it that are listed:
Noah Spence ($895k)
Lamont Gaillard ($895k)
Jake Browning ($825k)
Keandre Jones ($825k)
Wyatt Hubert ($731k)
John Brannon ($705k)
Elijah Holyfield ($705k)
Pooka Williams ($705k)
Scotty Washington ($705k)
-----------------------------
$7.036 mill

You can also probably toss in Trayveon Williams ($965k), Isaiah Prince ($965k), and Thad Moss ($705k) to that list, getting the Bengals nearly an extra $10 mill in total.

(02-25-2022, 08:49 PM)fredtoast Wrote: But we are still under 51 players, so how much cheaper can we sign replacements? 

The $7.036 million savings you project will have to be used to sign other guys at almost the same price.

(02-25-2022, 09:00 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: If you were the one making the decisions, how would you handle things?  Would you be looking to improve any specific position group?  If yes, at the risk of what other position group?

(02-25-2022, 11:56 PM)fredtoast Wrote: We have two free agents on the O-line (Spain and Reif).  I would re-sign Spain.  I don't think he is that great, but I think we can get him at a decent price.  I would not re-sign Reif, but I would sign a RT at $10M+ for one year.  Hopkins is not horrible, but I feel he is overpaid.  I'd like to sign a young Center for $10-12 million and cut Hopkins $7 million.  Carman and Smith deserve a year to develop, but I would sign another vet like Miller/Su'a-Filo ($2-$3 million) for depth.

TE...Resign CJ if he is not too expensive ($7-$8 million)

D-line...I am a really big fan of Ogunjobi, but I don't think we will be able to afford him.  We are paying a ton of money to Reader, Hendrickson, and Hubbard.  We may have to cut back the spending a bit at DT.  The only problem is that Hill and Tupou played over 900 snaps.  That is the equivalent of another full-time player.  I am saying 2 guys at combined about $8 million.

Safety...I am also a huge fan of Bates, but he may be too pricey.  Just taking into account the players listed above I only have $15 million left and we still need a starting CB.  

At this point I believe we have to release Waynes.  That frees up another $10 million giving us $25.  

We are still 5 players short of 51 so that means at least $3.5-$4 million.  

We have to pay our high draft picks, but most rookies that make a roster displace a higher paid veteran, so they actually save money.  And picking at 31 makes a big difference.  Our first round pick will make about $3 million a year.  So I guess the net draft cost is $2-$3 million.  

Every team in the league sits on a little space in case they need to sign new players as injury replacements. Say $3 million.

That leaves $15 million for a starting safety and starting CB.  And CBs are not cheap.

This is where the accounting comes is.  All of the numbers I have listed above are "yearly average".  Since free agents get a lot of cash in their pockets from signings bonuses they don't mind taking small salaries their first season, especially the larger contracts.  If we sign 4 players to contracts of $7+ million (RT, TE, Saf, CB) we should easily be able to create $6-$8 million in cap space.  Not that much if you sign the RT to a one year deal like I suggest.

Don't count on any starters from the draft.  Take O-line if possible.  But picking at 31 it is often best to just go BPA and start developing starers for the future.  You can't always build your team through free agency.  You have to create a pipeline that has young players ready to be a starter when we need to replace one.   

(02-25-2022, 11:56 PM)fredtoast Wrote: We have two free agents on the O-line (Spain and Reif).  I would re-sign Spain.  I don't think he is that great, but I think we can get him at a decent price.  I would not re-sign Reif, but I would sign a RT at $10M+ for one year.  Hopkins is not horrible, but I feel he is overpaid.  I'd like to sign a young Center for $10-12 million and cut Hopkins $7 million.  Carman and Smith deserve a year to develop, but I would sign another vet like Miller/Su'a-Filo ($2-$3 million) for depth.

TE...Resign CJ if he is not too expensive ($7-$8 million)

D-line...I am a really big fan of Ogunjobi, but I don't think we will be able to afford him.  We are paying a ton of money to Reader, Hendrickson, and Hubbard.  We may have to cut back the spending a bit at DT.  The only problem is that Hill and Tupou played over 900 snaps.  That is the equivalent of another full-time player.  I am saying 2 guys at combined about $8 million.

Safety...I am also a huge fan of Bates, but he may be too pricey.  Just taking into account the players listed above I only have $15 million left and we still need a starting CB.  

At this point I believe we have to release Waynes.  That frees up another $10 million giving us $25.  

We are still 5 players short of 51 so that means at least $3.5-$4 million.  

We have to pay our high draft picks, but most rookies that make a roster displace a higher paid veteran, so they actually save money.  And picking at 31 makes a big difference.  Our first round pick will make about $3 million a year.  So I guess the net draft cost is $2-$3 million.  

Every team in the league sits on a little space in case they need to sign new players as injury replacements. Say $3 million.

That leaves $15 million for a starting safety and starting CB.  And CBs are not cheap.

This is where the accounting comes is.  All of the numbers I have listed above are "yearly average".  Since free agents get a lot of cash in their pockets from signings bonuses they don't mind taking small salaries their first season, especially the larger contracts.  If we sign 4 players to contracts of $7+ million (RT, TE, Saf, CB) we should easily be able to create $6-$8 million in cap space.  Not that much if you sign the RT to a one year deal like I suggest.

Don't count on any starters from the draft.  Take O-line if possible.  But picking at 31 it is often best to just go BPA and start developing starers for the future.  You can't always build your team through free agency.  You have to create a pipeline that has young players ready to be a starter when we need to replace one.   

(02-26-2022, 12:43 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I see the only thing you are missing is contract creativity to sign players to huge contracts while pushing the cap hit down the road. For example, you could ****

(02-26-2022, 12:43 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I see the only thing you are missing is contract creativity to sign players to huge contracts while pushing the cap hit down the road. 

(02-25-2022, 11:56 PM)fredtoast Wrote: This is where the accounting comes is.  All of the numbers I have listed above are "yearly average".  Since free agents get a lot of cash in their pockets from signings bonuses they don't mind taking small salaries their first season, especially the larger contracts.  If we sign 4 players to contracts of $7+ million (RT, TE, Saf, CB) we should easily be able to create $6-$8 million in cap space.  Not that much if you sign the RT to a one year deal like I suggest.

(02-26-2022, 04:46 PM)fredtoast Wrote: No, I mentioned it here.  



I would never want to be in a position like the Saints where you are moving $20+ million down the road because you will eventually have to make some cuts.

But we could easily create $5-$10 million in cap space if we sign 3 or 4 players to large multi-year contracts.

(02-26-2022, 04:56 PM)Bengalbug Wrote:  For people that think you can’t get creative with the cap, it’s just not true.

(02-26-2022, 04:56 PM)Bengalbug Wrote: Oh look the saints and packers restructured contracts to help with the cap hit this year. For people that think you can’t get creative with the cap, it’s just not true.