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+--- Thread: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep (/thread-18619.html)
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - fredtoast - 12-30-2018
I believe a lot of the criticism of Dalton's deep passes is that fans don't really notice how rare it is for even the best QBs in the league to complete a high percentage of deep passes. They watch every play of all of Dalton's games, but when it comes to other QBs all they see are the highlights of them completing bombs.
Dalton misses on a lot of deep passes but so do all the other QBs in the league.
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - bengalfan74 - 12-30-2018
(12-30-2018, 12:36 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Bengals value the O-line and take it very seriously. They use first round picks on the O-line on a regular basis and last year they traded for Glenn.
The problem is not how much they valua the line. the problem is in player evaluation.
The problem is they try and nickel and dime it. The Mike Brown way
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - fredtoast - 12-30-2018
(12-30-2018, 12:45 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: The problem is they try and nickel and dime it. The Mike Brown way
First round picks are not "nickles and dimes".
Trading for the 9th highest paid tackle in the league this year is not "nickle and dimes"
Look, there are plenty of reasons to criticize the Bengals, but claiming the Bengals don't value the offensive line is just silly.
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - bengalfan74 - 12-30-2018
(12-30-2018, 12:53 PM)fredtoast Wrote: First round picks are not "nickles and dimes".
Trading for the 9th highest paid tackle in the league this year is not "nickle and dimes"
Look, there are plenty of reasons to criticize the Bengals, but claiming the Bengals don't value the offensive line is just silly.
Name me some of the things you view as "acceptable" to criticize the Bengals about.
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - fredtoast - 12-30-2018
(12-30-2018, 12:56 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Name me some of the things you view as "acceptable" to criticize the Bengals about.
Failure to pursue any top quality free agents
The defensive coaching this year.
Lewis's record in playoff games and against the Steelers.
Failure of too many recent first round picks.
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - bfine32 - 12-30-2018
(12-30-2018, 12:56 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Name me some of the things you view as "acceptable" to criticize the Bengals about.
When we lose someone(s) during the season we never bring in a quality replacement.
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - Bengalitis - 12-30-2018
The great thing is that ROSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS (where are you?) will no longer be a rookie (with his extended rookie card this year) and he will be the GO TO receiver next season as all his supporters, coaches and non-supporters have given him all the time and nurturing and coaching (Huzmonzzadah) he needed. /end sarcasm
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - SunsetBengal - 12-30-2018
(12-30-2018, 01:23 PM)bfine32 Wrote: When we lose someone(s) during the season we never bring in a quality replacement.
That's kind of a tough one there, and kind of a problem league-wide. In the modern free agency era, it's tough to keep a bench full of starter quality backups, like the Niners and Cowboys did in their dynasty years. I mean, when your franchise QB goes down for the year, you can't just drive over to the new QB store and pick yourself out a new one.
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - rfaulk34 - 12-30-2018
(12-30-2018, 11:39 AM)Daddy-O Wrote: Quite possibly one of the worst counterpoints I've read on these boards. A WR very rarely runs a 4.5 second 40 in game conditions - he'd have to be totally uncovered. WR's are either bumped at the line or have to redirect their routes on go patterns. A 40-yard dash is just that, a straight line dash from one point to another. A pattern is never a straight point A to B. Just a silly counterpoint.
You should read more of the boards then.
Receivers are rarely bumped to any significant change of their route. The discussion is about deep passing. From the time a QB takes a snap, releases the ball and it travels 30-50 yards down field, even the most average WRs are there to attempt to catch it. OP stated that the Bengals simply don't have time to throw deep. Then he went on to say what i confirmed; it only takes 2-3 seconds to release a ball that far down field.
Where his post breaks down is when he starts talking about secondary or later receivers and it taking 6 seconds to release the ball. That has nothing to do with "not having time to throw deep". As i've stated, it only takes 2-3 seconds to do it. VERY few teams can block for 6 seconds for even a few times a game. If you watch the game today, every time the ball is snapped to Driskel, count one one thousand, two one thousand, three one thousand and then mark it down. That's how many opportunities the Bengals will have had to throw deep.
I'll just ignore your observation that my counterpoint was one of the worst you've read because your counterpoint to my counterpoint was worse than your perceived opinion of my counterpoint. I'll just go ahead and chalk it up to laziness or lack of comprehension.
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - bfine32 - 12-30-2018
(12-30-2018, 01:42 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: That's kind of a tough one there, and kind of a problem league-wide. In the modern free agency era, it's tough to keep a bench full of starter quality backups, like the Niners and Cowboys did in their dynasty years. I mean, when your franchise QB goes down for the year, you can't just drive over to the new QB store and pick yourself out a new one.
I'd go out on a limb and say there are better QBs sitting on the couch than Jeff Driskel:
Sam Bradford
Matt Moore
Ryan Mallett
Colin Kaepernick
There are better WRs out there cutting their grass this weekend than Cody Core:
Terrelle Pryor
Kenny Britt
Brandon Marshall
There are better LBs playing in their HS homecoming game than what we are trotting out there
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - bengalfan74 - 12-30-2018
(12-30-2018, 01:08 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Failure to pursue any top quality free agents
The defensive coaching this year.
Lewis's record in playoff games and against the Steelers.
Failure of too many recent first round picks.
Which is exactly what I'm talking about ! Hart is not even close to an answer at RT.
(12-30-2018, 01:23 PM)bfine32 Wrote: When we lose someone(s) during the season we never bring in a quality replacement.
Or when we have a very underperforming piece we leave it in place = Redmond.
(12-30-2018, 01:42 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: That's kind of a tough one there, and kind of a problem league-wide. In the modern free agency era, it's tough to keep a bench full of starter quality backups, like the Niners and Cowboys did in their dynasty years. I mean, when your franchise QB goes down for the year, you can't just drive over to the new QB store and pick yourself out a new one.
I get what you're saying and agree. But when you have Hopkins and Westerman sitting on the bench why do you leave Redmond and Hart starting ?
Why not put Hopkins in at center and move Price to Right G ? Try something !
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - McC - 12-30-2018
(12-30-2018, 01:54 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Which is exactly what I'm talking about ! Hart is not even close to an answer at RT.
Or when we have a very underperforming piece we leave it in place = Redmond.
I get what you're saying and agree. But when you have Hopkins and Westerman sitting on the bench why do you leave Redmond and Hart starting ?
Why not put Hopkins in at center and move Price to Right G ? Try something !
That goes against the Bengals MO. Instead of seeing the plan as bad, they will always see the plan as a good one and yammer on about how they just have to be better at executing the plan. This is their greatest flaw.
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - Socal Bengals fan - 12-30-2018
Ross is amazing. He has more drops than catches. And 7 tds. That’s skills when you get targeted 4 times a game.
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - McC - 12-30-2018
(12-30-2018, 02:00 PM)Socal Bengals fan Wrote: Ross is amazing. He has more drops than catches. And 7 tds. That’s skills when you get targeted 4 times a game.
You're gonna have to prove that.
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - bengalfan74 - 12-30-2018
(12-30-2018, 01:58 PM)McC Wrote: That goes against the Bengals MO. Instead of seeing the plan as bad, they will always see the plan as a good one and yammer on about how they just have to be better at executing the plan. This is their greatest flaw.
Bingo,
Big egos ! They refuse to admit failure. Most teams/coaches will cut the cord on something that isn't working in a hot damn hurry. But not us. We ride it out determined to be right.
"We have to do a better job"
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - muskiesfan - 12-30-2018
(12-30-2018, 01:23 PM)bfine32 Wrote: When we lose someone(s) during the season we never bring in a quality replacement.
This is an excellent point. Especially considering the Bengals save several million each year just for this. It's been written many times that the Bengals are near the top if not the top of the league in what they save for injury replacements. You would think they could sign decent replacements instead of former Bengals and practice squad players.
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - fredtoast - 12-30-2018
(12-30-2018, 02:10 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Bingo,
Big egos ! They refuse to admit failure. Most teams/coaches will cut the cord on something that isn't working in a hot damn hurry. But not us. We ride it out determined to be right.
"We have to do a better job"
Yes. This is why almost every head coach and GM retires voluntarily instead of being fired.
Uh, er, wait. . .
Nevermind.
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - bengalfan74 - 12-30-2018
(12-30-2018, 02:34 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Yes. This is why almost every head coach and GM retires voluntarily instead of being fired.
Uh, er, wait. . .
Nevermind.
This has absolutely nothing to do with what I'm talking about.
I'm talking about refusing to admit Redmond isn't getting it done. Hanging onto MJ way to long, Margus Hunt, Dennis Roland. Refusing to change a scheme that isn't working. And on and on.
Marvin's motto is we're doing it this way and that's final ! If these players can't get it done we'll get new players. He refuses to admit that possibly he needs to change.
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - fredtoast - 12-30-2018
(12-30-2018, 03:05 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Marvin's motto is we're doing it this way and that's final ! If these players can't get it done we'll get new players. He refuses to admit that possibly he needs to change.
Yeah, That is why Austin is still our DC.
Uh, er, wait. . . Nevermind
RE: Let’s Talk About Throwing Deep - rfaulk34 - 12-30-2018
(12-30-2018, 03:24 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Yeah, That is why Austin is still our DC.
Uh, er, wait. . . Nevermind
So, Marv is Austin?
Austin is Marv?