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+--- Thread: Core looking great! (/thread-11317.html)
RE: Core looking great! - Murdock2420 - 05-24-2017
I have been as critical as anyone of the O-line and I will be very happy to be proven wrong if these guys can develop into quality starting tackles. While Alexander's words don't really have much impact with me, the fact that Ced himself said he felt comfortable and Andre Smith who has shown he can play was speaking highly of Fisher gives hope for these two. If the O-line holds up, this team can be interesting.
RE: Core looking great! - Luvnit2 - 05-24-2017
(05-24-2017, 02:24 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Core is probably an August cut and practice squad candidate.
Green
Ross
LaFell
Boyd
Malone
Erickson
The only chance for Core to make it is (a) if the Bengals decide to roll with 7 receivers...which I see as unlikely, or (b) if Core beats out Erickson, but I also see this as unlikely considering Erickson just lead the NFL in kick return yards and was 2nd in yards per return. Add in the fact that Malone is essentially a a better version of Core, and I just see Core as the odd man out if we roll with 6 receivers.
No doubt we all of sudden are loaded at WR. Could we see Bengals trade before the final cut as I see no way Core or Erickson make it back to the practice quad
RE: Core looking great! - Luvnit2 - 05-24-2017
(05-24-2017, 04:52 PM)3wt Wrote: Yeah, I know we're in the underwear stage, but I'm way encouraged to hear anything good about Og, Fisher and Billings. And I'm thrilled to hear that Core is building on the positives he showed last year. Makes me very happy to hear that Pacman is a fan (which means that Core is a true competitor) and that everyone is noticing the obvious work he put in in the off season and his performance improvement.
The guy was a stud in camp and really flashed in some of the games.
If Og and Fisher step up we could have a formidable offense.
PLayers in years 2 and 3 can make huge strides. We have a lot of them that could be much better in 2017 so I am optimistic
RE: Core looking great! - bfine32 - 05-25-2017
Well let's not write Josh Malone's name down on the 53 in ink yet. He and Core are pretty much clones physically. It will come down to which ones can run routes and catch. Core may already have a heads tart on the route running.
RE: Core looking great! - Shake n Blake - 05-25-2017
(05-25-2017, 12:31 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Well let's not write Josh Malone's name down on the 53 in ink yet. He and Core are pretty much clones physically. It will come down to which ones can run routes and catch. Core may already have a heads tart on the route running.
He was a 4th round pick. No way he gets cut. That's rare in the NFL and I don't think the Bengals have ever cut a 4th rounder before or during their rookie season. If they tried to get him to the practice squad (something else they've never done with a 4th rounder), some lucky team would pounce all over that.
It's as close to written in stone as it can be, barring Malone punching Marvin Lewis or something along those lines.
RE: Core looking great! - Shake n Blake - 05-25-2017
There's no doubt a ton of similarities between Core and Malone. Same size, similar combine numbers, both body catchers with below average acceleration from what I've read. The difference I saw in scouting reports was that Malone has plus hands, while Core's hands were deemed average. Also, Malone is sharp out of his breaks, while it was said Core runs rounded, sloppy routes.
Also I have to wonder why the coaches would spend a quality pick on Malone if they were sold on Core.
RE: Core looking great! - TSwigZ - 05-25-2017
It's unprofessional how bad he is at writing idk how he hasn't improved over the years or how he still has a job for that matter. There is no structure to his articles, I swear there are kids in junior high out there that could do a better job.
Anyways this is good news but probably means Erickson is gone barring any injuries or setbacks which honestly isn't a big deal considering how loaded we are at the position assuming JoJo is good for one more year
RE: Core looking great! - SHRacerX - 05-25-2017
(05-24-2017, 02:24 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Core is probably an August cut and practice squad candidate.
Green
Ross
LaFell
Boyd
Malone
Erickson
The only chance for Core to make it is (a) if the Bengals decide to roll with 7 receivers...which I see as unlikely, or (b) if Core beats out Erickson, but I also see this as unlikely considering Erickson just lead the NFL in kick return yards and was 2nd in yards per return. Add in the fact that Malone is essentially a a better version of Core, and I just see Core as the odd man out if we roll with 6 receivers.
I will tell you right now Core will not be cut. The Bengal's only reservation on drafting Ross was that it would reduce opportunities for Core, as they like him that much. Very coachable. He was very raw, but he has learned quickly and has the right mindset.
The Bengals went from a lot of guys that might be solid #3 or 4 receivers that struggle to get separation and looked very limited without Green on the field to having serious speed, size, and athleticism.
I don't know who goes, but it won't be Core.
RE: Core looking great! - yellowxdiscipline - 05-25-2017
Its gonna be impossible to keep all these WRs.
RE: Core looking great! - HarleyDog - 05-25-2017
(05-25-2017, 06:42 AM)yellowxdiscipline Wrote: Its gonna be impossible to keep all these WRs.
So it seems. So much talent.
RE: Core looking great! - Luvnit2 - 05-25-2017
(05-25-2017, 01:57 AM)Shake n Blake Wrote: There's no doubt a ton of similarities between Core and Malone. Same size, similar combine numbers, both body catchers with below average acceleration from what I've read. The difference I saw in scouting reports was that Malone has plus hands, while Core's hands were deemed average. Also, Malone is sharp out of his breaks, while it was said Core runs rounded, sloppy routes.
Also I have to wonder why the coaches would spend a quality pick on Malone if they were sold on Core.
I guess you did not read the article in this thread. You don't get to 22.8 MPH (AJ Green is 22 MPH) with below average acceleration. Can you provide the article(s) that stated such a fact?
RE: Core looking great! - Luvnit2 - 05-25-2017
(05-25-2017, 05:56 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: I will tell you right now Core will not be cut. The Bengal's only reservation on drafting Ross was that it would reduce opportunities for Core, as they like him that much. Very coachable. He was very raw, but he has learned quickly and has the right mindset.
The Bengals went from a lot of guys that might be solid #3 or 4 receivers that struggle to get separation and looked very limited without Green on the field to having serious speed, size, and athleticism.
I don't know who goes, but it won't be Core.
I have to agree. It appears Core worked his rear end off in the off season, studied on eof the best route runners in the NFL (Green) and is ready to make huge strides from rookie to 2nd year player. I never quite understand why some like to pigeon hole players based on 1 or 2 seasons in the NFL. It is common for late round picks to prosper, but it takes years in some cases. Atkins was not great as a rookie, but he sure is now.
RE: Core looking great! - SHRacerX - 05-25-2017
(05-25-2017, 08:05 AM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I have to agree. It appears Core worked his rear end off in the off season, studied on eof the best route runners in the NFL (Green) and is ready to make huge strides from rookie to 2nd year player. I never quite understand why some like to pigeon hole players based on 1 or 2 seasons in the NFL. It is common for late round picks to prosper, but it takes years in some cases. Atkins was not great as a rookie, but he sure is now.
Yep, and Core likely wouldn't have been able to provide a glimpse of his abilities if not for AJ's injury last year. He would just be another unproven rookie that was a late draft pick. I like LaFell's character a great deal, but I would let him walk before I did someone like Core. That money could also be applied to the future contracts of Burfict and Eifert.
RE: Core looking great! - ochocincos - 05-25-2017
(05-25-2017, 08:01 AM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I guess you did not read the article in this thread. You don't get to 22.8 MPH (AJ Green is 22 MPH) with below average acceleration. Can you provide the article(s) that stated such a fact?
Not true. Just like any vehicle, you may have a good top speed, but based on your acceleration, it may take longer to get up to said speed.
Also, NFL.com scouting profile says below average acceleration here - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2016/profiles/cody-core?id=2555331
RE: Core looking great! - SunsetBengal - 05-25-2017
(05-25-2017, 10:28 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Not true. Just like any vehicle, you may have a good top speed, but based on your acceleration, it may take longer to get up to said speed...
Also, NFL.com scouting profile says below average acceleration here - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2016/profiles/cody-core?id=2555331
Quote:This offseason, more competition was added to the wide receiver position, but Core is upping his skillset and making sure it will be too hard for the Bengals to part ways with him come September. Meanwhile, his teammates are taking notice.
“He’s fast,” quarterback Andy Dalton told Bengals.com. “You can tell he’s put in a lot of work. He looks really good.”
RE: Core looking great! - ochocincos - 05-25-2017
(05-25-2017, 11:12 AM)SunsetBengal Wrote: ..
Ok...what you shared isn't new to me. I was simply responding to Luvnit saying you can't get to X speed without good acceleration, which was simply not true. Also, Luvnit asked for someone to provide an article(s) that provided such a fact that Core had below average acceleration, so I did.
Also, what you shared doesn't discredit what I posted at all. Being "fast" doesn't necessarily mean that a person has good acceleration. It can mean that person has good top speed, which is nothing surprising from what we knew of Core already. Perhaps Dalton should specify what he means by "fast". Is Core getting really good explosion off the line and getting early separation from his speed? Or is it more he's fast in terms of long speed? Simply saying "fast" doesn't provide enough detail for that.
RE: Core looking great! - McC - 05-25-2017
I'm rooting for him. Can never have too many good players. Second year for Core and Boyd. Maybe we see real good things out of both of them.
To me, if another punt returner is found, Erickson will be moving on. There are guys on the team who can return kickoffs.
On the bright side for Erickson, even if he doesn't make it here, he will play for somebody.
In a competition, if it's close, size and speed wins.
Like others have said, it's a great situation to have.
RE: Core looking great! - SunsetBengal - 05-25-2017
(05-25-2017, 11:18 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Ok...what you shared isn't new to me. I was simply responding to Luvnit saying you can't get to X speed without good acceleration, which was simply not true. Also, Luvnit asked for someone to provide an article(s) that provided such a fact that Core had below average acceleration, so I did.
Also, what you shared doesn't discredit what I posted at all. Being "fast" doesn't necessarily mean that a person has good acceleration. It can mean that person has good top speed, which is nothing surprising from what we knew of Core already. Perhaps Dalton should specify what he means by "fast". Is Core getting really good explosion off the line and getting early separation from his speed? Or is it more he's fast in terms of long speed? Simply saying "fast" doesn't provide enough detail for that.
I get what you're saying. However, we have been reading about how much work that Core has been putting in. If he got to 22.8 mph, during the course of a football play, I'm going to say that shows pretty good acceleration. A football play typically lasts what, 3-5 seconds?
RE: Core looking great! - ochocincos - 05-25-2017
(05-25-2017, 11:28 AM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I get what you're saying. However, we have been reading about how much work that Core has been putting in. If he got to 22.8 mph, during the course of a football play, I'm going to say that shows pretty good acceleration. A football play typically lasts what, 3-5 seconds?
You may very well be right that he's improved his acceleration. But without numerical proof of a breakdown of a route or even a chance to see him truly in action, it's hard to prove at this time. He was clocked at 22.8 mph, but the context of what route was being run, the distance covered, etc. was not revealed. It could have been a 70-yard catch and run for all we know. If we take Core's 40 time into account (4.47 seconds at combine, 4.37 at pro day), you're looking at between 7.64 and 7.8 seconds. If we took 70 yards divided by 7.64 seconds, you're talking about 9.16 yards per sec. In mph, that's 0.0397727 miles divided by 0.002122222 hours = 18.74 mph.
It's worth noting John Ross's fastest 40 time ever was 4.22 secs, which equates to 7.385 secs for 70 yards. That's 0.0397727 miles divided by 0.0020513889 hours = 19.39 mph.
So what I'm trying to get at is if we're taking the whole distance into account, it won't be 22.8 mph. It's a max speed of 22.8 mph at a particular point in time, and that speed is likely not going to be reached within the first 20 yards. Just watch this video of John Ross's 20-yard acceleration being measured. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkoMJHBuzOM
His max speed during this 20-yard sprint is 16.68 mph. I think we would all agree Ross is faster than Core, so the fact Ross can't get within 5 mph of 22.8 mph in a 20-yard sprint means I doubt Core was able to accomplish that feat within a few seconds. So what I'm saying is that if Core is hitting 22.8 mph, it's after a much longer distance than 20 yards.
We can't get a true sense of his burst off the line simply by measuring his top speed of 22.8 mph, as that clocked speed likely came toward the end of a big run
So my point still stands that having such a great max speed doesn't necessarily translate to having great initial acceleration and explosion off the line, it could come from building up that speed over a longer distance.
We need a 20-yard sprint acceleration test with Core like the above video of Ross to get a true comparison of how good his acceleration is. You can't go based off of his top speed.
RE: Core looking great! - Shake n Blake - 05-25-2017
(05-25-2017, 08:01 AM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I guess you did not read the article in this thread. You don't get to 22.8 MPH (AJ Green is 22 MPH) with below average acceleration. Can you provide the article(s) that stated such a fact?
(05-25-2017, 10:28 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Not true. Just like any vehicle, you may have a good top speed, but based on your acceleration, it may take longer to get up to said speed.
Also, NFL.com scouting profile says below average acceleration here - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2016/profiles/cody-core?id=2555331
Beat me to it. That's exactly where I found my info.
Look. I'm not trying to rain on the Core hype parade, but the guy was a 6th round pick. You don't find many flawless prospects in the 6th round. So I'm inclined to believe the scouting reports that say he's slow off the line and runs "rounded sloppy routes". Every year we seem to hype a bottom-of-the-roster WR. Binns, Alford, Wright, Cobi Hamilton, Whalen, Briscoe, etc.
Core is 23 years old and fully developed, physically. I doubt his acceleration could dramatically improve from one year to the next. I tend not to believe the fluff articles because they happen every year. The coaches were comparing Binns to Anquan Boldin one offseason for pete's sake. I believe actions speak louder than words, and if the Bengals thought highly of Core as a deep threat, they would not have invested 2 quality picks in speedsters.