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+--- Thread: Rank our RBs (2024) (/thread-38503.html)
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - Essex Johnson - 06-16-2024
(06-15-2024, 02:49 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Yeah, that is why the All pick made me shake my head so badly at the time. Loved all these RB's and any one of them would of improved
our RB room big time. All could be a great TE if he can stay healthy though, reminds me of a much faster Gresham honestly. Hard to tackle.
Well the answer is not caked in yet, we can only assume till we see results lets see what happens over next few years, for example if Brown comes on this year,that weakens to have drafted a RB this past draft or if All performs better than those RBs do...I agree i was surprised we did not go RB but we also are thin at TE for the future so at least we addressed another position of weakness
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - BoomerFan - 06-16-2024
I am much more bullish on this position group. And I'd even be OK with us just keeping two RBs. I voted for 7-12 and based that on the sort of YPC that I am expecting to see this season. Of course that doesn't mean the pass blocking will be great (though I hope it improves) and we may see a drop off in pass-catching but in terms of actually running the ball I think Moss and Brown will put up some numbers when we do it.
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - Joelist - 06-16-2024
You can tell from the way they rebuilt the RB room that the coaches were aware of the major shortcomings in the room last season - poor pass blocking and way too easily brought down (showing in the low YAC). Moss is above average as a pass protector and well above average in difficulty to bring down (as shown by his YAC numbers). Brown will need to up his pass protect game but that speed can't be ignored. Trayveon Williams is okay. I do expect they think the "power" back is already in camp as they did sign two UDFA RBs and both are power backs (Elijah Collins and Noah Cain).
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - bfine32 - 06-16-2024
(06-16-2024, 01:46 PM)Joelist Wrote: You can tell from the way they rebuilt the RB room that the coaches were aware of the major shortcomings in the room last season - poor pass blocking and way too easily brought down (showing in the low YAC). Moss is above average as a pass protector and well above average in difficulty to bring down (as shown by his YAC numbers). Brown will need to up his pass protect game but that speed can't be ignored. Trayveon Williams is okay. I do expect they think the "power" back is already in camp as they did sign two UDFA RBs and both are power backs (Elijah Collins and Noah Cain).
Did they really "rebuild it?" We replaced 1 player. We signed one mid-tier veteran and drafted no one.
To me they showed they really don't care too much about it and changed focus to TE.
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - Joelist - 06-16-2024
(06-16-2024, 03:23 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Did they really "rebuild it?" We replaced 1 player. We signed one mid-tier veteran and drafted no one.
To me they showed they really don't care too much about it and changed focus to TE.
When you swap out the starter who had the huge majority of the carries for a back with a different style and different strengths you have reset the room. Moss strengths and style align much better with the offense as a whole and the types of blocking this line is good at.
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - TheLeonardLeap - 06-16-2024
This is probably the one poll where I have the easiest answer for me because I did the rough figuring of it a month ago. I think we have the 10th worst RB group in the league (I found it easier to count the teams we were better than in this instance). So that would put us at 23rd, or right in the middle of that 20-26 group.
We are, in my opinion, ahead of the Patriots, Texans, Raiders, Broncos, Cowboys, Giants, Buccaneers, Saints, and Panthers.
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - TecmoBengals - 06-17-2024
I voted for a lower tier, but I'm optimistic that the transition from Mixon to Moss can produce better results if Moss is indeed a better fit for the offensive scheme. Mix in Brown's speed and the duo could perform well. If one of those two gets hurt though things could get ugly.
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - Whatever - 06-17-2024
(06-14-2024, 11:35 PM)Bengalbug Wrote: You sure are giving a lot of benefit of the doubt to a lot of just guys. Kamara and Williams both were awful last year. Go look at advanced metrics, don’t be surprised if their 3rd back usurps both of them.
Dobbins has never been healthy… we talk about tees availability here… but dobbins is on another level. I’d wager a lot of money with you that dobbins will never have another 1k yard season. Gus Edward’s has been in the league a few years longer and he is ok, but you can’t tell me he is “easily” better.
We got rid of Mixon for moss. That tells me everything I need to know about how the bengals feel about that. Pierce averaged under 3 yards per carry last year and lost his job to Devin Singletary. Yea…
Since his injury, Javonte Williams plummeted in YPC to 3.7. Maybe he is bettter having more time from ACL, but not everyone is Adrian Peterson. Perine is just a guy, you know that.
Miles sanders looked great behind the eagles OL, so does everyone (see swift). He isn’t even slated to be their RB1
James Conner is up there in age and again, just a guy.
I’m not saying that our backfield is even average, but they are not “easily” a top 5 bad RB room. They can arguably be one, which is why we are having the conversation.
You lose me when you bring up the Eagles OL in regard to Sanders, but are kinda overlooking the fact that the Colts had a Top 10 OL last year and Moss was JAG behind it.
At the end of the day, the Bengals are hoping a guy that was cut from his rookie deal and has had one year of RBBC level production behind a top OL can repeat that career high production and a 2nd year 5th round pick can take a massive leap. Not to mention, pray neither of them get hurt because Williams and Evans are CFL level backs.
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - Essex Johnson - 06-17-2024
(06-16-2024, 01:46 PM)Joelist Wrote: You can tell from the way they rebuilt the RB room that the coaches were aware of the major shortcomings in the room last season - poor pass blocking and way too easily brought down (showing in the low YAC). Moss is above average as a pass protector and well above average in difficulty to bring down (as shown by his YAC numbers). Brown will need to up his pass protect game but that speed can't be ignored. Trayveon Williams is okay. I do expect they think the "power" back is already in camp as they did sign two UDFA RBs and both are power backs (Elijah Collins and Noah Cain).
It does look like Moss will be better pass blocking and YAC ( though a fantasy site i use had him at 2.6 yac average, and Mixon 2.4 last season, also but his pass catching and effectiveness is a major backseat to Mixon For those that attest to PFF, Mixon has a better PFF the past three seasons over Moss, the main worry i have is the sub par pass catching, seems he will be more limited to down and distance when he is on the field and with the lack of experience with Brown this really does look to be a RB group in the bottom tier coming into the season
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - Au165 - 06-17-2024
I picked the 13-19 group only because a person I really respect in the league is super high on Chase Brown breaking out this year. It's unfortunate he didn't get more run last year but I think we will see him have some really nice explosive plays this year.
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - Bengalbug - 06-17-2024
(06-17-2024, 10:20 AM)Whatever Wrote: You lose me when you bring up the Eagles OL in regard to Sanders, but are kinda overlooking the fact that the Colts had a Top 10 OL last year and Moss was JAG behind it.
At the end of the day, the Bengals are hoping a guy that was cut from his rookie deal and has had one year of RBBC level production behind a top OL can repeat that career high production and a 2nd year 5th round pick can take a massive leap. Not to mention, pray neither of them get hurt because Williams and Evans are CFL level backs.
Taylor averaged 4.4 YPC last year behind the colts on 169 carries. Moss averaged 4.3 YPC last year on 183 carries. Moss did just fine last year.
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - ochocincos - 06-17-2024
What RB stables do people think are actually WORSE than the Bengals?
Combining the 2023 stats of the current Bengals RBs:
Moss - 210 total touches for 794 rush yards, 192 rec yards, 7 TDs
Brown - 58 total touches for 179 rush yards, 156 rec yards, 1 TD
Williams - 22 total touches for 69 rush yards, 10 rec yards, 0 TDs
Evans - 3 total touches for -1 rush yard, 12 rec yards, 0 TDs
---------------------------------
293 touches for 1041 rush yards, 370 rec yards, 8 TDs
Bengals did not add a RB in the draft to add college production hype like teams like the Panthers and Cardinals did.
Moss likely is around a 1000 yard rusher if he was a bellcow.
Chase Brown had limited touches, but if you quadrupled his touches to be more in line with Moss, he'd be right around the same as Moss. Maybe even a bit higher with his added speed and contributions in the receiving game.
Moss is the Steady Eddie of the group, Brown offers optimism based on his rookie season, and the other two guys are purely backups.
I don't personally see this RB stable as being Top 20 collectively though...unless Chase Brown explodes.
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - Whatever - 06-17-2024
(06-17-2024, 12:12 PM)Bengalbug Wrote: Taylor averaged 4.4 YPC last year behind the colts on 169 carries. Moss averaged 4.3 YPC last year on 183 carries. Moss did just fine last year.
Moss averaged 4.3 YPC and "did just fine". Conner averaged 5.0 YPC on over 200 carries and "is just a guy". See the double standard, there?
Beyond that, our #3-4 have been in the league a combined 8 years and have combined for under 400 rushing yards. So, they are proven nothing-burgers with no realistic hopes of taking another step. So even if you want to argue that Moss and Brown are equivalent to other starting duos(which you gotta drink a ton of Kool -Aid to do), the atrocious depth behind them drops them below those other groups.
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - jason - 06-17-2024
(06-17-2024, 12:38 PM)ochocincos Wrote: What RB stables do people think are actually WORSE than the Bengals?
Combining the 2023 stats of the current Bengals RBs:
Moss - 210 total touches for 794 rush yards, 192 rec yards, 7 TDs
Brown - 58 total touches for 179 rush yards, 156 rec yards, 1 TD
Williams - 22 total touches for 69 rush yards, 10 rec yards, 0 TDs
Evans - 3 total touches for -1 rush yard, 12 rec yards, 0 TDs
---------------------------------
293 touches for 1041 rush yards, 370 rec yards, 8 TDs
Bengals did not add a RB in the draft to add college production hype like teams like the Panthers and Cardinals did.
Moss likely is around a 1000 yard rusher if he was a bellcow.
Chase Brown had limited touches, but if you quadrupled his touches to be more in line with Moss, he'd be right around the same as Moss. Maybe even a bit higher with his added speed and contributions in the receiving game.
Moss is the Steady Eddie of the group, Brown offers optimism based on his rookie season, and the other two guys are purely backups.
I don't personally see this RB stable as being Top 20 collectively though...unless Chase Brown explodes.
Agreed... I went 20 - 26 but that's more of a "hoping for the best" situation. I think Chase Brown being the truth is our best hope, and I'm far from certain that will happen.
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - jason - 06-17-2024
(06-17-2024, 12:42 PM)Whatever Wrote: Moss averaged 4.3 YPC and "did just fine". Conner averaged 5.0 YPC on over 200 carries and "is just a guy". See the double standard, there?
Beyond that, our #3-4 have been in the league a combined 8 years and have combined for under 400 rushing yards. So, they are proven nothing-burgers with no realistic hopes of taking another step. So even if you want to argue that Moss and Brown are equivalent to other starting duos(which you gotta drink a ton of Kool -Aid to do), the atrocious depth behind them drops them below those other groups.
To me Zack Moss is the definition of just a guy.
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - bfine32 - 06-17-2024
(06-17-2024, 12:38 PM)ochocincos Wrote: What RB stables do people think are actually WORSE than the Bengals?
Combining the 2023 stats of the current Bengals RBs:
Moss - 210 total touches for 794 rush yards, 192 rec yards, 7 TDs
Brown - 58 total touches for 179 rush yards, 156 rec yards, 1 TD
Williams - 22 total touches for 69 rush yards, 10 rec yards, 0 TDs
Evans - 3 total touches for -1 rush yard, 12 rec yards, 0 TDs
---------------------------------
293 touches for 1041 rush yards, 370 rec yards, 8 TDs
Bengals did not add a RB in the draft to add college production hype like teams like the Panthers and Cardinals did.
Moss likely is around a 1000 yard rusher if he was a bellcow.
Chase Brown had limited touches, but if you quadrupled his touches to be more in line with Moss, he'd be right around the same as Moss. Maybe even a bit higher with his added speed and contributions in the receiving game.
Moss is the Steady Eddie of the group, Brown offers optimism based on his rookie season, and the other two guys are purely backups.
I don't personally see this RB stable as being Top 20 collectively though...unless Chase Brown explodes.
Tampa
Dallas
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - Bengalbug - 06-17-2024
(06-17-2024, 12:42 PM)Whatever Wrote: Moss averaged 4.3 YPC and "did just fine". Conner averaged 5.0 YPC on over 200 carries and "is just a guy". See the double standard, there?
Beyond that, our #3-4 have been in the league a combined 8 years and have combined for under 400 rushing yards. So, they are proven nothing-burgers with no realistic hopes of taking another step. So even if you want to argue that Moss and Brown are equivalent to other starting duos(which you gotta drink a ton of Kool -Aid to do), the atrocious depth behind them drops them below those other groups.
That’s fair on the Connor thing, and I don’t think we have anything special. This whole thing started due to them being an “easily” bottom five group. I think there are about 1/3 of the teams that are in a similar spot. I out bengals at 20-26 (or whatever option that it was), but my thinking is the continued continuity/upgrade of the OL, a healthy burrow and hopefully the playcalling from the backend of last year carries over to this year. It has less to do with the players and more to do with everything around them. Guess we will see.
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - CJD - 06-17-2024
I think we're below average simply because of how unproven our room is. Chase Brown has intense potential, but he only got a small introduction last year as a rookie due to injuries and sitting behind a true bell cow back in Mixon.
And then Zack Moss has only had 1 half of a season as the undisputed starter. He looked fantastic in that half season, but it's a gamble to bet on such a small sample size. He has been a serviceable back up/committee back for his entire career, so even if he "busts" he'll still be useful. It's just that we don't have a true, proven, top of the line starter right now, so gotta go 20-26.
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - kevin - 06-17-2024
I think Houston is putting a good team together. I figured they would when Cleveland traded them 3 years of #1 draft picks. They have the star QB now. They have a good young star #1 WR. They add Mixon to grind out rushing yards. A good TE. Good D.
As for our Bengals. We have star QB and now a back-up QB that is better than back-ups we have had. We have Chase and it looks like Higgins got on board for one more season. I think TE will be better than last year, and Bengals D should be good. I have no problem with RB by committee. The RB brought in from Colts is one of the best pass catching RB's in NFL, and Bengals like to use RB as an extra WR a lot. I'm hoping Chase Brown is for real and ends up one of the best RB's in the NFL. Great break away long gain ability like OJ Simpson. That's right, OJ Simpson, who on the field could turn short gains into break away touchdowns. Chase Brown showed an ability to break away and make long gains. Bengals have some other RB's in the stable.
Too early to rate Bengals RB's. I'm hoping Chase Brown is a Superstar ready to burst on the scene. As for a RB that catches passes, the RB from Colts is a great pass catcher. They do need a running game. I hate games where Zac calls pass plays 90 % of the game, not only do Bengals lose, but it's a good way to get Burrow career injured. We need the run plays so defenses can't just load up on clobbering Burrow and covering the pass. I'm really hoping Chase Brown is as good as he looked on some plays last season. If so, he could be one of the best Bengals RB's ever. I do like his OJ or Paul Robinson ability to find the hole and get 30 yards up the field quick and fast with his break away speed. Or as Howard Cosell use to say, " He Could Go All The Way ".
GO BENGALS
RE: Rank our RBs (2024) - Joelist - 06-17-2024
We'll be better than some expect.
Moss is a different type of RB than Mixon with different strengths. He is not so much about speed and home runs as he is about breaking the first tackle / making the first defender miss, pass protection and balance - he stays on his feet. Goodberry upon careful tape study said he reminds somewhat of Rudi Johnson. I agree. Expect Moss to get plenty of carries.
Chase Brown is the "lightning" in the backfield. He needs to work on his pass protection and tackle breaks but he is a home run threat every time he gets the ball. Unlike Moss Brown likes the edge but he also is plenty fast enough to gain it.
Trayveon Williams is a known quantity. When healthy he is a reliable spot duty back. The one I think will be gone is Chris Evans. In my upset special I have the Bengals going with Noah Cain as RB4 because he is a bruising power back.
Expect the Bengals run game to look different not just in frequency but HOW they run too. This RB group suggest much more inside work and using power schemes which also play into what our lineman like to do - block downhill.