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+--- Thread: Whit & Zeitler Vs Geno & Carlos (/thread-16811.html)
RE: Whit & Zeitler Vs Geno & Carlos - I_C_DeadPeople - 08-31-2018
" I wonder why they haven't created their own insurance company."
Because Insurance only works when you pay out less dollars than you take in via premiums. Right now the payouts could be huge.
RE: Whit & Zeitler Vs Geno & Carlos - Whatever - 08-31-2018
(08-31-2018, 02:21 AM)BengalChris Wrote: To start with the Bengals could have signed both of them for less than they got on the open market. When Zeitler was in his option year he could have been signed for around what DeCastro got, which was around 9M per year. The Bengals low balled Whit but he would have stayed for a decent contract.
The team then would not have signed Kirkpatrick for 12M per year. That's where I believe we'd have seen them save money.
We could still sign Geno and Dunlap. But I'm sure our draft priorities would have changed.
But, that's all speculation.
It's hard to say what Zeitler hypothetically would've taken. It's clear that they were never really close. DeCastro is a lot better than Zeitler. Frankly, Z isn't worth $9 mil a year. Maybe $7 mil, tops.
The issue with Whit was the Bengals wanted to go year to year due to his age and Whit wanted another multi year deal. The initial money was close. The Bengals big mistake with Whit was overestimating his loyalty to the team and not tagging him.
People assume a player will always sign on the cheap if you extend them a year early, but it's not always the case. Some guys want to test FA, regardless. A 1st round pick who just got his 5th year option picked up has made enough money to be set for life and can afford to gamble on themselves. Now, guys taken in the middle to late rounds who aren't making millions a year will often jump on that financial security, but that wasn't Z or Whit's position.
RE: Whit & Zeitler Vs Geno & Carlos - I_C_DeadPeople - 08-31-2018
Regardless of how the Whit/Zeit talks went, it is clear to us all that the team simply did NOT spend enough quality draft picks on OL. And by quality I mean number of picks and quality of the picks and where drafted. The Og pick was a known disaster early on and I am sure they knew they would likely lose Zeit so they simply took too long (still working on it) to enact plan B.
RE: Whit & Zeitler Vs Geno & Carlos - BengalChris - 08-31-2018
(08-31-2018, 12:38 PM)Whatever Wrote: It's hard to say what Zeitler hypothetically would've taken. It's clear that they were never really close. DeCastro is a lot better than Zeitler. Frankly, Z isn't worth $9 mil a year. Maybe $7 mil, tops.
The issue with Whit was the Bengals wanted to go year to year due to his age and Whit wanted another multi year deal. The initial money was close. The Bengals big mistake with Whit was overestimating his loyalty to the team and not tagging him.
People assume a player will always sign on the cheap if you extend them a year early, but it's not always the case. Some guys want to test FA, regardless. A 1st round pick who just got his 5th year option picked up has made enough money to be set for life and can afford to gamble on themselves. Now, guys taken in the middle to late rounds who aren't making millions a year will often jump on that financial security, but that wasn't Z or Whit's position.
Yes, but the year before DeCastro's contract set the mark for OGs. It would have been unreasonable for Zeitler to demand more than DeCastro in the same off season, and I am pretty sure he didn't. The Bengals didn't even bother offering a deal. Now the next year was entirely different and he got a record contract from the Browns.
Bengals just overestimated Ogbuehi and underestimated Whit.
RE: Whit & Zeitler Vs Geno & Carlos - BengalChris - 08-31-2018
(08-31-2018, 03:07 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Link?
Bengals weren't even close baby.
https://www.cincyjungle.com/2017/3/14/14916488/andrew-whitworth-leaving-bengals-competitive-offer
RE: Whit & Zeitler Vs Geno & Carlos - Whatever - 08-31-2018
(08-31-2018, 10:36 PM)BengalChris Wrote: Bengals weren't even close baby.
https://www.cincyjungle.com/2017/3/14/14916488/andrew-whitworth-leaving-bengals-competitive-offer
"Whitworth left to sign a three-year deal with the lowly Rams this offseason, which pays him over $11 million annually."
"the Bengals only offered Whitworth a one-year deal worthup to $10 million with incentives."
Not sure how that isn't close on a per year basis.
RE: Whit & Zeitler Vs Geno & Carlos - Whatever - 08-31-2018
(08-31-2018, 10:30 PM)BengalChris Wrote: Yes, but the year before DeCastro's contract set the mark for OGs. It would have been unreasonable for Zeitler to demand more than DeCastro in the same off season, and I am pretty sure he didn't. The Bengals didn't even bother offering a deal. Now the next year was entirely different and he got a record contract from the Browns.
Bengals just overestimated Ogbuehi and underestimated Whit.
There were obviously contract talks with Zeitler, and it was obvious the two sides were never really close. Otherwise, MB wouldn't have told him at the start of FA to come back if the money he wanted wasn't there on the open market.
RE: Whit & Zeitler Vs Geno & Carlos - BengalChris - 09-01-2018
(08-31-2018, 11:15 PM)Whatever Wrote: "Whitworth left to sign a three-year deal with the lowly Rams this offseason, which pays him over $11 million annually."
"the Bengals only offered Whitworth a one-year deal worthup to $10 million with incentives."
Not sure how that isn't close on a per year basis.
It's not the per year that Whit wanted. He wanted the multi year deal and the Bengals OL sure could have used him. He's still better than Glenn, not that Glenn is bad or anything like that, but Whit is just better and was last year and will be this year as well.
RE: Whit & Zeitler Vs Geno & Carlos - Whatever - 09-01-2018
(09-01-2018, 12:03 AM)BengalChris Wrote: It's not the per year that Whit wanted. He wanted the multi year deal and the Bengals OL sure could have used him. He's still better than Glenn, not that Glenn is bad or anything like that, but Whit is just better and was last year and will be this year as well.
While Whit was still good last year, his play declined. It's not a slam dunk to say he will better than Glenn this year.
Your original argument was that Whit was "low balled" and it would have only taken a "decent contract" to keep him here. He wasn't "low balled" and a one year, $10 mil deal is a great contract for a 35 year old offensive lineman. He was able to get more, and more power to him, but that's a false narrative.