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RE: PFF Grades heading into final week - Forever Spinning Vinyl - 01-05-2024

Things that I never thought that I would say about the 2023-24 Bengals

Dax Hill leads the defense in snaps
Tanner Hudson is the teams best run blocker
Germaine Pratt and Logan Wilson each have 53 pass rushes and have combined for 3 sacks on those 106 pass rushes
Even though both starting LBs would have down years, Markus Bailey will still only get 14 snaps on defense

The secondary snap total and rankings
1,036 Dax Hill - 90th out of 97
843 Mike Hilton - 19th out of 125
774 DJ Turner - 113th out of 125
722 Chidobe Awuzie 76th out of 125
620 Cam Taylor-Britt 69th out of 125
561 Nick Scott - 97th out of 97
481 Jordan Battle - 13th out of 97

One and a half starters ranked above average to fill five positions

Over half of the snaps were with the worst and 8th worst Safeties on the field

Jordan Battle had a few plays where he looked very young and foolish . . . and he still played well enough to be considered 13th best in the league.

RE: PFF Grades heading into final week - WeezyBengal - 01-05-2024

(01-05-2024, 03:21 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: I’d start by tagging and trading Tee. Then prioritize DT, RT, & WR.

I like this but only if they spend the money they were going to owe Tee (around 20 million) on a replacement level player on either DT or RT. 

The Bengals really need to start spending up to the cap again and getting crafty with their contracts. 

RE: PFF Grades heading into final week - Whatever - 01-05-2024

See guys, Cordell Volson doesn't suck. He's only rated a couple of points lower than Boyd. *Sarcasm*.

RE: PFF Grades heading into final week - 007BengalsFan - 01-05-2024

(01-04-2024, 09:00 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Thoughts:

In limited snaps Ivey scored well and looked well

Battle is our ROY

Pollard got OBJ coached up

No way Hendrickson should be 22nd

Ja'Marr is pretty good

Tanner Hudson has been a pleasant surprise

Hendrickson is great at pass rushing but it comes at the cost of run support.  He is horrible against the run, often times pushing way too far up field in an attempt to get to the QB.  He is little help against a run to his side.

RE: PFF Grades heading into final week - Bengalholic - 01-05-2024

I think with Jonah grading out even worse at RT than he did at left, it's pretty clear it's time to move on and try to find a better option.

One possibility is Mike Onwenu from the Patriots. He's 6'3-350, just turned 26 and has experience at RT, RG and LG. 

Year     Grade     Pass Block      Run Block     Sacks      Penalties     Tot Snaps    Snaps-RT
2023       71.6            66.2              74.1              2               4                  792             598           (also played LG and RG)
2022       79.3            83.1              73.1              1               2                1,044               0            (all snaps taken at RG)  
2021       87.0            69.8              89.8              2               3                   647            276            (also played at LG)
2020       84.3            72.5              84.9              3               1                   927            616            (also played LG and RG)

RE: PFF Grades heading into final week - 007BengalsFan - 01-05-2024

(01-04-2024, 11:00 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: They didn’t come close to getting their money’s worth out of the DL this season (outside of Trey). Or the LBers for that matter. There are larger issues with this defense than just merely the safeties.

Reader leads the defense in PFF grade (not counting Ivey's 21 snaps) but he did get injured again...  When Reader is in there, he is a force.  Im not sure what you do with him this offseason.  He is getting older and has suffered two season ending injuries with the Bengals so he isnt helping if he cant play.   I like having him on the team but I think it comes down to what kind of money he wants.  I dont see us re-signing him for anywhere near what he is making this year.

Hubbard has had a bit of a down year.  He has never been a great pass rusher and this year looks to be worse at run support.  10 million a year is a too much for what he brings to the table.  We are stuck with him at least through next season and maybe 2025.

BJ Hill is above average but he is not great at anything.  Is he worth 10 million per year?  He is the #22 highest paid tackle graded #41 at his position.  Next year will be the final year of his contract so we have him one more year.

The backups are all JAGs  Not the worst but still bottom half guys.  We certainly could use better depth.

RE: PFF Grades heading into final week - Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 - 01-06-2024

Other than Burrow, Chase, and Hendrickson, we could use help or upgrades everywhere.

The good news is that we have a ton of cap space. Of our 5 pitential big ticket FA's (Higgins, Reader, Jonah, Boyd, Chido) only Reader played like a guy who deserved a big salary, and he likely won't get one due to injury.

I'd try to keep Tee & Reader. I'd tag Tee if I have to but would listen to trades. If I can get Reader for reasonable, I do it in a heartbeat. I let Jonah walk and enter the draft thinking RT is our #1 priority.

I would not rule out bringing Boyd or Chido back. But depending on how much $$ we have left after Tee & Reader, it may be only one. We might want to play in FA instead.

Wilson & Pratt & Hubbard all had down years. Dax made a lot of mistakes. As did Turner. Scott & Irv Smith were awful.

Starters I feel good about: Burrow, Chase, Karras, Hendrickson, Hilton, Battle, McPherson, Adomitis.

Feel OK: Brown Jr., Cappa, BJ Hill, CTB.

Trenches is my #1 priority. Secondary #2. Generally willing to roll with Tee, Hubbard, and the LBs for 1 more year. Hope Dax & Turner make leaps & Ivey recovers.

RE: PFF Grades heading into final week - bengalfan74 - 01-06-2024

(01-05-2024, 02:50 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: I think with Jonah grading out even worse at RT than he did at left, it's pretty clear it's time to move on and try to find a better option.

One possibility is Mike Onwenu from the Patriots. He's 6'3-350, just turned 26 and has experience at RT, RG and LG. 

Year     Grade     Pass Block      Run Block     Sacks      Penalties     Tot Snaps    Snaps-RT
2023       71.6            66.2              74.1              2               4                  792             598           (also played LG and RG)
2022       79.3            83.1              73.1              1               2                1,044               0            (all snaps taken at RG)  
2021       87.0            69.8              89.8              2               3                   647            276            (also played at LG)
2020       84.3            72.5              84.9              3               1                   927            616            (also played LG and RG)

Yup

I believe there's a half a dozen positions we need a serious upgrade on. RT and LG are among them for sure. Volson had a 3 or 4 game stretch there where he was playing decent. But overall as the PFF grades help illustrate he just isn't starter level NFL Oline material. We have to protect JB, that's where it starts.

The defense also needs some serious upgrading, no doubt.

RE: PFF Grades heading into final week - puddycat - 01-06-2024

Dax Hill and DJ Turner have no business being named starters entering training camp next year(along with the entire OLine.)
Mixon's pass blocking is pathetic for a 220 lb. RB with 7 years in the league.
DJ Reader and Awuzie both make good cases for coming back next year.
James Casey, the Bengals tight end coach, who started the season with Irv Smith as the starter and Tanner Hudson on the practice squad, needs to have his eyes examined.
The Oline seems to get less out of that unit than they should.

RE: PFF Grades heading into final week - TheLeonardLeap - 01-06-2024

(01-05-2024, 03:25 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: Reader leads the defense in PFF grade (not counting Ivey's 21 snaps) but he did get injured again...  When Reader is in there, he is a force.  Im not sure what you do with him this offseason.

Gotta move on from Reader sadly. He's been on the IR 3 times in 4 years with the Bengals. A good player is only good for you if he is on the field and you just can't rely on Reader.

RE: PFF Grades heading into final week - casear2727 - 01-06-2024

(01-06-2024, 07:54 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Gotta move on from Reader sadly. He's been on the IR 3 times in 4 years with the Bengals. A good player is only good for you if he is on the field and you just can't rely on Reader.

Also, his current injury is not an easy one with a player his size.  Good chance he is not ready before the season starts.

RE: PFF Grades heading into final week - casear2727 - 01-06-2024

(01-05-2024, 02:41 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: Hendrickson is great at pass rushing but it comes at the cost of run support.  He is horrible against the run, often times pushing way too far up field in an attempt to get to the QB.  He is little help against a run to his side.

(01-05-2024, 03:25 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: Reader leads the defense in PFF grade (not counting Ivey's 21 snaps) but he did get injured again...  When Reader is in there, he is a force.  Im not sure what you do with him this offseason.  He is getting older and has suffered two season ending injuries with the Bengals so he isnt helping if he cant play.   I like having him on the team but I think it comes down to what kind of money he wants.  I dont see us re-signing him for anywhere near what he is making this year.

Hubbard has had a bit of a down year.  He has never been a great pass rusher and this year looks to be worse at run support.  10 million a year is a too much for what he brings to the table.  We are stuck with him at least through next season and maybe 2025.

BJ Hill is above average but he is not great at anything.  Is he worth 10 million per year?  He is the #22 highest paid tackle graded #41 at his position.  Next year will be the final year of his contract so we have him one more year.

The backups are all JAGs  Not the worst but still bottom half guys.  We certainly could use better depth.



Agree on all of this, however Hubbard has apparently played many games injured, not that he has ever been a sack threat.

RE: PFF Grades heading into final week - Nicomo Cosca - 02-05-2024


I also saw PFF named him as our most improved player. If he can improve his tackling he could become one of the best CB’s in the league.

RE: PFF Grades heading into final week - Soonerpeace - 02-05-2024

Tops on offense
1. Chase 86.0
2. Burrow 77.9
3. Browning 75.2
4. Hudson 74.8
5. Higgins 72.1
6. Mixon / Chase Brown 68. 7

RE: PFF Grades heading into final week - Frank Booth - 02-05-2024

(02-05-2024, 10:37 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Tops on offense
1. Chase 86.0
2.  Burrow 77.9
3. Browning 75.2
4. Hudson 74.8
5. Higgins 72.1
6. Mixon / Chase Brown 68. 7

not one offensive lineman...

RE: PFF Grades heading into final week - Soonerpeace - 02-05-2024

(02-05-2024, 10:43 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: not one offensive lineman...

Karras was next I think. But with the 31st run game and it seems if my memory was right the entire OL was #28 not a shock. Amazing how much life would be easier for Zac as a play caller and Joe as the QB if our line hadn’t been dog ____ forever.