(05-09-2022, 11:10 AM)grampahol Wrote: As is often the case I could be wrong about this, but last year I seem to recall our offensive line kind of stank. Sinked, stanked or stunked? it's probably the tense part that gets me in trouble.. 

(05-09-2022, 10:34 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: They managed to do it in 2020, and they didn't have a single player reach 60 catches or 800 yards, yet still had the 7th scoring offense, won 11 games, and won a playoff game.

If you zero blitz all the time, you're going to be giving up huge plays all the time too. Lamar Jackson can always tuck it and let his 4.34 speed handle the rest if he sees the slightest gap, or he'll just quickly dump it to Mark Andrews who is going to almost certainly beat his guy 1-on-1 with no help in the vacated middle.

Now... do I think that their offense is a threat to win a SB? Probably not, but it can win some games in the regular season. Not many defenses are set up to defend against that type of offense anymore.

(05-09-2022, 10:34 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: They managed to do it in 2020, and they didn't have a single player reach 60 catches or 800 yards, yet still had the 7th scoring offense, won 11 games, and won a playoff game.

If you zero blitz all the time, you're going to be giving up huge plays all the time too. Lamar Jackson can always tuck it and let his 4.34 speed handle the rest if he sees the slightest gap, or he'll just quickly dump it to Mark Andrews who is going to almost certainly beat his guy 1-on-1 with no help in the vacated middle.

Now... do I think that their offense is a threat to win a SB? Probably not, but it can win some games in the regular season. Not many defenses are set up to defend against that type of offense anymore.

Quote:“The No. 1 reason teams miss early in the draft is when they go for the outlier,” an evaluator said. “They try to roll 11 in Vegas instead of seven. That is Baltimore in this draft.”

(05-09-2022, 10:41 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: The Ravens as a team threw for 2,919 yards in 2020 and they scored 29.3 points per game.

That's 2.2 points per game more than the 2021 Bengals with Chase/Higgins/Boyd/Mixon/Uzomah.

(05-09-2022, 10:47 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: I love this argument like it somehow matters. Who cares who is younger at this point? They are both 25. It really doesn't matter what age they came into the league - currently they are the same age. 

You can argue Burrow has accomplished more so far in his career, too. Sure Lamar has the MVP, but Burrow has the AFC Championship and SB appearance. 

(05-10-2022, 07:44 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: but they looked SO BAD on defense last year, even before the injuries, that I just think they won't return to their 2020 form on offense OR defense.

(05-10-2022, 08:18 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I don't think there was ever a "before the injuries" for the Ravens. Lol

After Week 1, they were down an All-Pro CB, starting LB, a starting DT, a semi-starting CB, a backup CB, a backup DT, and a backup LB.

- - - - - - -

That said, I agree with you they won't return quite to 2020 form. I was just saying that an offense without relying on passing has proven it can win regular season games in the modern NFL, and doesn't have to be a bad 20 point per game offense.

(05-08-2022, 09:26 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Never understood the huge discount of having a good center. He's the only guy who touches the ball more than the QB (because sometimes the QB doesn't take the snap, but the C always snaps it). Pressure up the middle is devastating because then there's no pocket to step up into, and being able to run up the middle is demoralizing to a defense because you're consistently converting those short yardage downs on the ground and just dragging out drives and tiring the defense out.

Packers had the 7th rushing YPC offense in 2020, lose Corey Linsley, and go to 20th rushing YPC in 2021.
Chargers add Corey Linsley and go from 30th rushing YPC in 2020 to 17th rushing YPC in 2021.

2017 with Travis Frederick the Cowboys were 3rd in rushing YPC.
2018 without Frederick they were 14th in rushing YPC.
2019 with Frederick they were 5th in rushing YPC.
2020 without Frederick they were 23rd in rushing YPC.

The Falcons added Alex Mack in 2016 and went to 5th in rushing YPC (and the SB, and an MVP for Matt Ryan) up from 25th rushing YPC in 2015.

Just don't get why some people discount the Center position. It's probably a big part of why the Bengals almost never have good rushing offenses. (Only 2 top-10 rushing YPC seasons out of the last 20 years, most of the time very low.)

(05-08-2022, 10:20 PM)Gdale_Bengal Wrote: Baltimore has like 2 guys to throw to. There will be a lot of drives that are all run plays. If abatement can’t stay healthy there won’t be a play action passing game for them.

They’re a good team but honestly I don’t know how they can force teams to honor there receivers and zero blitz Jackson all the time.

(05-11-2022, 08:12 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Who was the all-pro CB they lost week 1?  I honestly don't know?

And although the Ravens seem to get a pass nationally due to their injuries, the Bengals did lose their starting CB, DT, and RT but had been prepared with better depth behind them (except perhaps at RT).  They also lost Wilson for some time in the middle of the season.  

But I hear ya....they had a really bad start to the season health-wise.  

(05-11-2022, 08:42 AM)Sled21 Wrote: As long as we have Lou as DC and disciplined play like we get from Hubbard, they have shown they can shut down Lamar's running

(05-11-2022, 10:24 AM)fredtoast Wrote: His last 2 games against the Bengals he has 187 rushing yards on 23 carries.

(05-11-2022, 10:19 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Marcus Peters, never took a snap in 2021. 2x 1st Team All-Pro, 1x 2nd Team All-Pro, 3x Pro Bowler.

(They actually lost another 1st Team All-Pro CB later in the season, too, in Marlon Humphrey, plus their All-Pro LT, and their MVP QB, and a lot more. That's why they seem to get a pass due to injuries.)

(05-09-2022, 10:53 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: And this right here is why I'm not 100% sold on ZT as an offensive play caller/game planner/play designer. Our offense actually underperformed last year IMO. 

(05-11-2022, 04:27 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: Ahhh.  To be fair, Peters was a 64.4 on PFF in 2020 and had been trending downward.  But I get it.  They lost Humphrey in week 12, I believe.  

I know they have a lot more equity in the court of public opinion, but no one had trouble heaping shame on the Bengals in 2020 when they lost Burrow, Reader, Geno, Daniels, XSF, CJ, Waynes, and Hubbard.  

(05-09-2022, 10:51 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: He is career 65% completion percentage. That is more than enough accurate. I would love to see his completion percentage on pass more than 20 yards, though. 

Lamar gets in trouble when he isn't given the option to run. When teams take that away completely, that's when he gets into trouble. 

(05-08-2022, 08:23 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Baltimore
One exec joked that if the Ravens selected a punter in the first round, analysts would probably applaud Baltimore for smartly zigging when the rest of the league was zagging. Without question, the Ravens’ long-term success has earned them the benefit of the doubt. But there is growing doubt from some who have long held the Ravens in high regard.

“The No. 1 reason teams miss early in the draft is when they go for the outlier,” an evaluator said. “They try to roll 11 in Vegas instead of seven. That is Baltimore in this draft.”

There’s some fear the Ravens lowered their odds for success by using early picks for outlier players at less premium positions: 6-foot-4 safety Kyle Hamilton at 14, undersized center Tyler Linderbaum at 25, injured outside linebacker David Ojabo in the second round and, yes, a punter in the fourth, before anyone else drafted one.

“A lot depends on how you view Linderbaum, because it is beauty in the eye of the beholder with him,” an evaluator said. “There is not a great precedent of guys his size being great players in the league. He is very similar size-wise to Garrett Bradbury, who just got his fifth-year option declined. Kyle Hamilton checked every box except for the athletic component.”

If there were large numbers of 6-4 college safeties failing in the NFL year after year, we would know with greater certainty height was a limiting factor. But few safeties that tall exist at any level. Does that mean the hit rate is far lower for them?

“I’m more bullish on Baltimore, but I can see the skepticism,” an exec said. “While I like a lot of the players they picked, the positions they focused on were kind of weird: strong safety, center, nose tackle, punter, two tight ends. Kyle Hamilton fell and probably for a reason. He is a weird shape, tall and slow. Linderbaum was highly rated, but he’s a center. Ojabo, they got a quote-unquote value pick there, but he might not play. Travis Jones, he is a guy that the analytics loved. His measurables were very good. But his tape was not.”

Trading Hollywood Brown, drafting zero receivers and loading up on tight ends could signal Baltimore doubling down on its run-heavy offense rather than trying to unlock a conventional passing game by surrounding Lamar Jackson with upgraded traditional receiving weaponry.

“They just stick so heavily to their board that if someone is higher than a wide receiver, they are definitely going to take that other person, but they might be a little slow in adjusting to positional importance,” an exec said.

Cincinnati The Bengals picked the right year to be terrible (2020) and the right year to suddenly become a Super Bowl team (2021). That allowed them to pick in the top five when Ja’Marr Chase was available in the draft one year ago and at the other end of the round in this draft, where teams tended to see greater value.

“Even if (veteran safety) Jessie Bates signs the (franchise) tender, Daxton Hill is a good add,” an exec said. “You also notice they made two targeted trade-ups, for the corner (Cam Taylor-Britt) in the second round and the other safety (fifth-rounder Tycen Anderson). I see them going from being maybe the least aggressive team in acquiring players to maybe a little bit middle of the pack, targeting their guys and going and doing it.”

Execs who questioned the quality of the offensive linemen Cincinnati added in free agency noted that the Bengals waited until the fourth round before addressing the position with North Dakota State’s Cordell Volson, the last of four tackles taken in a 26-pick span.

“I like their first pick (Hill), and it makes sense they would target him given their defensive coordinator’s history coaching the secondary,” an exec said. “He could play safety, he could play corner, he could play them all and could be a good nickel for them. He is pretty talented. Taylor-Britt can really run and he is tough, he is physical, but he’s a bit of a tweener, and I’m not sure how that goes ultimately.”

(05-11-2022, 05:36 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Which is strange because according to PFR he allowed only a 78.0 QB Rating in his coverage and had 4 INT and 4 FF.

Because the Bengals in 2020 were coming off having the 1st overall pick and 2 wins. Then they had 4 wins and the 5th overall pick, and their 5th straight losing season. That deserves shaming.

Not to mention that even with all those injuries the Ravens still went 8-9 in 2021. Literally twice as many wins as the Bengals had in 2020, more wins than the Bengals had in 2019 and 2020 combined, and they hadn't sucked the year before. They went 11-5 and won a playoff game, so it doesn't look like you're making excuses for a bad season with injuries despite being a terrible team the year before too (sure it was our 5th straight losing season, but we had injuries this year!).

It's not the same situation, man. It's not some double standard, it's just very different situations.