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+--- Thread: Jonathan Allen falling (/thread-10278.html)
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RE: Jonathan Allen falling - bengals67 - 03-13-2017
I like Vigil but come on- not in same league as Foster.
sign Barwin
get Richardson in trade for McCarron
draft Foster
best way for us to have a chance next year is load up on defense.
RE: Jonathan Allen falling - Whatever - 03-13-2017
(03-13-2017, 02:27 PM)Au165 Wrote: Sacks have nothing to do with coverage, and honestly mean very little for 4-3 linebackers, case in point Luke Kuechly had 2.5 sacks in college. The int thing you could argue means something, but it doesn't really reflect his coverage skills more so his catching skills as he dropped 2 ints in the national title game.
Foster is the better player than Vigil and the tape shows it. What I would say is the year in the system does help, but the skills of Foster would catch him up quickly. I do think though for a SAM Vigil would be above average athletic wise and a really solid player there. There in lies the rub as Vigil will be playing SAM and Foster is a MIKE from day 1 and MIKES play in nickle packages because they wear the green dot (except Rey who was so horrible they couldn't).
We've gone back and forth as a team as to who plays in nickel,and honestly, for us it's always the two best suited guys for the package. His rookie year, Lamur wasn't even a starter and came in as one of the nickel LB's. I don't think Will, Mike, or Sam really matters to Marvin and Company when it comes to the sub packages. Whoever has the radio helmet will call the plays, and it will probably stay with Burfict this year. Marvin typically trusts that duty to veterans, and assigning a rookie who will miss OTA's with injury with play calling duties over Burfict doesn't really make a lot of sense. Some believe Foster will be a WILL in a 4-3, anyways. He supposedly played at 225 this past year, which he could get away with at bama because of their stout DL, but he will have to bulk back up to 240 or so to be a 4-3 MLB and his film at that weight from his junior year shows a drop off in athletic ability at that size.
Foster is a better overall player than Vigil, no doubt, but a lot of that is tied to the fact that he's a much better athlete, especially at 225. However, you have to factor in that Marvin isn't big on playing rookies, and again, Foster won't have the benefit of OTA's. Pass rush does matter when we're talking about anickel package that is designed to stop the pass first, run second, and they will be asked to blitz at times. If we do take Foster, he will likely get some nickel time as a sub, but isn't likely to get the majority of the snaps there, especially early in the year.
RE: Jonathan Allen falling - Jpoore - 03-14-2017
(03-13-2017, 12:41 PM)Whatever Wrote: Dude, you can't really write-off Ross due to injuries when he will be ready to go for camp and champion Jake Butt, who had two torn ACL's and likely won't play at all next year.
(03-13-2017, 02:27 PM)Au165 Wrote: Sacks have nothing to do with coverage, and honestly mean very little for 4-3 linebackers, case in point Luke Kuechly had 2.5 sacks in college. The int thing you could argue means something, but it doesn't really reflect his coverage skills more so his catching skills as he dropped 2 ints in the national title game.
Foster is the better player than Vigil and the tape shows it. What I would say is the year in the system does help, but the skills of Foster would catch him up quickly. I do think though for a SAM Vigil would be above average athletic wise and a really solid player there. There in lies the rub as Vigil will be playing SAM and Foster is a MIKE from day 1 and MIKES play in nickle packages because they wear the green dot (except Rey who was so horrible they couldn't).
I was responding to the comment of getting after the qb. As for foster, one could easily argue he benifited greatly from the dline of bama. I peraonally would take mcmillan ad reddick at the minumum before foster. Dont see what the big deal with him is. His coverage skills were average at best.
RE: Jonathan Allen falling - SHRacerX - 03-17-2017
(03-06-2017, 09:46 PM)bfine32 Wrote: After the combine there is talk that he could fall out of the top 10. Not only did he have one of the poorer workouts, but medicals on his shoulders raised some fed flags.
If he is there are 9 would you take him and if so, where would you want him to start; as he is somewhat of a tweener.
He starts at RDE and stays right there....I think he could be awesome there and wouldn't need to get bigger, he could actually trim down. He put on weight for his kicks inside last year at Bama, but he was an outstanding DE the year before. I would hope he would fall right to us...he's on a very short list I would stay put at #9 for and not move down.
Then, we can have a Dline that looks like:
Dunlap, Geno, Hardison, Allen on passing downs. Like the sound of that a lot.