(11-18-2020, 12:18 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: I will say, floating a bunch of potential replacements, no matter how qualified or good of a coach we believe them to be, is almost a futile exercise if another hire doesn't occur first.

Before the team looks for a new coach (not saying they will) they need to look for a GM.  Until that happens, I'm afraid none of it really matters in terms of building a true contender.

We'd all be better off listing off GM candidates than HC candidates.  Bring in the right GM, and he'll hopefully build out the right staff.

(11-18-2020, 12:17 PM)RiverRat13 Wrote: Missed where I called him a genius. And I agree that he has more helium than maybe he should due to modernizing LSU's offense, a move that many other guys probably could have made.  But looking strictly at results, he does have two good seasons as a coordinator compared to zero for Zac (Carolina is 7th in DVOA offensively, the Bengals are 26th).  Especially looking at Zac's resume when hired.  Brady wouldn't be my first choice, but you have to be realistic in who the Bengals can attract.

(11-18-2020, 11:14 AM)PhilHos Wrote: While I'm fine letting the rest of the year play out before deciding on whether or not to give Zac one more year (anything less than 5 wins after last season's 2 guarantees a boot to the ass if I'm the owner), let's not forget that Marvin Lewis took over a 2-14 team and went 8-8 his first season. Dude also has a winning record as HC of the Bengals. I'm not saying I want him back, but in today's NFL it is more than possible for a new HC to come right in and turn things around within a season or 2. 

(11-18-2020, 12:18 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: I will say, floating a bunch of potential replacements, no matter how qualified or good of a coach we believe them to be, is almost a futile exercise if another hire doesn't occur first.

Before the team looks for a new coach (not saying they will) they need to look for a GM.  Until that happens, I'm afraid none of it really matters in terms of building a true contender.

We'd all be better off listing off GM candidates than HC candidates.  Bring in the right GM, and he'll hopefully build out the right staff.

(11-18-2020, 11:06 AM)RiverRat13 Wrote: I doubt they'd replace a young, inexperienced guy with another, but Joe Brady would be a name to throw out there.  Unlike Zac, he actually has a couple of years of results on the resume.

(11-18-2020, 12:22 PM)impactplaya Wrote: Each day that goes by and each loss that accumulates
The Zac Taylor  FanClub is running out of reasons to retain him

(11-18-2020, 12:53 PM)kalibengal Wrote: .THIS TEAM PLAYS 6 GAMES PER YR IN AFC NORTH. We need to adapt to what we are dealing with yr after yr  Pitt and Balt are smash mouth and always have been...Brownies are pretty close to that now too.....

(11-18-2020, 01:30 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: No offense, but there is no single thing I disagree more with this long outdated thinking.

People always say this, but this logic hasn't been true in forever.  People were still calling Pittsburgh a "smash mouth team" when they were near the top of the league in pass attempts under Arians.  They were throwing the ball more than almost every other team.  Ben was heaving the ball 500+ times a season.

Ben Roethlisburger is currently 7th in attempts this season.  The Steelers are 25th in rushing yards.  Pittsburgh hasn't been a smash mouth team in a long, long time.  Unless "smash mouth" has somehow morphed into just having a good defense.

The Ravens aren't a smash mouth team either.  They run a read-option for Christ sake.  They run a ton of shotgun, and employ a super modern QB.  This isn't smash-mouth football.  Again, unless smash mouth means having a good defense.

The Browns?  They run the ball well.  But also, not smash mouth either.  They employ one of the highest paid duo's of WR's in the enitre league.  They paid out the highest contract to a FA TE this season.  They have another 1st round TE they just drafted a couple of years ago.  They also drafted another one relatively high this year.  They employ a more than average mobile QB.  Their team is built with tons of weapons, not lets line it up and ram it down your throat smash mouth football.

And even if all the above wasn't true (it is), the idea that you have to build your team out to mirror your division peers is absolutely ridiculous.  You build the very best team you can, in the way you envision ultimate success.  You make, not only your division oppenents, but everyone else around the league.

We need to build the very best team we possibly can.  A team that cannot only beat Pittsburgh and Baltimore, but can also potentially beat teams like the Seahwaks, the Saints, the Chiefs, and the Bills.  I can't think of any other division, or team, that builds out their team with the thought process "this is NFC South football".

The AFC North isn't smash mouth and hasn't been in forever.  And even if it were (it's not), that doesn't mean we can't build out our team like any other successful team outside of the division.  The idea, that someone like the Chiefs or the Saints, couldn't compete in this division because they're not built for smash mouth football is the god damn dumbest thing I've ever heard.

tldr The term smash mouth football should've died around the turn of the century.

(11-18-2020, 11:44 AM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: Here's a list of names of potentional options.  Whether you think they would come here or not, or if you think they're a good fit, is up to you.

Eric Bienemy (KC OC)
Robert Saleh (SF DC)
Joe Brady (Car OC, former Burrow OC at LSU)
Brian Drabol (Bills OC)
Dan Quinn (Atl HC, former Sea DC)
Raheem Morris (Atl Int HC, former TB HC)
Byron Leftwhich (TB OC)
Arthur Smith (Ten OC)
Gary Kubiac (Min OC)
Matt Eberflus (Ind DC)
Wink Martindale (Bal DC)
Greg Roman (Bal OC)
Josh McDaniels (NE OC)

College Coaches who have been floated as making the jump to the NFL:  Matt Campbell, Dabo Swinney, Lincoln Riley, PJ Fleck, David Shaw

There's tons of options, this is just what I came up with in about 5 minutes.  There's plenty of more potential and worthy candidates.  Maybe they're silk, or a thong.  Maybe there's someone really cool I don't even know about.  What, I thought we were in the trust tree?

(11-18-2020, 11:10 AM)capitalist_pig Wrote: If there was a ton of talent on the roster I would get firing the guy, but that isn't the case.  The defensive line is second to last against the run in almost every metric, second to last in sacks and dead last in forced fumbles.  Your DB's get smoked in the red zone giving up the most passing TD's of any team.  To be honest I think your inability to stop the run is masking the deficiencies in your secondary but those same deficiencies are exposed in the red zone.

Offensively your offensive line is one of the worst in football talent wise.  The run blocking is abysmal and the pass blocking is suspect giving up the second most sacks on the season.

Zac Taylor's play calling sucked at the beginning of the year, but in the last few weeks I have found it to be way more creative tying together the run game and pass game very well using formations.  I thought the guy sucked to start the year looking very predictable but now, I think he has gotten it together and starting to put together an offense.

You have to have talent to succeed in the NFL, and right now you guys look to be 2 seasons away from fixing all of your problems.  But the good news is you have a franchise QB and an innovative offensive coach, which is 9/10ths of the puzzle in today's NFL.

Biggest mistake on the year in my opinion was not moving vets during the trade deadline to stack up draft picks and go younger.  AJ Green and Geno Atkins needed to be moved.

(11-18-2020, 09:29 AM)SuperBowlBound! Wrote: To start off I for one would give him 1 if not 2 more years.

I don't have a replacement for him but laugh at the people on the board who think the best solution is always to fire the coach.
Firing coach should be the last thing you want to do. It could dramatically change how your team is being built and set you back 2-3 more years.

Those that are clamoring to have Zak Taylor fired, what staff are you going to bring in to replace him with. Before you say someone you need to make sure that they would actually coach here.

Bill Cowher - Would not come out of retirement to coach the Bengals.
Tony Dungy - Would not come out of retirement to coach the Bengals.
Rex Ryan - Would not come out of retirement to coach the Bengals and we would not want him as a HC.

Lets see who you got.

(11-18-2020, 01:30 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: No offense, but there is no single thing I disagree more with this long outdated thinking.

People always say this, but this logic hasn't been true in forever.  People were still calling Pittsburgh a "smash mouth team" when they were near the top of the league in pass attempts under Arians.  They were throwing the ball more than almost every other team.  Ben was heaving the ball 500+ times a season.

Ben Roethlisburger is currently 7th in attempts this season.  The Steelers are 25th in rushing yards.  Pittsburgh hasn't been a smash mouth team in a long, long time.  Unless "smash mouth" has somehow morphed into just having a good defense.

The Ravens aren't a smash mouth team either.  They run a read-option for Christ sake.  They run a ton of shotgun, and employ a super modern QB.  This isn't smash-mouth football.  Again, unless smash mouth means having a good defense.

The Browns?  They run the ball well.  But also, not smash mouth either.  They employ one of the highest paid duo's of WR's in the enitre league.  They paid out the highest contract to a FA TE this season.  They have another 1st round TE they just drafted a couple of years ago.  They also drafted another one relatively high this year.  They employ a more than average mobile QB.  Their team is built with tons of weapons, not lets line it up and ram it down your throat smash mouth football.

And even if all the above wasn't true (it is), the idea that you have to build your team out to mirror your division peers is absolutely ridiculous.  You build the very best team you can, in the way you envision ultimate success.  You make, not only your division oppenents, but everyone else around the league.

We need to build the very best team we possibly can.  A team that cannot only beat Pittsburgh and Baltimore, but can also potentially beat teams like the Seahwaks, the Saints, the Chiefs, and the Bills.  I can't think of any other division, or team, that builds out their team with the thought process "this is NFC South football".

The AFC North isn't smash mouth and hasn't been in forever.  And even if it were (it's not), that doesn't mean we can't build out our team like any other successful team outside of the division.  The idea, that someone like the Chiefs or the Saints, couldn't compete in this division because they're not built for smash mouth football is the god damn dumbest thing I've ever heard.

tldr The term smash mouth football should've died around the turn of the century.

(11-18-2020, 01:18 PM)wildcatnku24 Wrote: Nope.  I'm easily still a proud member of said fanclub.  We're still seeing the Bengals do things we haven't seen them do (FA, signing folks constantly, let's call it roster management) and that all started with Zac walking in the door.  We're improving.  I like seeing progress.  W's and L's aren't the only way progress is measured.  Sure, it is the only way from a standings perspective, but I firmly believe the wins will come based on the eye test weekly.  

Perhaps a less futile exercise than most on this board would be naming said fanclub!  

(11-18-2020, 09:29 AM)SuperBowlBound! Wrote: To start off I for one would give him 1 if not 2 more years.

I don't have a replacement for him but laugh at the people on the board who think the best solution is always to fire the coach.
Firing coach should be the last thing you want to do. It could dramatically change how your team is being built and set you back 2-3 more years.

Those that are clamoring to have Zak Taylor fired, what staff are you going to bring in to replace him with. Before you say someone you need to make sure that they would actually coach here.

Bill Cowher - Would not come out of retirement to coach the Bengals.
Tony Dungy - Would not come out of retirement to coach the Bengals.
Rex Ryan - Would not come out of retirement to coach the Bengals and we would not want him as a HC.

Lets see who you got.

(11-18-2020, 04:52 PM)Destro Wrote: Coaches would also have to choose to come here. Regardless of who the players/talent are, they will be working for Mike Brown and the Bengals front office. For some people, those are cons and they may choose to go elsewhere, or stay where they are, instead of coming here.

(11-18-2020, 05:15 PM)Big Boss Wrote: Matt Campbell or Luke Fickell.