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RE: Our Tackles have played better - McC - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 01:45 PM)Wyche Wrote: Yup.....if only there wasn't this "witch hunt" going on over #61. Mellow

I hope the barber nicked his ear.

RE: Our Tackles have played better - THE PISTONS - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 01:48 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: 1. Stop living or dying by PFF on OL stuff. 

2. No he isn't. 

3. Bodine has single handedly killed this run game for four years. He's the worst and deserves that label. No bad handful of games should change that. 

Bodine is terrible. We have 4 bad offensive lineman.

Hopkins is worse though. When your that bad...does it really matter though?

This might be the worst offensive line in the history of the Bengals.

RE: Our Tackles have played better - RoyleRedlegs - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 01:45 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Hmm, just so happens to be the same year Bodine was drafted...interesting... Hmm

(10-30-2017, 01:45 PM)Wyche Wrote: Yup.....if only there wasn't this "witch hunt" going on over #61. Mellow


It's not like this was predictable. 
I'm even old enough to remember that last year was HIS year and he'd turn it around in his third year

RE: Our Tackles have played better - Brownshoe - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 01:48 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: 1. Stop living or dying by PFF on OL stuff. 

2. No he isn't. 

3. Bodine has single handedly killed this run game for four years. He's the worst and deserves that label. No bad handful of games should change that. 

I think it's funny that you had to argue with people on how bad the OL will be during the pre-season. Didn't people try and act like our OL improved from last year because of PFF, and you basically laughed at it.... Seems like you have been right so far. PFF has been garbage for a while.

RE: Our Tackles have played better - Brownshoe - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 01:51 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Bodine is terrible. We have 4 bad offensive lineman.

Hopkins is worse though. When your that bad...does it really matter though?

This might be the worst offensive line in the history of the NFL.

FIFY

RE: Our Tackles have played better - Hoofhearted - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 01:52 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: It's not like this was predictable. 
I'm even old enough to remember that last year was HIS year and he'd turn it around in his third year

What's more inexcusable; Bodine or Marvin Lewis keeping their respective jobs?

RE: Our Tackles have played better - RoyleRedlegs - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 01:52 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: I think it's funny that you had to argue with people on how bad the OL will be during the pre-season. Didn't people try and act like our OL improved from last year because of PFF, and you basically laughed at it.... Seems like you have been right so far. PFF has been garbage for a while.

PFF is a useful tool but it can't be the tool in the tool box. 

On OL stuff they are purely results based (for the most part from what I gather now, they hide their method now). 
It doesn't really work like that for the OL. Sure it can for WR or RB given the nature of those positions. 

You see the grades go up for the OTs and the grades on the IOL dropping more. 
It isn't because one is magically playing better. 
They aren't getting beat because teams have been hardcore hitting our IOL with stunts and twists. Usually over the G/C and our center is late to pick it up. Teams know you can get them to call a slide on the OL and then loop over the center and he'll likely be late. So while it "looks" better for the tackles, it's really just the lack of time for an edge defender to win vs the time for a inside rush to win. Techniques are still bad. It's unsustainable success. 

This is why I don't think Hopkins is worse. Bodine has taken nearly every snap at center for 4 years. 
He should be able to communicate these to the young guards and tackles. But there's a disconnect going on. The tackle rotation is hurting the offense because it's delaying any potential growth for the young players. You either play both and just let it roll or you pick one to roll with and play Andre at the other. But rotating both is just dumb. Fisher has regressed in his technique which was already wildly inconsistent. 

Moving Fisher to FB/TE his rookie year was such a terrible move. I really think that put him on a delayed path. 
I'm all for cross training along the OL to a degree, but the early constant juggling and never giving a guy a chance to get settled in was dumb to do for both Ced and Fisher. 

RE: Our Tackles have played better - RoyleRedlegs - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 01:59 PM)Hoofhearted Wrote: What's more inexcusable; Bodine or Marvin Lewis keeping their respective jobs?

Marvin just by sheer duration. 
Bodine is one of the worst mismanagement situations under Lewis though 

RE: Our Tackles have played better - Luvnit2 - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 02:02 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: Marvin just by sheer duration. 
Bodine is one of the worst mismanagement situations under Lewis though 

I agree ML needs to go. My hope is a complete outsider like ML was and he brings in his staff.

RE: Our Tackles have played better - THE PISTONS - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 02:03 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I agree ML needs to go. My hope is a complete outsider like ML was and he brings in his staff.

It's really our only semblance of hope. We need people from outside that can come in a set up processes here that winning teams have.

RE: Our Tackles have played better - 3wt - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 12:38 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I care if the exterior linemen are playing better, it very well could mean we do not need to spend a high draft pick on another uncertain OT. I don't think you'll get anyone to argue that the interior needs to be addressed.

Agreed.   I think we could get away with Boling, but we definitely need RG and C replaced.

I don't usually pull for us to lose.   But I would like the interior addressed in two of the first three picks.   I'd dream of Quentin Nelson in the first and Billy Price in the 2nd.   Even with these tackles it would make a quantum difference.

RE: Our Tackles have played better - McC - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 02:05 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: It's really our own semblance of hope. We need people from outside that can come in a set up processes here that winning teams have.

This is probably the most maddening aspect to the whole mess.  It's not like the blueprint is a closely guarded secret.  The process is out there for anyone to see.   Pick a great organization and copy it.  Or, stubbornly refuse to change and never get there.

RE: Our Tackles have played better - TheLeonardLeap - 10-30-2017



 


There's three tackles 'improving".

RE: Our Tackles have played better - McC - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 02:37 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote:

 


There's three tackles 'improving".

Max protect and two rushers running free.

RE: Our Tackles have played better - Shake n Blake - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 01:28 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Here are there PFF Grades for the season:

Ced 42.8
Fisher 44.1
Andre Smith 48.1
Clint Boling 72.3 or Average
Trey Hopkins 39.4
Russell Bodine 44.8
TJ Johnson 44.3

Hopkins is actually our worst offensive lineman.

Bodine actually grades out better than Ced and Fisher by a small amount. They are all epically terrible.

Our best offensive lineman Boline grades out at the lower end of Average.

Well there you have it. 

(10-30-2017, 02:37 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote:

 


There's three tackles 'improving".

That 2nd one was the throw someone on here claimed was Dalton "heaving up a prayer". He was clearly hit as he threw and couldn't follow through. Announcer even said so. But yeah, these 3 clips sum up our tackles and sadly, this is just a small snippet. The pass blocking was this bad all day.

RE: Our Tackles have played better - THE PISTONS - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 02:28 PM)McC Wrote: This is probably the most maddening aspect to the whole mess.  It's not like the blueprint is a closely guarded secret.  The process is out there for anyone to see.   Pick a great organization and copy it.  Or, stubbornly refuse to change and never get there.

The Bengals organization is filled with people who have only worked here. How many coaches do we have that were here 10+ years?

RE: Our Tackles have played better - THE PISTONS - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 02:37 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote:

 


There's three tackles 'improving".

On that 3rd one, it was like Andre Smith was intentionally not trying to see that pass rusher. He wouldn't look at him!

RE: Our Tackles have played better - Shake n Blake - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 02:47 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: On that 3rd one, it was like Andre Smith was intentionally not trying to see that pass rusher. He wouldn't look at him!

Looks like he was supposed to help double team the DT there...but how could no one see the free rusher?  Confused

Maybe our players don't have the freedom to switch their assignment?

RE: Our Tackles have played better - Hoofhearted - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 02:23 PM)3wt Wrote: Agreed.   I think we could get away with Boling, but we definitely need RG and C replaced.

I don't usually pull for us to lose.   But I would like the interior addressed in two of the first three picks.   I'd dream of Quentin Nelson in the first and Billy Price in the 2nd.   Even with these tackles it would make a quantum difference.

So when the offensive line coach comes out and says Center is fine, what does that mean to you?

And why draft a guard or center that early to let them walk after their rookie deal? They do not value them that high, so why place that value in the draft process?

RE: Our Tackles have played better - Hoofhearted - 10-30-2017

(10-30-2017, 02:47 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: On that 3rd one, it was like Andre Smith was intentionally not trying to see that pass rusher. He wouldn't look at him!

Whiff goes the fish


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